Plugging in an Alien Bees B400/B800 for off-camera reception lighting?

[dustin_hatcher]

<p>Hi All,<br>

I just wanted to gather some of your thoughts about bringing along an Alien Bees B400 or B800 along to setup for off-camera lighting at a reception. Right now I currently use an older Canon 540EZ on a lightstand to accomplish this, but was thinking something that plugs in might give me a little quicker recycle time. <br>

I would of course make sure all cords are hidden &/ taped down to minimize the risk of any tripping. </p>

<p>Thank you everyone!</p>

[savagesax]

<p>And your questions are?</p>

[Matt Laur]

<p>Well, no question that a B800 is going to throw quite a bit more light than a hot-shoe speedlight. And yes, it will cycle faster.<br /><br />How are you triggering? If you're doing it optically, remember that everyone's point-and-shoot cameras will be setting off your monolight, too. If you're using radio triggers, then things will be more under control.</p>

[dustin_hatcher]

<p>I use the newer Alien Bees wireless receiver and transmitter. I found they work quite well at half the price of the pocket wizards. Good for the budget :)<br>

My question is what do you guys think of doing something like that? I've seen photographers go with off-camera lighting, without off-camera lighting. Hot-shoe mounted flashes, but I haven't seen any monolights hooked up at a reception yet. Of course that doesn't mean anything as I've only been doing this for a year now.</p>

[daverhaas]

<p>If you're triggering with the radio transmitter then your only worry may be the wireless mike or radio system in use at the reception venue.</p>

<p>Personally - I go with the hotshoe mounted flash for the reception. That way I don't have to worry about taping down cords or a slightly drunken guest trying to dance with my lights.</p>

<p>Dave</p>

 

[pete_s.]

<p>It's a pretty common technique and they're usually called room lights if you want to google.<br /> I have been using profoto compact 600 for this and I'd say you would need at least two lights and something of similar power (AlienBee B1600?) and also reasonably fast recycle speed (the profotos are 0.8s at 1/1 power).</p>

[steve_c.5]

<p>I guess I don't understand this need for photographers covering dimly-lit receptions to try and light up the whole room with strobes. My approach has been to do some shutter drag and raise the ISO to capture the ambient room lighting and simply handhold an off-camera shoe mount flash with a diffuser to pop a little lighting on people dancing or doing other activities. It's far less intrusive, you can go anywhere you like, nobody will trip on anything, there are no stands to set up, no extra gear to lug, and you affect the ambient lighting in a minimal way. If the DJ is using colored disco lights with his rig, you can also capture those colors, rather than blowing them away with strobes.</p>

<p>Now, with my rig, I either use the Alienbees Cybersync triggers, or I will use an off-camera TTL sync cord along with the camera's flash compensation control. And I do connect an auxiliary power pack to the flash for rapid recycling, as the four AA rechargables simply cannot keep up with rapid action like bouquet tosses and the like. I also like to manage flash output manually, usually between 1/8 to 1/2 power to keep short recycle times and extend battery life. If you try to pop full power flashes, you'll go through a lot of batteries and risk burning out the strobes.</p>

[dustin_hatcher]

<p>Hi Steve,<br>

I think that's a good point that you bring up about destroying the ambient lighting of the room. I actually try to make sure I don't in fact blow the ambient lighting away. I tend to try to use the off-camera light as more of a sidelight to the crowd during dancing etc coupled with an on-camera flash to fill in faces and details, but maintain the ambient look in the background. Well that's my goal anyhow when I setup :)</p>

[kiva]

<p>I use a White Lightning at some receptions in addition to my usual speedlights.</p>

<p>You'll get a lot more use out of your Alien Bee at receptions if you purchase the battery pack that goes with it and just run the light, during the reception, using the battery pack. My battery pack has a fast recycle setting and I have no problems with it at all. This way you are not limited to areas along the wall and there are no cords to deal with.</p>

<p>The reason I find it "good" to use this kind of lighting at a reception is that it can be turned off and one can shoot as Steve describes which works very well. But, the advantage to having the extra off camera lighting (including your Alien Bee) is that you can turn them on for use periodically to capture a "different" look.</p>

<p>At times, it's lovely to create more light in backgrounds or to have your cross lighting create all sorts of fun light on guests while talking or dancing.</p>

