Aperture Priority or Manual?

[nathancraver]

<p>I use both. Mostly, I use manual for more concentrated, focused shots. I use AV mode for more casual, "I don't know what I am going to shoot" method. Both get me great results. </p>

[matroskin]

<p>if you keep practicing it'll become second nature. </p>

[cjogo]

<p>"I have a follow-up question for all you pros. During a typical wedding, how often do you end up changing your settings on manual? Also, when you make minor adjustments, which setting do you typically set?"</p>

<p>In bright sun -- Average :: ISO 100 250 @ 9.5 --minor adjustments would be in the flash settings</p>

<p>In overcast day --- the camera exposure remains the same--the flash changes</p>

<p>Typically if you are indoors for a reception -- the light never changes ( unless the subjects are lit by windows ) Average :: ISO 400 hand meter the ambient ... and set what you are comfortable with holding >> 1/30 f4 with bounce flash into a large white card -- occasionally direct flash 125 / 5.6</p>

<p>The Church setting rarely ever changes --- about 1/8 @ f4 500 ISO</p>

<p> </p>

[Jack_Maegli]

<p>The weddings I have shot; I use manual, adjusting the ISO as low as possible to get good background lighting at a decent shutter speed (depending on action) at a focal depth to make the shot (portrait or dancing; short or long). A book could be written on the lighting variables encountered at the average wedding. Your best friend is a flash and extender, so you can adjust the facial fills to get a good result, especially in daylight where the backlight will drown your subjects. In flash-less situations overexpose if necessary to get good facial histograms. Sorry to sound vague; ISO 200 to 800, shutter 1/25 to 1/320, f/3.2 to 11 sort of covers my normal span. The only point I wanted to make is get good facial exposure.</p>

[cjogo]

<p>I have the early Canon bodies ( 20/40d ) -- so never past 640 ISO ----- just use the flash to control more of the exposure than pumping up the ISO. <br /> <strong>"How to shoot fast in manual mode"</strong> . I don't chimp ~~ just the check the histogram , if in a tricky light . I use the C1, C2, etc. on the dial ----- preset to the average shutter & f/stop & ISO > for 90% off all situations. The subject moves from shade to full sun ~~~ just have to change my flash setting .......I use only one zoom lens.</p>

[jonj]

<p>I decided to put my camera's aperture priority mode against metering and then shooting in Manual mode.<br>

Most of the images where buildings that had the daytime sky in the background.<br>

While in Aperture Priority I had the camera metering on the center rather than the entire frame. I found the camera still over/under exposed images in full sun light by 2 stops. </p>

[picturesque]

<p>Jonathan--what camera and what metering pattern? Are you talking about spot metering or averaging metering? In most matrix or even averaging metering patterns, the camera meter, in bright sun and shade, will overexpose the highlights. This is because it is doing what it is supposed to do--take all the values in the scene into account and compare them to middle gray. If matrix, not only does it do that, but factor in other things determined by the camera manufacturer. This is one reason I like the incident meter. Much less 'stuff' going on and by determining the placement of the meter head/dome, I know what is being metered.</p>

[randall_pukalo]

<p>I am not a wedding photographer, but to me the main advantage of using Manual mode is when you are using Flash. It allows you to set a smaller lens aperature, but also drag the shutter at say 1/15 or 1/8 to get more background fill. In A or P mode, the camera would just shoot the lens wide open, and set shutter speed to a faster setting, such as 1/60. Manual mode therefore allows more depth of field without the background going black.<br>

Are ther other advantages or reasons to use Manal Mode, other than because it is Old School Discipline?</p>

[picturesque]

<p>Randall, your use of the term depth of field is unconventional here. The term is usually not applied to background/foreground exposure in dragging the shutter--just so no one gets confused.</p>

<p>Also, I don't see that using manual camera mode is Old School. It merely allows you to control the exposure, rather than allowing the camera to control it through it's programs. Control is the reason to use manual mode. Consistency of exposure in a series is another good reason.</p>

<p>It could be argued that to some degree, one can also control exposure using an automated mode, such as aperture priority, through exposure compensation. You just have to be really good at guessing how the camera's meter will react to a scene. Manual exposure mode still gives the ultimate control, however.</p>

