Wedding Critique of the Week 12/14/09

[picturesque]

<p>This week's image was taken by Mike Canada.</p>

<p>This is Part 2 of Wedding Photo of the Week. You can see all submissions in the thread with that title.<br />In your critiques - include what you would do to improve the shot or why the shot is perfect as it is. Remember that this is not a contest. Sometimes an image will be a winning image and sometimes an image that needs some help. Try not to just say "great shot" but explain why it works. Or - "Doesn't do it for me" without explaining why.</p>

<p>The photographer up for critique for this week should remember that the comments expressed each week are simply "opinions" and the effort and focus of these threads are to learn and to take images to another level. There will be times where the critique is simply members pointing out why the shot works which is also a way for others to learn about what aspects contribute to a good wedding photo. In reading all critiques -- you may agree or disagree with some points of view - but remember that there are varying approaches and often no right or wrong answer.</p>

<p><strong>Mike's Comments:</strong> "This image was taken over a year ago and at the time I liked the duo tone. I since have grown tired of this look and think that it's been over done. But I have clients that still like this look and are asking for it. I would rather not even do it, but I do to keep happy clients. Just wondering if I'm alone on this or are other people sick of this look too.</p>

<p>This image was taken over a year ago and at the time I liked the duo tone. I since have grown tired of this look and think that it's been over done. But I have clients that still like this look and are asking for it. I would rather not even do it, but I do to keep happy clients. Just wondering if I'm alone on this or are other people sick of this look too."</p><div></div>

[theresa_skutt]

<p>I think spot color is nice here and there, but not several times in the same album. That's not what bothers me...it's the nose ring =) All I'd do is burn the edges a little.</p>

[kel_madics]

<p>probably push the contrast and darken the shadows. would have been nice if it was shot in profile view and silhouted to accentuate the nose ring but i understand this is more of a journalistic capture the moment style.</p>

[philipward]

<p>The BW conversion is too flat for me.The spot colour I agree is a little dated by now, but its all about keeping the customer happy.</p>

[rayt]

<p>Nice catchlights in the eyes, and unfortunately the nasal and lip jewelry. I feel the B&W conversion is flat, not nearly enough contrast. The face just sort of blends into the veil and then the background. Focus on the eyes seems good given the limited resolution and web limitations.</p>

<p>I don't think the spot color is so bad if used sparingly. You, after all, have to deliver what the client wants. If your client liked the image then you did well.</p>

[daverhaas]

<p>I don't know that I'd have done spot color on this one - unless the client asked for it. The nose and lip rings just look like they hurt in general - but that's me and my squimishness.</p>

<p>Perhaps if the crop included her wedding ring I'd like it a bit more.</p>

<p>The B/W does appear to be flat / lacking clear contrast / blacks and whites... but then again - there really isn't anything pure black / white in the photo.<br /><br />Dave</p>

[dawn_tyler]

<p>I have to say I really like this image, the moment and the framing is nice. The capture is smooth and sharp - and I myself don't dislike the spot coloring on this image. I am a little fed up with it in general but many clients do love the look so we must do what the client wants.</p>

<p>I have posted the image with the adjustments I would make to it if it were my own. I bumped up the levels on the red side, to enhance the contrast and the color of the champagne. I used a slight filter on the eyes and catchlights to brighten them up after darkening the contrast - and a very very light touch with liquify to give a more sleek jaw line and nose bridge (but ever so slightly). </p>

<p>I don't mind the nose and lip jewelry in the slightest - how can one really critique a wedding picture taken of the bride as she wished to look on her wedding day? I had a bride that wore a lip piercing as well and for my portfolio I did indeed clone it out, but I didn't adjust anything on the actual images I gave to her - it's how she wanted to look! Also, the fact that there are several of the piercings on her face in key lighting areas it would possibly prove more effort than it's worth to clone them out - though it can simply be done if you wish to spend the time doing it. I however, would not.</p>

<p>Overall I think you did well, and the image would benefit from contrasting and that's all it needs. If you are over the whole two-toned phase then simply make it B&W, it will be just as lovely.</p>

<p> </p><div></div>

[neilambrose]

<p>My views are similar to many others:</p>

<p>Good stuff - Pretty subject and quirky image. I like the half-smile and twinkle in her eyes, and I'm sure it worked for the client. It's a definite keeper, as this is exactly the kind of image that helps reconnect with moment.</p>

<p>Bad stuff - shame it's not b+w; dark gray and light grey doesn't count. And it's not a great piece of framing - the loss of ear and hand don't work for me, and the head seems uncomfortably positioned in the frame. And, to answer your question, Mike - yes, I also hate selective colour. That dog has had its day, and it was a long time ago. I wish people would let it die gracefully :-)</p>

<blockquote>

<p>I have clients that still like this look and are asking for it. I would rather not even do it, but I do to keep happy clients. (Mike)</p>

<p>...many clients do love the look so we must do what the client wants. (Dawn)</p>

