EOS 7D and new EF-S lenses

[thomas_sullivan]

<p>personally, too many odd things about it. The naming convention is wrong....the single digit name has been the upper echelon of Canon thru out all of digital....and the main feature has always been a full frame sensor.</p>

<p>Next, according to Best Buy inventory....the 7D is going for $2700. Same as the 5DMKII....this price mark up from every other crop camera Canon makes just does not ring true...........there's just not that much value added over the top of the line crop camera they presently have.</p>

<p>Hoax....if you ask me.</p>

[benbangerter]

<p>I'm with Thomas - I smell a rat.</p>

[keith reeder]

<blockquote>

<p>I just love how people are already upset over the sensor. You haven't seen sample images yet! How can you judge? Oh wait, you can't.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>Indeed.</p>

<p>I'm no fan of pixels for the sake of it - I didn't upgrade to the 50D from the 40D because I underwhelmed by the noise "improvements" it delivered, but even I accept that the 50D is far from terrible, especially given the size of the increase.</p>

<p>An extra 3 mp isn't <em>that</em> much more than the 15mps in the 50D (the 40D went up by 2 mp over the 30D, a proportionately bigger increase, and yet noise is clearly better in the 40D), and it is known that Canon has been working on some cutting edge, novel sensor design approaches which might well deliver real improvements <em>and</em> a higher pixel count.</p>

<p>Let's face it, there's quite a buzz about Sony's new backlit Exmor sensors - maybe Canon has something new to unveil in this camera.</p>

<p>This - admittedly a quote from a rumour site, but with a ring of truth to it - is interesting:</p>

<blockquote>

<p>Canon is very excited about a next generation CMOS sensors they are working on. Two full frame versions have 40M and 50M pixels at the -same- noise level as the current 1D series. Low power supply voltages give cooler chips and lower noise even with smaller pixels. Different circuit fabrication techniques also promise to make close to 100% of the sensor area active pixels. This technology won't make any of the upcoming models, but is expected in 2009/10.</p>

</blockquote>

<p>It's interesting particularly because an 18 mp 1.6 crop sensor would equate to a c. 46 mp FF sensor. Canon is sometimes known to roll out new tech in its non-pro bodies first, so maybe the sensor in this camera is a debut of the technology on which the 40 and 50 mp sensors referred to above are based?</p>

<p>Conversely, pixel binning/sRAW could deliver (say) 9 mp at very clean high ISO, which would certainly suit <em>me</em> perfectly: some folk are taking a similar approach with the 5D MK II at very high ISOs and have reported great success using sRAW, with no observable impact on fine detail.</p>

<p>Finally, there's no reason to believe that the processing power of dual Digic IV might not be coupled with novel software-based noise solutions: it <em>must</em> be possible to deal with noise "mathematically" by recognising it for what it is (let's face it - we can) and (say) interpolating correct or closely analogous replacement values for the noisy pixels based on the non-noisy pixels surrounding them but without the "smearing" of detail that clumsy NR usually delivers (and here I'm anticipating new approaches, not current binning/averaging/NR techniques).</p>

<p>Look closely at the output of the newer Nikons at high ISO: they're <em>bereft</em> of chroma noise, and I'm convinced there's software-based colour replacement going on there, with chroma noise "swapped out" for what appears to be luma.</p>

<p>Or how about efficient real time in-camera black frame reduction?</p>

<p>I'm not ruling this vapo(u)rware camera out just yet on the basis of its supposed mp count...</p>

[images_in_light_north_west]

<p>I agree with Keith, but at the same time a little dubious about 18mp in an APS-C camera.</p>

[landscape_shooter]

<p>Wow, I remember when a new film came out that was exciting. The 15-85 lens sounds interesting in focal length. If it was a straight f4 it would be more interesting I think. This must be a replacement to the 17-85 that has gotten a bad reputation.</p>

[tim_klimowicz]

<p>What a huge let down. Two crappy EF-S lenses and yet another APS-C with a trillion megapixels.<br>

I just don't get it....</p>

[PuppyDigs]

<blockquote>

<p>What a huge let down. Two crappy EF-S lenses and yet another APS-C with a trillion megapixels.<br />I just don't get it....</p>