[jonj]

<p>Nadine,</p>

<p>I use the spot metering with my Nikon D80 when shooting in Aperture priority not the full pattern metering. When shooting manual I use the same spot metering but meter the light off of a similar object. Like in this photo of a highrise building. I Used the Nikon's spot meter aimed right at the building and the digital meter inside the viewfinder showed 1/800th at f11 was the proper exposure, but that was to bright . So I metered off of a similar wall not in the full sun light I bracketed my images and 1/1000 at f11 was the correct exposure.<br>

So I guess even though you have the metering on "spot" the camera is still going to be off because it just doesn't know what you are trying to accomplish.</p><div></div>

[William Michael]

<p><em>"to me the main advantage of using Manual mode is when you are using Flash. It allows you to set a smaller lens aperature, but also drag the shutter at say 1/15 or 1/8 to get more background fill. </em><strong><em>In A or P mode, the camera would just shoot the lens wide open, and set shutter speed to a faster setting, such as 1/60.</em></strong><em>"</em></p>

<p > </p>

<p >There are many advantages to using Manual Mode, and each of those advantages is often quite personal and <em >all about how the individual Photographer goes about their own work.</em></p>

<p > </p>

<p >I can use Manual Mode and another Photographer with equal intention and the same thought process can use Av Mode with compensation or override and we can both arrive at the same exposure parameters and for exactly the same reasons.</p>

<p > </p>

<p >What seems to be often missed in these discussions is the TYPE of in-camera metering being used.</p>

<p > </p>

<p >It seems to me that some Photographers do not understand what each metering pattern does, how it works and when and where each pattern is most effective. </p>

<p > </p>

<p >And IMO, this misunderstanding of the In Camera Metering Patterns combined with the inability to manually calculate exposures, is often the cause of missing the "correct" exposure - especially when there is a white Wedding Gown involved. </p>

<p > </p>

<p >***</p>

<p > </p>

<p >RE The portion quoted in bold: </p>

<p > </p>

<p >Av Priority will shoot at the aperture preset by the Photographer. </p>

<p > </p>

<p >P Mode will select the "best" aperture according to a programme which is generally biased to prevent Camera Shake. </p>

<p > </p>

<p >Neither will necessarily be shooting “wide open” and a matter of simple fact. </p>

<p > </p>

<p >*** </p>

<p > </p>

<p >To the OP:</p>

<p > </p>

<p >I used M (Manual Mode) about 90% of the time. I use Av a little and P more often than Av. I can’t remember using Tv (Shutter Priority) at a Wedding</p>

<p > </p>

<p >But with Av and P, I would still ride the exposure dial.</p>

<p > </p>

<p >I also used an Hand Held light meter and I shoot in batches as much as possible, which is usually quite easy to do at a Weddings – thus containing similar lighting conditions to each batch – which is also useful for PP. <br /><br /></p>

<p >Outdoors and with moving clouds or in and out of shaded areas, is the most difficult and the batch shooting idea goes right out the window.</p>

<p > </p>

<p >For in camera metering, I mainly use spot metering, or centre weighted average and I often get in close to use CWA as a very tight reflected reading. I usually manually calculate from the camera’s readings. I do not use Flash that often. If it looks like it is going belly up with time and I need the shot: “P” is my answer – it is very useful, and warrants consideration for some scenarios. </p>

<p > </p>

<p > </p>

<p >WW</p>

<p > </p>

 

[pete_s.]

<p>Jonathan, the spot meter shows exposure relative to middle gray. So in manual you want to take into account what you are metering to decide what the meter should show. Only when spot metering a subject that has the same tone as middle gray should the exposure meter read zero (the "needle" in the middle).</p>

<p>For instance pointing the meter on a white subject you want the meter to show +2 to +3 stops. In your shot above you could have pointed the spot meter at the darkest shadows and placed the exposure at -3 stops (compared to middle gray). That way you know that the shadows have enough exposure and the rest of the scene will then fall where it may. Actually there are many ways to spot meter depending on what in the scene is important to you so this is just one example.</p>

<p> </p>

[jonj]