<p>The different look helps give you a nice flow and change at a wedding reception as well as giving a nice change to the photography; a hot look to hot times is my observation. I tend to turn On my off-camera lighting (including my White Lightning 800) when the dancing or activity gets "hot" and the extra lighting gives a hard direct lighting to match the activity going on.</p>

<p>So, the purpose, is to create a rythmn and a flow to the reception instead of having the same "look" for the entire reception. Let's face it: some receptions deserve some lighting that matches the pace of the celebration if for nothing else than to create a different look. I will turn all my off-camera lighting off and then back on several times during an evening but it depends on the flow and pace of the reception.</p>

<p>Also note the use of long shutter to create lighting effects certainly can add a different look to a few photographs ... couples seem to love this but beware of over-doing it. It's like using a fisheye: use it sparingly to get the wow factor but it can be done nicely even with your off-camera lighting.</p><div></div>

[dustin_hatcher]

<p>William just curious do you point your White Lightning directly at the crowd or bounce from the ceiling?</p>

[kiva]

<p>I do both Dustin ... depends on the look I want and what the reception hall looks like. I suggest you try both: it takes mere seconds to change from bounce to direct flash. You might try it at a wedding coming up but only try it for a short time at the end of the evening so that you can experiment with it. No need to jump in full force; the biggest stress is in getting it all set up for use so that all you do is turn it on and play with it. I tend to use it most when the reception hall is large and I need some reach to get to the dance floor so if you're close just turn it down to 1/4 or 1/8 power and give it a try. No reason it can't be used in small areas to: just dial it down.</p>

<p>I've bounced the light as well as shooting it directly but I'd say that bouncing it is most common for me with the White Lightning. I've bounced it forward towards the dance floor by angling it off the ceiling and I've bounced it backwards into where a ceiling meets the wall so it would soften a bit more. One wedding where I bounced it forward right onto the dance area was a location that had a black ceiling and black walls: it worked like a charm.</p>

<p>In the set of photos above I was pointing the WL straight up and bouncing it off the angled tent ceiling just off to the side of the stage where a band was playing so that the light bounced into the band a bit as well as the dance floor and then I had two direct hard flash units on the other side (opposite the band) to scrap across the dance floor from corner to corner. <strong>I also used a flash unit on my camera as fill light</strong> ; just use flash compensation to dial it up and down as needed for the area you're in at the time<strong>. </strong> I control lighting, in general, by adjusting my aperture. <br>

My usual starting point is to set the White Lightning to about 1/2 power or less so that I have a fast recycle and then set my speedlites to 1/2 and/or 1/4 power depending on how much reach I need to get nice coverage. Then just work the aperture to balance the exposure. If you use two or three off camera lights then you can lower the power used on each of them which allows you faster recycling. Again, I don't use the off camera flash units all night long; turn them off and on depending on the pace of the evening and the pace of the excitement shown by the guests. Others will do this differently.</p>

<p>Remember: you're setting up cross lighting so you'll need to have a plan that has you placing your lights so that you are shooting across their path in some way. Or, if you shoot directly at them you can use a person's body to hide the light and get a fun effect. And, it's fun to allow the units "flash" to show in a few photos just to give yourself a fun / different look: again, don't overdo it. At least that's my method at this time.</p>

[picturesque]

<p>I pretty much do as William M. does. Set them up when I want them for the effect I want. Sometimes I don't use them, but mostly I do, because I like the accenting they provide. In some venues, a single on camera light is pretty boring, even when dragging the shutter. As for preserving the ambiance, that is all well and good except when the ambiance is basically just darkness. To have a picture, you need light, and while high ISO quality gets better all the time, you still can't shoot in the dark without some help if you want quality images. And sometimes, bouncing the flash gives an effect totally opposite the actual ambient lighting. I use Sunpak 120Js with battery packs on them, not monolights. I personally don't like monolights at weddings because they are top heavy. If you are careful, they are OK though. Some photographers use off camera lights only--no on camera. Obviously this frees you a lot while giving you dimensional lighting.</p>

<p>To me, the real issue is not recycling, but what you want to do with the light. You can always get a battery pack for the 540EZ to make it recycle faster. Usually, you don't need even shoemounts to be at maximum power for room lights anyway, even bouncing.</p>

<p>However, you can obviously do a few things with light from a more powerful unit like a monolight, than you can with shoemounts. Look up some posts by Michael Church on these forums. He uses a single Alien Bee 1600 bounced off walls and ceilings.</p>

<p>William M. is right--with digital, there is no reason not to experiment wildly. There is no downside to doing this. If you don't like the effect, just change it.</p>

