Films and filters......

[huntrbll]

<p>Hello all, here's the scenario.........<br>

I'm retiring in five months, and the first photo trip I'm planning is a visit to Arches. I just purchased an RB67 Pro S, and have 65, 90 and 180mm lenses.<br>

Most of the photography I will be doing with this camera will be landscapes and portraits, and I am looking for suggestions for B&W and color films. It has been a while since I shot with film, and I would like to have a film/developent system in place before I take the first trip.<br>

I am also loooking at filters for this camera, probably the basic yellow, red, orange, polarizer and ND filters. Does anyone have experience with Cokin filters with this camera? They would seem to be an advantage if using ND filters because of the ability to adjust them up or down. Am I wrong in this? Are there any other filters one would recommend for landscape photography?<br>

Thanks in advance.........</p>

[adrian_wilson9]

<p>Hi Bill,<br>

Sounds interesting, I literaly have shedloads of filters from 49mm round to Cokin X-Pro. I now only carry three filters with me, 1. Cheap Polariser, 2. ND4 3. IR 850nm. Seems to be all I need. I have both Cokin X-Pro Lin and Circ polarisers but have no interest in using them because the tint ( Blue ) is too strong, the cheaper filters have little or no tint and work fabulous, although someone may insist on telling you different. The ND4 is used where I am faced with a contrast difference, and of course the IR for bright days with plenty of greenery.<br>

The punch line is I changed to digital and my output has rocketed and the quality of my work has advanced as well, not that there was a great deal to complain about from the start.<br>

Cheers,<br>

Adrian.<br>

N.B. The 850nm filter is soon to go when I convert a Nikon D70s to IR.</p>

[graham_martin2]

<p>Hi Bill</p>

<p>Congrats on the retirement. I will be doing the same the end of this year. I use the Cokin P system and Use the ND4, linear polariser, red, orange, and graduated ND. I recently bought an IR filter for use with Ilford SFX 200 film. I am wondering if this filter can be used with other film? Without hijacking your thread I would be interested in hearing any comments in that respect.</p>

[eric friedemann]

<p>For your lenses, the Cokin P system gradients would be fine. I've used Cokin P gradients with similar RZ lenses.</p>

<p>I just ordered a limited Cokin X-Pro kit with gradients. I bought the X-Pro kit to use with my 16-35mm Nikkor, so as to avoid vignetting when shooting ultrawide. You won't have a vignetting issue with your RB lenses and Cokin P filters, and the X-Pro filters and accessories are significantly more expensive.</p>

[adrian_wilson9]

<p>Hi Graham,<br>

What strenght is your IR filter.<br>

Cheers,<br>

Adrian.</p>

[dave_wilson1]

<p>Although I use Hassies, I've been using Ilford films, mostly HP4+, some Delta and HP5+ also. Soup everything in HC110 Kodak, dilution B usually. As filters go, I have too many, but the Cokin P line has served me very well, just avoid scratching them and getting fingerprints all over them, I have GND grey, amber and blue, which I also use sometimes for color, occasional polarizer Tiffen, and all the basic black and white Cokins, red, yellow, green, plus 81 series for color.</p>

[m_dawg]

<p>I'm shooting color right now--so I have no advice on red filters, etc.--but I use a cokin p system with my rz67 and I don't completely agree with what's been written here. First of all, the filter holder often vignettes at 65mm and wider. I've have to do lots of painting in photoshop to correct it and it doesn't always appear in the finder. You can still handhold cokin p filters without vignetting, if you have steady hands. At 90mm+ you should be fine.</p>

<p>A polarizer is always nice, I agree. The new Hoya ones ("HD multicoated") appear to be the best, with the multicoated B+W and Nikons a close second. All of those polarizers are more light-efficient and color-accurate than the competition. Cokin's polarizers, which I use, are effective but of poor quality and light-hungry. I'm going to trade up to a 77mm hoya soon.</p>

<p>For ND grads I used to use the hi-tech ones (not bad for the money) but they give off a horrible magenta tint with velvia 100, which is highly IR-sensitive and they don't block IR. I assume they're okay for other films, though. The singh-ray ones are very expensive, but nice...and they have an IR-blocking layer (at three stops or higher; the lighter grades don't have it) so you can use them with velvia 100 or even with IR film. I have a three-stop soft filter, going to buy a two-stop soft and three stop hard next probably.</p>