<p>Pete,<br />During Weddings and portrait sessions I meter off of the face of the B&G or someone who is in the similar light. I would not meter off of a gray subject and then shoot the B&G. I often shoot someone sitting in the front pew and fire off a test shot. If all is well with that setting then I lock it in and shoot that portion of the wedding using those settings. Here is where it gets a little hectic during the Ceremony I'm often at 1/60th f2.8 iso 800 and the processional is under way as you follow the B&G out the door it's almost impossible to shoot manual from the Sanctuary, to the Lobby, and outside to the Limo, and then inside the limo! That's when I have to switch to Aperture Priority and that's why the second camera is ready for the Processional.</p>

[buffdr_rasouliyan]

<p>I shoot Manual 100% inside, outside with good light, I always use P Mode. If you know how your camera meters you can work with it to get good exposure. As said already, inside in low light condition, M mode allowes you to drag the shutter to get some ambient light along with flash. V/r Buffdr</p>

[pete_s.]

<p>Jonathan,</p>

<p>I know from your profile that you are an accomplished shooter but I was confused by your previous post on how you spotmetered the building. That's why I posted how it is the photographer that decides how bright or dark something appears when using the spot meter. Most people place caucasian at +1, so one stop brighter than middle gray. If you spot meter the bride's white dress +2 to +3 depending on the camera would be reasonable.</p>

<p>Regarding the exposure I know that fast changing light may be challenging. But if you know the light level it's not as difficult though, aside from actually spinning the wheels on the cameras fast enough (aperture ring is faster IMHO).</p>

<p>Maybe taking a look at previous wedding will give you some pointers? For instance 1/60th f2.8 iso 800 is EV6 so that's pretty normal indoors. Outside you'll might have EV15 on a sunny day and about 2 stops less if it's cloudy or backlit. So if you are at 1/60th f2.8 iso 800 and let's say you are using flash outside (1/250s) you need to hit something like 1/250s, f/11, iso100 if it's sunny. Obviously as you go into the limo it will get darker, probably 2-3 stops. I think if you know where you are heading exposure wise you will find that you can do it faster. Check your exif info.</p>

<p>Also try to spotmeter other things besides faces, like clouds, grass, asphalt, white churches, white dresses, your hand and what not.</p>

<p> </p>

[picturesque]

<p>Jonathan, forgive me if you already know this, but I'm making sure, because it sounds like you may not. When you use the spot meter, whatever value is 'under' the spot is compared to middle gray by the camera meter, and the 'suggested' exposure is based on the spot contents being middle gray. So, taking your building, depending upon where, exactly, on the building you metered, the suggested exposure would vary, because if you 'jumbled' the contents of the values under the spot, you would end up with a single value (like putting the values into a blender). The meter assumes it is middle gray. If it isn't middle gray in reality, the reading will be 'off'.</p>

<p>Now, I could have told you what the exposure would be for this shot because bright sun is very consistent. At ISO 100, it is f11, 1/250th, which at ISO 400 (what you shot), is f11, 1/1000th (2 stops different from ISO 100). I would not have metered this shot. That aside, I would say that indeed, the camera doesn't know what you have in mind. This is what I mean by knowing where and how to meter to get the information that (in your experience) tells you what settings to use to accomplish what <strong>you</strong> want. I always say, you take the information the meter gives you, and then apply your brain. You also have to understand how the meter works and how it is giving you that information. No meter is going to read your mind. There is also no exact 'correct' exposure. Within a certain range, correct exposure can vary.</p>

<p>I will attach an example which shows an image I shot, and describe a method taught to me by a former photography instructor. What you do is defocus your eyes, so that the values begin to swim together. You will end up with a single value. Now remember, that value is what is 'called' middle gray by the meter. So if that value is lighter than middle gray, you will get underexposure, and if that value is darker than middle gray, you will get overexposure. The contents of your spot in your example above, must have been slightly darker than middle gray.</p>

