Hasselblad slips on the Manfrotto 410

[neil_huxtable]

<p>I've just bought a Manfrotto 410 geared head for my Hasselblad 501CM. It seems that no matter how tightly I screw the quick release plate to the bottom of the camera, the camera still rotates on the plate which is really annoying when using it in the field. Anybody else experienced this and anybody got any solutions?<br>

The tripod head comes with 2 screws 1/4 inch and 3/8 inch. The Hasselblad has threads to accommodate either but unfortunately they are too close together to use them at the same time otherwise that would solve the problem.</p>

[q.g._de_bakker]

<p>I put a Hasselblad quick mount on the plate of the 410 (i'm not going to put that too large 410 plate underneath the Hasselblad, and the Hasselblad already has a shoe underneath), and it sits there very well: no movement, no play at all (except in the 410 head itself).</p>

[john_a5]

<p>I have the predecessor heads, 2 of them, which use the same plate. I have mounted my H and V system cameras, my dSLR and LF wood and Linhof Technikardan with no slippage at all. You have to use a screw driver to tighten the screws, you cannot do it sufficiently by hand, so maybe that is the issue!</p>

<p>(just one thought, my plates all have rubber on the top. With older release plates for their other heads, sometimes they were rubber and sometimes cork. The cork ones were real problems unless you wet them before putting the camera on--which created more of a bond and held the camera in place. Don't know if they make cork for this head, but thought I would throw it out.)</p>

[jpo3136b]

<p>Maybe a little square of 2mm neoprene foam between the plate and camera body could help you out if the surfaces involved are too smooth. Walmart sells such foam under the brand name "Foamies" for about 33¢ in the crafts section. It comes in a sheet about 8.5X11 inches. One piece will last you for a bunch of projects. Cut the square, punch a hole in it to clear the screw. You get the idea. </p>

[tim_ludwig2]

<p>I have replaced the pads on all my many tripod heads with soft leather and I will never look back. Gentle on the cameras and grips very well (no slipping or twisting) since the camera base actually pulls down into the material. Exacto knife, contact cement and about ten minutes per head or plate is all it takes.</p>

[Gary Naka]

<p>Neil<br>

Could be that the rubber or plastic on the top of the plate is to hard/slick, thus letting the camera slip. I had this happen to me on my Stroboframe, flash bracket. I went to Ace Hardware and got a small piece of plastic non-skid, which I put onto the bracket...the camera does not rotate on the bracket anymore.</p>

[neil_huxtable]

<p>Thanks for all the replies. In response to Q.G. de Bakker, how do you mount the hasselblad quick release onto the 410 head? I've looked for a quick release on ebay and seen this one. Is this the one you're referreing to:<br>

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Hasselblad-Quick-Coupling-S-Release-Plate-NR-126389_W0QQitemZ290424686183QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item439ea90667<br>

The plate is rubber not cork and in response to John A, I am tightening it with a screw driver. I tightened it so much last time that I had a real job getting it off but the camera still turns!<br>

If I can't figure out how a hasselblad quick release plate fits on a 410 head then I'll try some of the other suggestions of adding rubber or leather to the 410 plate.</p>

[q.g._de_bakker]

<p>Neil,</p>

<p>The same as you would a camera: using the screw supplied with the 410 plate.<br>

You need that shoe for the 501 CM, yes. I happen to use an older version on the 410, because most of my Hasselblad cameras don't have the 2nd generation foot underneath.</p>

<p>What you say - using a screwdriver, with considerable force being applied - is another reason why i rather do that to a Hasselblad quick shoe. I'd rather bend or break that thing than a camera.</p>

<p>The suggestions of putting rubber or leather between the plate and the camera is a good one. It's easy to do, and doesn't require spending much, if anything at all. So give that a try, i'd say.</p>

[neil_huxtable]

<p>Thanks Q.G. de Bakker, I'm going to bid on that Hasselblad quick release on ebay.</p>

[Ed_Ingold]

<p>The QR plate has no lip to keep the camera from turning on the screw. Secondly, the built-in QR shoe on the Hasselblad doesn't have much area to engage the rubber on the plate. If you overtighten the screw, you risk damaging the camera without improving the situation. There are a couple of solutions...</p>

<p>The suggestion to attach an Hasselblad QR clamp to the Manfrotto plate is a good solution. You can use two screws or otherwise keep the clamp from rotating on the Manfrotto plate.</p>

<p>Another would be to attach lips to the Manfrotto plate to engage the sides of the QR plate built into the camera. Then the screw would hold if only finger tight (or with a coin as a tool). You could replace the rubber piece with strips of plastic, attached with Gorilla Glue (or whatever). Manfrotto plates are inexpensive. You could get another one if you use this head with other cameras (which will also slip and turn).</p>

<p>My own choice would be to convert to Arca-Swiss type QR, with beveled plates and clamps, which fit the Hasselblad and can be adapted to the Manfrotto head in a manner suggested by Q. G. above.</p>

[neil_huxtable]

<p>Thanks for that full answer Edward, I like the idea of the strips of plastic on the plate. I think I'm going to try the Hasselblad quick release plate mounted on the 410 plate first, that way I won't need to keep the 410 plate attached to the camera.<br>

I use an Arca - Swiss plate with my DSLR which is fantastic. The only "problem" (which isn't a problem for the DSLR) is that it's a bit too "quick release" and I carry my Hasselblad around on the tripod (I know I shouldn't but that's what works for me). I need something very secure and the 410 plate is definitely that, partly why I chose it. I don't know the Hasselblad QR but it has a safety catch so I'm hoping that will be secure enough also.</p>

[Ed_Ingold]

<p>I feel more comfortable with screw-type RRS clamps than the lever variety, and have been know to carry my Hasselblad attached to the tripod.</p>

[hugh_j.]