<p> Also, if you haven't used medium format before it seems to have more dr or at least way better tonality than the same film at 35mm...so I use less filtration with it and treat it more like digital in that respect.</p>

[sumo_kun]

<p>First for films. B+W I would use something fine grained like Fuji Acros 100. Its smooth and sharp. For more speed Tri-X is a good one. Start developing with a standard developer and keep everything simple. D76 is a good starter. It lets you check out your process and once you are comfortable with developing, then try different film and developer combos.<br>

For colour, it depends on what you want. For high saturation landscape work, Velvia is about the best choice. Either 50 or100 will do but not 100F. Kodak Ektar is a good choice but I find it blocks up the reds too easily. For lesser saturation, then try some portrait films like Fujis 160 series or 400H. Kodak have some too but I am not familiar with them.<br>

For filters, an essential landscape filter set will be a set of ND grads, a polariser and some colour corection filters (especially warm up and to a lesser extent cool down). I would really encourage you to get a Lee filter system. A bit expensive but its neutral unlike Cokin. Hi-Tech also reputedly make good filters but seeing that comment above, I am not so sure now... A starter set of GNDs would probably be a 2 stop hard and maybe a 1 stop hard. Lee do a set of filters with all the B+W colours you would ever need. They also do a warm up set. The polariser will need to be a big 105mm one and I think B+W are one of the only people making them. Get an extra wide one and you will get no problems with vignetting.</p>

[m_dawg]

<p>The hi-tech filters are decent (better build quality than Cokin) and neutral across the visible spectrum. Velvia 100 (and to a much lesser extent 50) is atypically IR-sensitive, and renders IR as magenta, so late day photography and particularly sunsets take on an unnatural hue with non-IR blocking grad filters. The singh-ray stuff, however ridiculously expensive for an uncoated piece of plastic, is built even better than the hi-tech--and their higher-density filters have an added IR-blocking component. The hi-tech filters are great for digital, but not for velvia 100. I don't know about lee filters but they're probably somewhere between the two. Or you could stick with 50 speed, which does not have the IR pollution issue (except maybe just the tiniest bit).</p>

<p>I've found 2-3 stop filters more useful than one stop filters but it's a matter of taste. Velvia has the best color saturation of any slide film but very low dr and it's a huge, huge pain getting good prints from it.</p>

[david_henderson]

<p>I don't get the "non IR " thing with Velvia. I've used Hitech ND grads for a decade with Velvia (50 and 100) and if I get a colour cast its for one of two other reasons</p>

<ul>

<li>Because there is a colour cast in the filter. Hitech ought to be immune to this but sadly they are not. Neither are Cokin and neither are Lee. All these brand are subject to variation in their "colour". If you intend to use grads for colour work you need to check any ND filters you buy on a white background to check that they are acceptably neutral and if not send them back. </li>

<li>Because Velvia itself seems very prone to exaggerate hints of colour in light with or without a ND fitted especially in weak light early or late in the day. If you're out at dawn, and there's a hint of blue or magenta in the pre-dawn light you get a colour cast. Whether you use a grad or not. Just as the same film and even more especially Velvia 100 exaggerates the reds in a post sunset sky regardless. When there is direct sun on a scene the chances of this type of colour cast a re very much reduced, and the stronger the sun the less are the chances. You can still get a cast from a non-neutral filter though. </li>

</ul>

<p>Bill. For your b&w with medium format I'd consider TriX- and indeed thats what I settled on after a lot of trial runs with other films some years back. Can't give you reasons- its entirely subjective. For the b&w I guess that a polariser (used carefully in red rock country unless you like black skies) a red filter and an orange would work to increase the contrast beween red rock and blue sky and make white clouds stand out better. </p>

<p>On grad brands, I found a long time ago that Cokin- by a distance the cheapest of the major "grad" brands- seemed more prone to have a clumsy transitions that I could see on some shots - and were a bit easier to scratch. Now none of them are hard to scratch and if I look at my set of Hitechs, now maybe three years old- they are a mass of tiny scratches. You either need to look after these things really well or view them as being a consumable in the long term. </p>

<p> </p>

[charles_sharp2]

<p>Bill<br>

You may want to look at getting a CC10M Magenta Filter for Arches and tha canyonlands for you color film work. It is a secret weapon of some photgraphers of the southwest. It add subtle color to the red sandstone without affecting the background.<br>

You may want to give it a try.</p>