</blockquote>

<p>If you feel a huge let down over speculation about a rumored product, it ain't a good thing for you. What if something truly tragic happened in your life? Besides, Canon is already in overkill mode with so many friggen great cameras and lenses, not much left to do except simulate the market.</p>

[keith reeder]

<p>Oh I'm skeptical too Ross, but I'm keeping an open mind because things do move on.</p>

<p>Canon are in the business of making money so they must know what the market scuttlebutt is saying about more and more pixels <em>for their own sake - </em> and there are some clever folk working for Canon (though perhaps not in their marketing dept!)</p>

[keith reeder]

<blockquote>

<p>What a huge let down. Two crappy EF-S lenses and yet another APS-C with a trillion megapixels.<br /> I just don't get it....</p>

</blockquote>

<p>What's the problem?</p>

<p>This, if it happens, is a brand new camera - a brand new <em>kind</em> of camera, and a radical departure from the Canon norm - which (assuming decent noise handling) is going to make a huge number of folk who shoot sports and wildlife absolutely bloody ecstatic.</p>

<p>Dismissing it as "just" another high mp cropper is ridiculous. It might not bring anything to your kind of photography, but so what?</p>

<p>On the basis of the material on your website, it would clearly be too much camera for your purposes, but some of us really want <em>and can benefit from</em> a camera with the capabilities suggested by this rumour.</p>

[yog_sothoth]

<p>Keeping in mind that the only advanage "full frame" has over APS-C is a stop or so noise reduction at high ISOs, a crop camera is just fine. I wish that Canon would make some fast and relatively compact EF-S primes. A rebel with a pankake lens would be really cool.</p>

[matthijs]

<p>EF 28 / 2.8 is pretty small...</p>

<p>But it's not EF-s and it's no pancake so maybe you won't like it.</p>

[mike dixon]

<blockquote>

<p>Keeping in mind that the only advanage "full frame" has over APS-C is a stop or so noise reduction at high ISOs</p>

 

</blockquote>

<p>And a greater capacity for shallow DOF. And the availability of fast wide angle lenses. And the need for less magnification for the same print size. And bigger viewfinders.</p>

[anov]

<p>

<blockquote>

<p>Keeping in mind that the only advanage "full frame" has over APS-C is a stop or so noise reduction at high ISOs</p>

 

And slower frame/second. And heavier, bulkier pro lenses. And less pictures per memory card. And less DOF for a given light. And heavier built camera ;)

 

Of course the same is true as you move to medium format.

</blockquote>

</p>

[25asa]

<p>Shouldn't this camera be a 60D and not a 7D?</p>

[PuppyDigs]

<blockquote>

<p>Shouldn't this camera be a 60D and not a 7D?</p>

</blockquote>

<p>The Elan 7E was called the EOS 7 in Japan and the EOS 50 in Europe. So EOS 7D kinda makes sense since it occupies the same place in the line as the old film 7E/7/50. And we don't know for sure what the North American name will be. I'm hoping Elan Digital.</p>

[JDMvW]

<p>I'm still skeptical about the 7D name, but maybe Puppy Face has it.<br>

If this is phoney somebody went to a lot of work over it.<br>

Although I am a great fan of the 17-85mm, it is certainly due for an upgrade, so that would be nice if it were true.</p>

[oofoto]

<p>I'm with Mike Dixon. The day I shifted my 10D and got back full frame 5D heaven was beautiful. I still don't need to upgrade from my 5D, full frame <em>per se</em> is enough for me at present. I think there are many folks now who came straight to digital SLR bypassing 35mm film who do not grasp the beauty of the format but only see it focal length and sensor size.<br>

I cannot believe an APS-C would be called 7D either although if we look at naming then an upgraded 5D would go towards either 4D or the infamous 3D so it could as well be true.</p>

[funkag]

<p>Does the world really need two more slow consumer zooms? Considering the barrel distortion of the 17-85 ("record-breaking" according to photozone.de) is already a bit extreme, will the 15-85 be approaching a fisheye at 15mm?</p>

[JDMvW]

<p>If you've been watching what has been happening in the other recent upgrades that Canon has been working through, CA and distortion are precisely what they have been fixing.</p>

<p>And even the Photozone.de and Bob Atkins' reviews of the old 17-85 were much kinder than Greg's summary of the problems they do have. If you do a lot of photography of brick walls, sure, you've got problems here, but otherwise, not so much.</p>