<p>The spot colour I agree is a little dated by now, but its all about keeping the customer happy. (Philip)</p>

<p>You, after all, have to deliver what the client wants. (Raymond)</p>

</blockquote>

<p>I'm fascinated that so many people seem to feel this way. Are we really in the business of just giving the client what they want? Because I don't think I'd ever produce a spot-coloured image, no matter how much a client asks for it.</p>

<p>Don't get me wrong - I care about client service as much as anyone else. But I think giving the client work that you don't believe in just diminishes the photographer to a specialised button presser. Doesn't commissioning a photographer mean buying their vision? Or are we in a place where wedding photography has become bereft of personal belief - an empty commodity to be done any old way, where we just bang out images the client asks for with no care or comment and no emotional connection to the final product?</p>

<p>I'm currently looking for a wedding photographer and am spending more and more time viewing portfolios. The only photographers that interest me are ones with a clear visual statement, where their style is consistent from wedding to wedding, and where they've clearly brought their personality and personal vision to the job. I hope none of them would ever say they'd give me whatever I wanted. I hope they'll say they have a 'look', and that's what they provide, and I can buy it if I want it, or go elsewhere if I don't.</p>

<p>The best way to give a client what they want is to give them what you love, and be consistent in doing it.</p>

[dawn_tyler]

<p>Hi Neil,<br /> <br /> I think where some of us are coming from is - even thoughI haven't had selective colour in a portfolio of mine, a client has seen it on other photographers sites and asked if I would be able to do something like that for them aswell, whilst still taking pictures in my creative style.</p>

<p>I definitely have my own style of photography (framing, angles, saturation/coloring, candids vs. formals etc etc the list goes on) but I wouldn't really shun a customer for asking for this to be done in a few photos. I have a vision, as do most photographers - but I think it's definitely about pleasing the bride and groom too - and I wouldn't really scoff at them for requesting spot coloring because it doesn't fall in line with my artistic aspirations.</p>

<p>It's a fine balance (for me) between my own art, and the client's day. I would much rather the client book with me, my overall vision and style, and I would meet them half way with an image that is spot colored in a tasteful manner. I think it still has it's place in the odd photograph here and there just not every single image like some photographers.</p>

<p>I think it's neither one extreme or the other - I think a photographer must have their own look, feel, and style. However, in my opinion it's definitively not simply about the person behind the lens and what they want to achieve. Well, not for me. I got into this business because I wanted to express myself artistically but also make a visual capture of their memories in a fashion my client would treasure. So that means sometimes listening to them or going out of your way to do something you possibly wouldn't do normally if you had the last say on the work for your own pleasure, only.<br>

<br /> I doubt any of the photographers that said that (well, at least most) are mindless point and click zombies that heed the call of the credit card and consumer demand, only. I guess the vast majority of us got into this business to be creative - sometimes it's just that we have to compromise some of it to please the client and I am happy to do that. Ultimately, what is being a wedding photographer if not making the client happy? If I wanted to shoot only for my own art then I wouldn't bother with weddings, and set up my own artwork shots and be in complete control of the lighting and situations.<br>

<br /> I love lomo, adore it to the ground. I also have a soft spot for macro. I doubt giving the client only lomo and macro images - despite the fact I love them and I am consistently good at taking them, would make them very happy at all. So whilst I agree wholeheartedly with the sentiment of doing photography in your own style, and letting the clients come to you because you fit each other - I am also in favor of adjusting my own personal wants slightly to make my client happy.</p>

<p>But I still think you're fantastic Neil. :)</p>

 

[picturesque]

<p>I find it fascinating that whether one would 'do' selective color for a client or not is such a contested topic. Do it because you would do it for your clients or don't do it because you want to stick to your artistic vision. Neither is wrong. Doing selective color for your clients doesn't mean you've sold your soul for money, and not doing selective color for your clients doesn't mean your artistic integrity is purer than any other photographer's.</p>

[mikecanada]

<p>Thanks everyone. I didn't realize how flat that image was and I do wish I would have included the wedding ring in the frame.</p>

<p>On the piercings, I would never have gotten rid of them, even for my own portfolio. I just don't see the point. Why would a client be turned off by a nose ring in one of my photos. That person's not going to be at there wedding.</p>

<p>Neil, I do agree that as photographers and artist we need to stay true to our vision. I choose photography as a career so I could express myself. Putting out work that I don't like myself would not be expressing myself. But I also agree with Dawn that there does have to be a balance between what the B & G wants and staying true to my vision. I'm still on the fence whether or not I'm going to continue to do them.</p>

[fotografz]

<p>Whether one uses selective color is up to them IMO. I personally won't do it, but that means absolutely nothing to anyone else. The movie Shindler's List used it for a reason ... : -)</p>

<p>The question I would ask is whether this is a good candidate for the technique? I've seen interesting uses of color isolation ... like a moody warm toned B&W shot of dried flowers with two "alive" red roses nestled together ... and stuff like that. </p>

