Singapore F1 night race

[ruth_grant]

<p>Hi all,<br>

I have a Nikon D50 and am going to the Singapore F1 night race in 2 weeks time. I have a Nikkor 85mm f1.8 that I'm going to use to try and get some photos of the cars (went to the F1 last year, there's a large area where you can walk around the track and get right near the fence - very cool and very loud!).<br>

My question is - I also want a wide angle lens to take some pictures of the scene and general atmosphere too. The F1 lights are incredibly bright, and they give a very unusual and different view of the city. I have been wanting a wide angle for a while, will also us it for some landscapes in South Africa and general city photos.<br>

Any suggestions for a lens that will be good at night? I currently only have a 20-80mm kit lens, which didn't really produce great photos at last year's GP.<br>

Also, any ideas on how to get some good photos of the cars from right near the fence? Last year I took a P&S (wasn't sure what they would let into the F1 area) so all I got were blurs of colour as the cars went by...<br>

Thanks in advance!</p>

[User_3607948]

<p>Ruth<br>

Photo near the fence ... just get to the same location above the cars like the brief segments as shown on today's coverage at Monza!</p>

<p>Enjoy the race!</p>

<p>Joe</p>

[Two23]

<p>How well lit is this track? I've not photo'd any race cars, but but I do photo moving trains at night. They go about 45 mph, which is considerably slower than what race cars typically do. To freeze motion on race cars I think you'd need something like 1/1000 second shutter speed. I'll make some guesses here. I was shooting night time soft ball games played under field lights all last summer. I used Nikon D300 at ISO 1600, Sigma 30mm f1.4 lens, and I think I was getting shutter speeds of 1/60. It wasn't fast enough to freeze moving trains, and even people in motion were blurring. I highly doubt you're going to do much better than that for your situation. The only way you're going to get crisp shots of speeding cars at night is to use a honking big flash, and by "honking big" I'm thinking of a monolight that kicks out 500ws of power. WIth ISO 800 and f1.4 lens I'm pretty sure that would do it. However, the cost of the monolight, battery/inverter/light stand will likely be more than you will spend. I also question if they'd allow something like that. If they do and you want to try it, get back to me and I'll tell you the cheapest route. What you might try instead is one of two things. First, how about some artistic blur shots? Second, you could try panning a car with your 85mm f1.8 @ Iso 800. You lock focus on a car, push the button, and follow the car with the camera. Takes practice, but this is going to be your best bet. As for a wider lens, how wide, how fast, how much do you want to spend? If f2.8 will do OK for you, the best value is the Tamron 17-50mm f2.8. That will work very well for landscapes and general city photos, even at night. If you are strictly an ambient light at night guy, the widest lens that's really good that I've tried is the Sigma 30mm f1.4. Still not at all wide on a D50 though. The Tamron is probably what you need. Below shot: I used a B1600 monolight to get the shutter speed I needed, f1.8 & 1/160 sec., Sigma 30mm f1.4 lens.<br />Kent in SD<br /><img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2654/3915892693_f6cf673d9f.jpg" alt="" width="500" height="362" /></p>

[Two23]

<p>Another thought. Buy an older Nikon SB-28 (or similar SB-24/25/26 model) flash, and also buy something like a Better Beamer flash extender (concentrates the flash at further distance) and attach to flash. Use camera on manual mode, ISO 800, f1.8, and 1/500. Your D50 is one of the very few cameras that can sync at 1/500. Set flash on M manual mode, to full power (1/1), and see what kind of exposure you are getting. If too bright, dial down f-stop a bit (e.g f2.8). If too dark, try upping ISO. Or, dial shutter speed down to 1/250. The flash duration alone might be enough to freeze the car's motion, despite the presence of some ambient light. I think this would work too if cars are within 80 ft. If you are taking photos of the cars from the side or from behind them, they'll never see the flash and it won't bother them.</p>

<p>Kent in SD</p>

[ramon_v__california_]

<p>the tokina 12-24mm will do the job, both for wide general atmosphere shots and by the fence. you can switch with the 85mm depending on what you desire. the 12-24 will be good around the pits also........the bright lights are always to your favor in car races.</p>

[munim]

For night racing, I believe you have 2 options (1) panning with a f2.8 lens or (2) use a flash extender. Have you checked the

fastest car you can shoot at 1/500? And have you considered 180mm f/2.8?

 

BTW even though I live in Malaysia, Singapore is nearer to me than the washed-out KL race, which I'm glad I didn't go to!

Take some waterproofing with you just in case in rains.