<p>So, if you are using aperture priority with the spot meter, what you are looking to do is to either quickly evaluate the values under the spot in the viewfinder for comparison to middle gray and adjust accordingly, or look for values that are close to middle gray, meter it, hold the exposure (the * button on a Canon), and then shoot. Now color confuses things. So on the right half of my example, you see a chart of colors that have been corresponded to stop differences from middle gray. The colors in the 0 column require no compensation. The colors in the +1 column (vertical) require one stop compensation, etc. You look around for objects that have similar colors. Obviously, this is not exact, but it will get you darned close, if you get good at it. Green grass in open shade, for instance, is very close to middle gray.</p>

<p>This is what I do when I rely on automated camera modes. I use the center weighted averaging metering pattern and judge the overall value of my scene (this happens very quickly), compensate the exposure and shoot. There are other things besides value that affect automated camera metering, such as backlighting, but I won't go into that here.</p>

<p>Re your spot metering off someone in a pew--if you spot metered on a clear area (I am assuming you are using a telephoto lens or you will not have enough skin to meter a clear are), you usually need to open up a stop--Caucasian skin is about 1 stop lighter than middle gray. If you are using the spot meter on a lot more area than a clear section of skin, you need to evaluate what is under the spot before accepting the suggested settings.</p>

<p>As for your example of running in front of the couple during the recessional, and out the door toward the limo--shooting manual can be done. I usually stop the couple just inside the exterior doors to give me a minute to make a change, though. Not only for exposure reasons but to perhaps adjust the flash head, and possibly to give a few simple directions. I find, if you don't give some direction (I know this may be frowned upon by PJ style photographers), the couple may not be in a good position relative to each other when they exit. Sometimes, they aren't even side by side.</p>

<p>Anyway, if, for instance, you are bouncing flash inside using ISO 800, f2.8, 1/60th as your example, and outside, it is bright sun. As you pass through the exterior door, change to ISO 100, f11, /250th (or wider, if you like your sunlight shots over by a little). You'd have to also put the flash head forward and perhaps comp the flash.</p>

<p>Personally, I do not think it is a sin to stop the couple for a few seconds to make the change, but that is my opinion. I would think if you had several custom settings, you could have one of them be bright sun settings, but you'd still have to comp the flash. This is where you might be manual inside, but switch to a custom setting or an automated mode when you pass through the doors, but bright sun is a hard one for automated camera metering--overcast or diffused shade would be much easier as far as getting you in the ballpark with an automated metering mode.</p><div></div>

[bob_bill]

<p>Manual? I thought M stood for Manly?? Old guy, in manual, spot, adjust as recompose. shoot. For me its faster than half click, adjust ev, shoot, chimp, darn, adjust ev, shoot, chimp. I like Nadines pre-scouting the areas of the room for exposure with an ambient meter. Great suggestion. In fast paced situation, if I can anticipate the location, spot there, set and wait for action to reach it. I also agree with her on the guessing- in non manual, camera guesses what the average is, then you guess at the compensation on what you see in difference between the scene and average. Hopefully, two guesses makes a right. Spot metering on a known tone, I can adjust accurately, for me less guessing, fewer re shot, and ready for next shot sooner. If I do chimp, I am not thinking about deciding on adjustment for a second shot, usually just confirming I got it. I prefer that mind set.</p>

[jonj]

<p>Nadine,</p>

<p>In the past I have used gray cards with similar results I found that the results were better when I used the " center weighted" mertering on a subject up-close. What I mean is when I do Bridal portraits I walk up to the bride and see what the camera thinks the proper exposure should be. I back off and recompose the shot and of-course the camera has now jumped up several stops from the original suggestion it gave when I was up close with the bride. I set the camera to the original set points based on the up-close metering and tend to get great results.<br>

With this photo I metered her face at 1/200 f3.2 iso 100 with an 85mm f1.8 up close I recomposed the shot and added fill flash.</p><div></div>

[wedding-photography-denver]

<p>I use both M and Av.</p>

<p>I like the way I work with both and would not consider it good or bad/right or wrong to use one or other, unless the results were bad from either.</p>

<p>Using Manual when the bride passes from shade to full sun would kill your exposure if you were not prepared. Being prepared is great, but it also takes planning and time to accurately assess what will be needed and when. It will also require you to remember to jump your exposure as the action happens. If you use AV in this situation, you can use the spot meter and it will (on my cameras at least) use the focus point selected to read the spot. If you simply follow the brides face, it usually means my results are better than a manual exposure where I did not jump (forgot) for the transition to sun (when not using fill). Of course, if you are simply exposing for the brights, and using flash to fill the shadows in that scenario, the M is the better bet.</p>