<p>IMO, this one isn't a particularly good one for the technique ... but might be better as a pure B&W or a warm toned B&W to take the edge off the slightly harsh lighting.</p>

<p> </p><div></div>

[ed_farmer]

<p>I just don't see anything in this image. As others have said and shown, the B&W conversion is weak. The conversion leaves the image very flat, there is little local contrast. This leaves the eyes and hair looking very dull and her skin grey and flat.<br>

The piercings don't bother me, but it looks like the glass is touching the tip of her nose and distorting it. The selective color is just a distraction. I don't have any problem with selective color, but I feel that should ADD to the image. Her it draws the viewer away from the main subject which should be her face and expression.<br>

As album filler, with out the selective color and with a better B&W conversion, this is a fine image. But, I don't see it as a "showcase" image in any case.</p>

[stephaniaw]

<p>I definitely think that the BW conversion lacks contrast and that "pop". Here is my BW version after add levels and curves adjustment layers. I think it looks a bit better. As far as doing selective color for clients, I have had a few clients lately say that they like that look. I have told them that I typically do not do that, but that I would be more than happy to do it on the image or images of their choice(up to a certain number of images) for their DVD of images or for a certain print that they might like. Happy clients, yet still maintaining my style.</p>

<div></div>

[neilambrose]

<p>Dawn, Nadine, Marc - thanks all for your comments.</p>

<p>I may have obscured the question I was asking by mentioning the colouring - it seems we're now discussing spot colour, rather than vision and intent. However, I'll try and make my point more clearly.</p>

<p>I have no issue with any photographer who likes spot colour and wants to use in their images. It's a creative choice, and it's the absolute right of any photographer to present their images in any way they see fit. You won't get any arguments from me. (Sure, I have a personal view on spot colour, but it's entirely that - just a personal opinion. I have no desire to force it on others).</p>

<p>I was really asking a question that was provoked by Mike's comment that he doesn't like spot colour, and would rather not do it, but does it under duress because clients ask for it. And this is at the heart of my question: to what extent should the photographer resist client demands if they conflict with their personal vision?</p>

<p>My own view - which is at the heart of everything I've ever learned about art, design and photography - is that no work is of any value unless it's supported by concept and belief at the point it was created. The moment any creative work (good, bad or indifferent) is produced without buy-in from the person making it then it's no longer authentic. For which reason, I am surprised that there was wide support from earlier posts that we're in the business of giving the client whatever they want, regardless of our own views.</p>

<p>I certainly believe that's not the business I'm in. For better or worse, I try to develop and maintain a style based on elements that are important to me. I then try to find clients that have an appetite for that type of work. I've never felt that my involvement in the process was a negotiable element, or that the client was the creative force.</p>

<p>The client certainly has a role in setting the brief. But, in my opinion, not in the method of execution. Hence I take all comments on board from the client in terms of subject, but none in terms of creative.</p>

<p>Dawn - thanks also for your very kind remark. Really nice of you to say that, although certainly undeserved.</p>

[mikecanada]

<p>My main reason for not wanting to do split tones is because I get most of my clients through referrals. I figure the more split tones I do, the more that are out there (with my name attached) and the more I will get asked to do them. So if I just don't do them at all then I'm less likely to get asked.</p>

<p>Nadine- I was more concerned with whether or not this would make clients unhappy. I'm not tring to act like my "artistic integrity is purer than any other photographer's".</p>

<p>Neil- Have you ever told a client flat out that you wouldn't do a split tone? If yes, what was their reaction?</p>

[picturesque]

<p>I apologize to both you and Neil, Mike, if I sounded harsh in my previous comment. Actually, my personal opinion on the matter of selective color is neutral. I am just interested in why the topic seems to be polarizing. Anyone that refuses to do selective color for their clients based on sticking to artistic vision is perfectly justified, IMO. I have just heard too many arguments for the latter based on the 'integrity' argument and implying that photographers who did selective color to please their clients are money grubbing. What Neil is talking about goes beyond the selective color issue, though.</p>

[neilambrose]

<blockquote>

<p>Neil- Have you ever told a client flat out that you wouldn't do a split tone? If yes, what was their reaction?</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Mike, there's lots of things I don't do - selective colour is just one of them - and I often need to set client expectations. But I don't refuse flat out, as that's just unhelpful.</p>

<p>What I try to do is educate the client about alternatives and explain the limitations of their choice. In the case of selective colour images, I'd point out that it's become rather cliched and would immediately date their photography, and it's something they'd probably regret in a few years. I'd show them alternative b+w treatments and explain what can be done differently. The usual reaction is along the lines of 'great, I didn't know we could do all this stuff. I only asked for it like that because I'd seen it somewhere.'</p>

<p>Clients struggle with limited knowledge of the options. I believe that if the photographer has a wider range of ideas and creative tools then it's their job to offer the client a richer set of choices. If someone's paying for the photographer's expertise then they should not be shy about providing it.</p>