[steve_c.5]

<p>I would add that those of us who do this all the time constantly refine our equipment and technique and try different things as Nadine and William suggest. There's no one way to do it, and no right/wrong way, but there are certainly better/worse techniques (direct flash on-camera being among the worst). </p>

[dustin_hatcher]

<p>Thanks for all the replies everyone, I certainly appreciate them. </p>

<p>William M. - I agree with the sentiment that I should play with it since it is digital. I'm going to give bouncing a try at some receptions this year. I've so far only been pointing it directly at the center [well close to the center] anyways of the dance floor for some side lighting and when I don't want it I just disconnect the remote trigger and put that in my pocket. I've typically been setting up in such a way that I can control how much light I need by switching between 100-800 ISO in terms of if I get closer or farther away instead of changing the aperture. I like to try to get softer backgrounds so that has worked pretty well for me. Here's a picture from a wedding my wife and I covered back in Dec. 08 of how my setup has been working for me. On the left you can obviously see where the off-camera light is and how I used it for effect and on the right is the other kind of affect I like to get as well. Believe it or not that is with the flash going off in the same direction, only I moved :)<br>

Nadine - I always heed your advice when reading these forums. I agree the monolights are top heavy and if I went with that solution I'd get a little beefier stand and I always put 10-20lbs of ankle weights [i find them cheaper to buy than boa bags and just as flexible to hold down light stands] on my stands to try to make sure they don't accidentally get knocked over.<br>

<img src="http://truebeautyphotography.com/Audrey_Vance_Blog/avwedding0630.jpg" alt="" width="807" height="638" /></p>

 

[kiva]

<p>Fun photos Dustin. Nice rim light created on the brides hair. Looks like your well on your way.</p>

<p>Not sure what camera you have but the reason I adjust my aperture instead of the iso is that the aperture can be adjusted almost instantly and on the fly as I move about; the iso is a bit more cumbersome to adjust. (It's interesting to see how many ways we can get there from here and create totally different looks on the way.)</p>

<p>I never use a stand for my lights: the legs are to much to worry about. Smaller units can be attached to "things" using Justin Clamp like stuff. For the larger light: I had a welder create a stand without legs for me that works great: a bit cumbersome to carry in but it's well worth it when you don't have to worry about someone hooking a stand leg with their foot and toppling a stand.</p>

<p>Steve, glad you pointed that out: don't use direct flash from the camera is the way to go ... I use a Demb Diffuser to bounce the light to soften it.</p>

[picturesque]

<p>Yeah--I've gotten really good at scoping out places for stands--every odd nook or potted plant. I also carry C clamps. I adjust my stand leg width, which you can't really do with monolights.</p>

<p>Another thing about room lights is that they do help with white balance and helps lower your ISO, as well as saves your on camera flash from working so hard--not a laughing matter these days, with the number of images one produces. Nowadays high ISO is good quality, but I still tend to use the lowest I can get away with.</p>

<p>And, I have seen some very nice dancing candids done with off camera lights and the on camera held in the hand, high and off to one side, but direct--by some highly respected wedding photographers. I don't make blanket statements about anything since someone always comes along to prove you wrong. :^)</p>

[pete_s.]

<p>A good idea when you set up light stands indoor is to also tape the legs to the floor with gaffa. And tape power cords and extension cables as well so people can't trip over them. And use proper stands that can hold the weight of the strobes and then some. Strobes are really lightweight compared to the light gear the DJ has so finding good stands is not hard. Common sense where to put them goes a long way as well.</p>

<p>Some DJs also have a clause in their contract that they are not responsible for people that fall or trip over their equipment and I can't see why a photographer couldn't do the same.</p>

[wedding-photography-denver]

<p>While I have AB's 800's and 1600's, I rarely use them for reception lighting. Too big/heavy and too slow to change the settings. Wile you can control the exposure via your ISO and aperture, your minimum dump from an 800 (320ws) is around 60ws I believe. So while using a 400 may be an option, the 800 will likely kill most reception ambient on the lowest setting. I prefer the speedlight approach to this as it gives faster control and when combined with higher ISO's (800 +) is pretty easy to get plenty of light at around 1/4 power or lower.</p>

<p>OTOH, you can do it with AB's, it just means the finished product will less resemble the way it really felt to be there.</p>

<p>I would gel them if you decide to go that route and at least try to bring some balance/ambient look back to the images.</p>