<p>If you really want a solid connection, get a <a href="http://www.kirkphoto.com/SQRC-3271_Manfrotto_3271_Quick_Release_Clamp.html">Kirk SQRC-3271</a> specialty clamp which replaces your RC4 plate and stays permanently on your 410, and a <a href="http://www.markinsamerica.com/MA5/P60H.php">Markins P60H</a> plate for your Blad. Designed to work perfectly together due to Arca-Swiss standard; no arts and crafts necessary.</p>

[q.g._de_bakker]

<p>If you really want a solid connection, no need to change the already present shoe for anything.<br />Just get the Hasselblad counterpart (i.e. the Hasselblad quick mount), and you're done worrying about it. Forever.</p>

[hugh_j.]

<blockquote>

<p>If you really want a solid connection, no need to change the already present shoe for anything.<br />Just get the Hasselblad counterpart (i.e. the Hasselblad quick mount), and you're done worrying about it. Forever.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>I guess you don't quite understand how it works. Your solution still relies on pressure on one screw to prevent twisting; the only difference being that you're applying that pressure to the RC4 plate rather than the camera. It's like using a leafblower; you're just taking the problem and moving it somewhere else, but it's still there.</p>

<p>The P60H plate completely replaces the Blad shoe, and attaches with 6 screws. The SQRC-3271 then snaps into the 410's quick release where the RC4 normally goes. The single-screw RC4 plate (the real source of the problem) is no longer used at all.</p>

[q.g._de_bakker]

<p>No, Hugh. I do understand.<br>

But i also know that you don't need all that to get a solid connection.<br>

;-)</p>

<p> </p>

[hugh_j.]

<p>Well, who really "needs" anything in photography aside from a hole in a wall and a really dark room...</p>

<p>The bottom line is, the original issue was twisting/rotation of the camera on the tripod head, the source of which is the RC4 universal plate, a problem common to all universal plates of its design - flat, single screw, reliant on cork or rubber to prevent twist. While adding strips or using the Hasselblad Quick Coupling clamp may be a slight improvement, as long as the universal plate is still in the picture they are only band-aid solutions at best.</p>

<p>The entire Arca-Swiss compatible custom mounting industry is virtually built around solving this problem. The solution is already there; and on top of that, the OP stated he already uses the A-S system for his DSLR (I'm not sure what he means by <em>too "quick release"</em>) so why not standardize? There's no reason to reinvent the wheel.</p>

[q.g._de_bakker]

<p>There's no reason either to overengineer something when there already is a simple solution to a simple problem.<br>

Even though they would love to take my money so bad that i would almost feel sorry for them for not giving it to them, i don't need the custom mounting industry to keep my shoes from falling off my feet either. ;-)</p>

[hugh_j.]

<p>The Arca-Swiss system <strong>is</strong> the simple solution to a simple problem because it removes the universal plate that is the root of the issue. I'm not certain why this is such a hard concept for you but I'm beginning to think you're not for real and are just trolling me :-)</p>

<p>But I was wondering why your name sounded familiar and realized that you're the same guy who <a href="00IfVN">in this other thread</a> advocates leaving screws loose in a tripod assembly to "Let the tiny amounts of play absorb the energy."</p>

<p>Given statements like that, I think I'll take whatever you have to say on the subject of tripods with a very large nugget of salt. ;-)</p>

[neil_huxtable]

<p>I appreciate all the input from you guys. I'm going to try the Hasselblad quick release first and try and find a way of making it secure on the 410 plate as that seems the simplest solution at present but I have a feeling I'm going to end up eventually with Hugh J's solution as that is obviously the best if also the most expensive. My only reservation of that system is that I would be very nervous carrying my Hasselblad around on a tripod with only that screw knob standing between me and immense emotional (and monetary) distres</p>

[q.g._de_bakker]

<p>Hugh,</p>

<p>Your inability to accept simple concepts (the count stands at two now, which isn't a lot, so you still enjoy the benefit of doubt) appears to be matched by the too much time you appear to have on your hands.<br>

A not uncommon combination. ;-)</p>

<p>The Arca thing is, as Neil remarks, probably the most expensive solution. But despite you believing it is, spending money on unneccessary things is neither the only nor the best solution.<br />So kudos to Neil for trying one of the many perfectly good solutions first.</p>

<p>Now, shall i explain that "loose screw" thing to you, so you may learn not one, but two things today?</p>

[stefano_buricchi]

<p>Hello, I've the same problem with my Manfrotto 410 geared head for my Hasselblad 501CM.</p>

[theadore_horvath]

<p>Neil, if your Hasselblad base plate has two screw holes (as does my older 500cm) you can use both with two 1/4" screws provided you have a 3/8 to 1/4 reducing insert for the 3/8 hole, and provided you grind the edges of the screw heads a bit. If the screws are brass or carbon steel this is not hard to do; if they are stainless steel it is more difficult but not impossible. Put nuts onto the screws to protect the threads, chuck them into a drill press or hand-held drill, and hold a file against the rotating screw head(s).<br>

Ted</p>

[neil_huxtable]

<p>Nice one Ted, my Hasselblad does have 2 screw holes. I don't have the camera to hand to see how it would look with 2 x 3/8 but I totally understand what you mean. I think the screw heads may need a little filing down as they'd be very close but I'll need to check. That's an excellent solution, thanks.</p>

[chrisn]

<p>I wonder if the screw is too long, and is bottoming out in the hole? That would prevent the tripod plate being firmly tightened against the camera.</p>