[johnw63]

<p>Other than the exposure you end up with, shooting a race at night is not much different than in the day. However, the lighting and night sky around that track is REALLY cool, so shots from up higher, where you can put the track in a shot with the buildings would be a good goal. As far as lenses go, something in the 35mm effective focal length and something in the 80-200mm zoom length would be the two most used lenses, I would guess. ( That would be 24mm and 50-150mm range for your DX camera. ) </p>

<p>Learning to prefocus, pan, and press the shutter would be a great thing to do, before the race. </p>

<p> </p>

[bsd230]

<p>Shutter speed is the key to great moving photography. At night you will probably need a fast lens in order to get the shutter speed you need. I would maybe look at adding a 35mm 1.8. It is a sharp lens and will give you a normal lens perspective. Getting the shutter speed just right is the difference between having blurry photos and photos that make the cars look frozen. Ideally you want to show a little movement in the photo. Fast enough that the cars are sharp but the tires show they are spinning looks best to me. Depending on how close you are, probably 1/250 to 1/500 should to it. I would add that the 35mm may not be wide enough for the photos of the overall stadium but might work for shooting the cars.</p>

[Wouter Willemse]

<p>For the wide angle stuff, the Tokina 12-24 is very nice and affordable, but at f/4 it may be hard to get shuttertimes short enough for the cars to be "frozen". The nikon 10-24 basically offers the same issue, but the 2 extra millimeters are nice, though a tad expensive. The Tokina 11-16 f/2.8 might be a bit better for the night/F1 lights, though in "normal" life it is a less versatile lens than a 1x-24.<br>

For the track, if the 85mm is long enough, the 85 f/1.8 to me makes a solid choice. Adding flash may be an option, if at all needed. The Better Beamer Kent mentions also exists for the SB600 (and a SB600 is a nicer flash option for the DSLRs, I think), but I doubt whether they allow flash? On top of that, I wonder whether you'd really need it. If my TV was somewhat OK during the last race there, the amount of light during the race was pretty staggering. Personally, I would rather bring a 80-200 f/2.8 for more versatility than a 85mm, by the way.</p>

<p>The main point is indeed panning along with the cars, and manually (pre)focus since your AF will not be able to keep up. Try to take your pictures at the slow corners, makes panning easier and because the cars have pretty "fixed"driving lines on the track, easier to pre-focus.</p>

 

[ruth_grant]

<p>Thank you to everyone for your responses! So many things to think about!<br>

@ Kent - the track is amazingly bright - brighter than daylight I would say. I'm not sure about using a flash for two reasons. One, not sure I'll need it in that light - and I don't remember seeing people with flashes last year. Really big lenses, yes, but I didn't see flashes. Other thing is I'm not sure of the regulations - I would hate to be a distraction to the drivers (unlikely, I know, but still). Thank you very much for the ideas on the flash though - I am intrigued! I will do some research and might come back to you for more information later, if that's ok?<br>

@ Raden - I have no idea how fast I can shoot compared to a car - especially a F1 car!! I doubt I can be very fast at all! BUT - half the fun is in the trying! What we did find last year was a little spot tucked away near one of the corners where the cars were going "slower" - we'll try find that same spot again. Also, if the safety car comes out, the photo opportunities are much improved as the cars aren't going anywhere near as fast as usual! I permanently have an umbrella with me in Singapore :-) and I've bought myself a lovely bright yellow rain poncho, just in case!<br>

I've been practicing my panning, but nothing my husband throws for me to track seems to go as fast as a race car! Thanks for the advice about using the manual (pre)focus - that had honestly never occurred to me. Actually, thinking about it, there are many other times when that would be much easier that struggling with the lens trying to focus for me!<br>

@ Wouter - I have been looking at the Tokina 12-24mm but am worried about it being f/4... My gut tells me a faster lens, but I also don't really want to spend a lot of money on this lens - it's more of a tangent to the greater "overall camera plan". The 80-200mm f/2.8 is in my greater plan, but I need to save up a bit more for that one.<br>

Anyway, I'm off to practice! Whatever happens this will be fun - and I'll show you the results - blurred or otherwise!</p>

<p> </p>

[johnw63]

<p>Unless you are shooting in a very fast section, or you WANT to freeze the car and the background, don't shoot faster than about 125th of a second. Of course, this may vary a bit, depending on how close you are and how fast you have to pan, but I have found shooting race cars is more dynamic in the 60th to 125th of a second. The wheels are blurring and the background gets smeared. I visited a web site of a guy that shoots them even slower because the "blur" is his trade mark.</p>

<p>The nice thing about race cars and good drivers is they always hit the same spot on the track every time. That means after a lap or two, you CAN focus on a spot, start panning with the car as they approach and then squeeze the trigger when they hit your spot. No auto focus needed. The one thing to keep in mind is make sure you have enough depth of field to get the whole car in focus. ( Unless your trying to get an artsy shot of ONLY the drivers helmet in sharp detail )</p>

<p>Another thing to keep in mind is keep your eyes open for action. Watch cars that are fighting for position and stay more zoomed out, just in case there is contact. It also gives you room to try different compositions, as the cars jockey for position. ( I know. It's F1, there won't BE that many on track passes. It is a street race, however and the walls can reach out and bite you ! )</p>

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