<p>The advantage of M is that you will control all parts of the image. The disadvantage is the speed at which you will have to keep up with any changing light (not to mention the need to simply remember to change settings).</p>

<p>If you have a static lighting situation, or are using flash to balance, you can set manual exposures and be done with it largely. But I don't care as much for the results I get employing that method. I prefer to ride the exposures to create darker looks, and brighter looks, more environmental scenes and more isolated scenes. Using light to help affect those desired looks, for my purposes, means getting more adept in the use of AV.</p>

<p>I do use two bodies most times, so that makes it easy to play too. One is always in M, the other in Av.</p>

<p>Horses for courses I guess.</p>

<p> </p>

[picturesque]

<p>Jonathan--again, forgive me, but it isn't obvious to me that you understand what the meter is doing. First, if you spot metered the bride's face and didn't open up by 1 stop or more, your settings would have been off (underexposure), even if you kept those settings upon comparing them to the suggested settings when you pulled back. Secondly, if you add fill flash but didn't pull it back, you would get overexposure (light is additive). Thirdly, it is impossible to tell much about the exposure at capture from an online image which has been processed. To me, the dress is blown out and the overall effect looks overexposed. Now, if that was your goal, that is fine, but the example does not help me understand your metering.</p>

[david_schilling___chicago_]

<p>Jonathan, I don't understand your point with the image above since you've completely blown the dress. My guess is that your central question is more about lighting than it is about camera shooting modes. For good outdoor location lighting, this DVD is a great resource with several hours of applied instruction: <a href="http://www.photovisionvideo.com/store/shop.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=P&Product_Code=LLT028&Category_Code">http://www.photovisionvideo.com/store/shop.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=P&Product_Code=LLT028&Category_Code</a>=</p>

[anner]

<p>I think the smartest approach is knowing what to use in any given situation and why its the best thing to use at that moment. A camera is like a toolbox, there are many different problems it can solve if you choose the right tool and know how to use it effectively. Here are some of the decisions that go into what I choose and when I choose it...<br>

Manual</p>

<ul>

<li>Always when shooting flash, because the camera's meter is easily fooled, regardless of what kind of metering you're using. </li>

<li>During a consistent lighting situation where there's little to no change in the brightness or quality of light, so that I'm in constant control of depth of field and motion blur.</li>

</ul>

<p>Aperture Priority</p>

<ul>

<li>When in a variable light situation where light quality changes from shot to shot, like the getting ready room where one moment may be near a bright window and in the same breath, a reaction may be across the room under tungsten light.</li>

<li>During sunset, when I simply want to focus on getting the best images during those last few moments of golden light without worrying about changing my exposure every 3 minutes due to the dimming light.</li>

<li>In high contrast situations where moments need to be nailed and isolated in both shade and sun without time to switch exposures.</li>

</ul>

<p>Shutter Priority</p>

<ul>

<li>When I don't have time to meter or think about depth of field, but want to grab a quick shot of something in motion using super slow or super fast shutter.</li>

</ul>

<p>Program</p>

<ul>

<li>When I'm feeling too sick, tired, or lazy in the moment and am willing to do a lot of post-production correction. (Usually the thought of all the post-production is enough to make me want to snap out of it and use the gray matter floating in my head.)</li>

</ul>

[anner]

<p>My thoughts on metering... you're best off sticking to patterned metering so that your spot metering doesn't slip and expose for something you weren't planning on having it expose for. With black tuxes and white dresses, it's far too easy to have something completely over or under exposed with just a slight tilt of the wrist. You're much better off having your camera meter the whole scene and then using your knowledge of light to adjust exposure compensation from there.</p>

[darshan_iyengar]

<p>P mode when you are horribly challenged and are willing to do a lot of photoshop but M mode always saves the day. I second Anne!!</p>

[darshan_iyengar]

<p>The biggest challenge is metering a shot in a wedding. The TTL is cool as long as you are willing to post-process the same constructively!!</p>