[bernard_odonovan]

<p>More stuff?</p>

<li>18M APS-C CMOS </li>

<li>Dual DiGiC 4, 14bit </li>

<li>8fps, 94 large fine jpegs or 15 RAWs </li>

<li>19 points cross type AF sensor. Center AF point uses cross plus X type AF sensor </li>

<li>ISO 100-6400, extend to 12800 </li>

<li>100% coverage, 1.0x optical viewfinder with smart information display. Digital gradiometer provided </li>

<li>3.0inch LCD, 920,000 dot </li>

<li>New iFCL metering system, brightness and color </li>

<li>Full HD video (with external mic input and HDMI output) </li>

<li>150,000 shutter life cycle </li>

<li>internal e-ttl flash control </li>

<li>Live view with Face-priority AF </li>

<p><img src="http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/camera_images_4/Canon/7d/7d-lenses.jpg" alt="" /></p>

[bernard_odonovan]

<p>New 100 Macro<br>

<img src="http://www.canonrumors.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/8689686.jpg" alt="" /></p>

[bernard_odonovan]

<p>Another 7D translation:<br>

1. 18MP APSC CMOS<br />2. Dual DIGIC 4<br />3. 8 FPS (~14 FINE JPEG/ 15 RAW)<br />4. New eight-directional double cross central AF point, total 19 cross AF points<br />5. ISO 100-6400 (Exp 12800)<br />6. ~100% 1.0X magni VF with intelligent display, horizon assist<br />7. New iFCL metering (exposure and colour)<br />8. 3′ 920K Version II LCD, 160 deg viewing<br />9. Full HD video (w external mic input n HDMI output)<br />10. Live view w Face-priority AF<br />11. New switch for Live View/Video mode<br />12. Aero-dynamic body design, metallic shutter sound, 150K shutter life<br />13. New 24mm built-in flash, supports EOS intelligent speedlite system<br />14. A.L.O<br />15. P.I.C<br />16. Picture style<br />17. EOS Integrated Dust Removal system</p>

[danielleetaylor]

<p>More pictures have appeared on rumor sites and it's looking pretty real at this point. I bet there will be no surprises on Sept. 1st except, perhaps, hopefully the surprise that early reviews find less noise thanks to one of the technologies Canon has stated they are excited about introducing. Canon must be confident to list ISO 6400 as a normal ISO (if I'm interpreting that correctly).</p>

<p>This is Canon's answer to the D300 and the complaints that the xxD series are really not at the same position in terms of line up, and are therefore at a disadvantage in comparisons. The metering is new and clearly pro level. Some will complain about 19 vs. 51 point AF, but it's clear Canon is trying to put "pro" AF in the 7D. And if they have in terms of technology and processing speed, then I predict the point density difference will be a non issue, i.e. you will see roughly the same performance for things like sports and BiF between the 7D and D300s. If they're real features, the horizon assist 100% VF and integrated wireless flash control are more answers to Nikon's challenge.</p>

<p>Depending on sensor performance I think this will be a very strong camera, and I'm excited to see the upgrade on the 1st. The sensor will determine whether this camera is roughly equal to the D300, or a clear step up.</p>

<p>If these are the specs I, for one, will try to upgrade by Thanksgiving.</p>

<p>As Keith pointed out, the other interesting thing about this is that it equates to a FF sensor in the 40-50 MP range. Canon has hinted that this would be coming up, and I'm excited to see what appears in the next 1D series.</p>

<p>While I'm sharing my thoughts...I predict the xxD series will not die, but simply remain as a model below the 7D, cheaper and with fewer "pro" features. And I think the 50D will be around for a while longer in any case, maybe with a price drop.</p>

[bernard_odonovan]

<p><img src="http://www.smugmug.com/photos/625042373_3V8fK-X3.jpg" alt="" /></p>

[anov]

<p>That 100mm macro is L lens with 67mm filter with much higher price I guess. So I'm thinking the 100mm macro non L will continue to march on alongside. The EF-S lenses do not have the big silver band in the middle anymore for some reason.</p>

<p>I'm happy they will offer a pro grade crop body ala Nikon D300s. The video feature alone might make me upgrade. I'm tired of carrying around a p&s just so I can take occasional video.</p>