tamara_ishmael Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 <p>Hi Everyone --<br> I posted awhile back, thinking I would be getting a Nikon D90. In the meantime, I have discovered the world of wide-angle, manual-control compact digital cameras, and I'm excited! I'm brand new to taking photography seriously, and while I was confident I could master the learning curve of going from point-n-shoot to DSLR, I was dreading the learning curve a bit. Now that I have discovered these cameras, I think they will suit my purposes much better. Plus, I figure the manual controls will still offer artistic control, and if I decide I want to take photography to the next level, I can always add a DSLR to my stash, right? <br> So, now the big question. I have read positive reviews for these cameras:<br> Leica d-lux4 / Panasonic LX3 / Ricoh GX200 / Sigma DPI <br> I have a Macintosh, and I understand the LX3's post-processing isn't Mac friendly? <br> Which one do you recommend, oh wise photo.net forum photographers? Is there another similar camera I've not included? I need some experienced help! <br> Thanks! Tamara</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcuknz Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 <p>I cannot imagine how the output from the LX3 would not be suitable for your Mac so long as you forget the 'editing' stuff which comes free with the camera and get yourself a good editoing programme such as Paint Shop Pro, Adobe's Photoshop if you have plenty of money or the cheaper version, Elements. You need to appreciate that camera and editor are complimentary tools if you want to get serious about photography and the sooner you familarise yourself with a good editing programme the better ... I'm sure it will be a hard learning curve for you but plug on with it and once it falls into place you will have a ball :-)<br> You don't need to have the latest version of either PSP or Photoshop as anything from v.7 in each programme will see you for quite a time untl you appreciate that you need to update. This may save you money at the outset. One programme which comes with most cameras is one which helps you stitch two or more frames which were shot overlapping into a panoramic image which in turn saves the need for wide-angle lens capability, in fact you end up with a much wider view than the token WA lensed cameras give you for all their hype.<br> You may have problems with PSP on a Mac so Elements, one of the later versions, could be most ecconomical for you.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albertdarmali Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 <p>I shoot JPG with LX3 and they are just fine.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobcossar Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 <p>From that group it's the LX3 for me....Bob</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
galileo42 Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 <p>I guess only someone having shot extensively with all four cameras can really answer your question. Not very likely. So, what you'll probably get is more hearsay than actual experience. All I can say is that my LX-3 is great. And you can perfectly process the Raw files from it in Lightroom, vers. 2.2. You can download this version for free from Adobe's site, if it's not already the version you have (or buy.)</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamara_ishmael Posted February 11, 2009 Author Share Posted February 11, 2009 <p>Thanks so much for the responses so far! I do have Photoshop Elements and I'm currently taking a Photoshop class. Doing multimedia-style digital art is what got me interested in taking my own quality photos. I'm glad to know I'd be able to process LX3 using Elements on my Mac. Thanks, Tamara</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamara_ishmael Posted February 11, 2009 Author Share Posted February 11, 2009 <p>Hi all -- another couple of questions I've come up with in regards to these cameras:<br> - will I be able to use different lenses on any of these? will it matter?<br> - what about image stablization? do any of these have it? will it matter?<br> FYI - my photography will be primarily candid people/kids shots, street photography, and macro nature<br> Thanks! Tamara</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
galileo42 Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 <p>These are not DSLRs, which means you can't change lenses. But they offer zooms, apart from the Sigma, which has a fixed 28 mm lens. Tle Leica D-Lux 4 and the LX-3 are basically the same camera (lens, sensor...) with different image engines and build. And price. They have VR. It works well in the LX-3, and since if offers a fast lens (f:2) plus a good IQ up to ISO 800, it's a perfect snapshot-reportage camera for almost all circumstances. I put mine on Auto-ISO set at max. 800 and I shoot away.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dg1 Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 <p>I have the Ricoh GX200 and it has some features that make it a good choice. With regard to changing lenses, none of these cameras allow interchangeable lenses, but that said, the Ricoh offers a unique "step zoom" feature which provides discreet focal lengths stepped to 24,28,35,50, and 72mm. In addition the GX200 can be programmed to boot to any zoom position including these, or to go directly to the focal length and manual focus point that you've programmed via any of 3 "mysettings" that are selectable with the top mounted dial.<br> The GX200 features a dual wheel control layout that works similar to most DSLRs and it is a very well designed and responsive camera in use. The VF-1 kit includes a removable electronic viewfinder that I find very useful.<br> I've found that the GX200 has a somewhat steeper learning curve than other compacts I have used because to get the best images one pretty much has to shoot RAW. The jpegs are OK, but they are not as good as those from the LX3, although I would judge the B&W mode jpegs to be among the best quality I've seen.<br> I considered the LX3 and went back and forth between it and the GX200, finally settling on the GX200. The deciding factors for me was the programmable focal lengths of the GX200 vs having to be in zoom mode all the time with the LX3, and the control layout of the GX200 is IMO superior, and I prefer the aspect ratio selection of the GX200 which includes a 1:1 sqaure format RAW, 3:2, or 4:3. The LX3 offers 16:9 which is nice too, but not for me.<br> Good luck, I don't think you can go wrong with either the GX200, or LX3. I'm waiting for the Sigma DP2 to be released with a 41mm f/2.8 lens, because for me the 28mm fixed length is too wide. If the DP2 has improved some of the sluggishness of the DP1 I'll be in line.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill_tuthill Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 <p>If you want a camera that allows you to change lenses, look at the Panasonic G1. Reviewers have said that it is easier to manual focus (using the electronic viewfinder) than entry-level DSLRs (D40, D60, 450D, XTi, A200, A300) with their undersized optical viewfinders. Only two lenses designed for the G1 are available, but more will appear soon. Silkypix, the Panasonic-provided RAW converter, does run on a Mac.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron_breeze2 Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 <p>Hi Tamara! I own both the LX3 and the G10 and generally tote them around in the same case as I use them for different types of photography. The LX3 with its 24-60 mm fast Leica lens is my favorite of the two because of the wide angle lens, film grain and pinhole settings in the scene modes. Although the MP drop to 3 in these modes you can get some extraordinary photos that I have fooled long time photographer friends into thinking were shot on Tri-X. Being able to quickly set your aspect ratio to 16:9 on the lens for panoramic scenics is also a plus. Some people have complained about the greens in jpeg mode but with the exception of the scene modes I use its raw capabilities and the colors are fine. The G10 is larger physically and weighs more but its ability to zoom out to 140 mm is useful for candid head and shoulder shots at a much more comfortable distance to subject. The G10 has a cool color mode in scenes that allows you to isolate a color on a subject and turn the rest of the image to black and white. It also has a built in ND filter that I believe is unique to it and the stitch mode is really sweet for doing panoramas. It also shoots in raw and after I downloaded the dng. convertor for PS I have no trouble working with the raw files. Hope this helps.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamara_ishmael Posted February 11, 2009 Author Share Posted February 11, 2009 <p>Thanks for the input! Hmmm... now I'm looking at the Panasonic G1. Verrrrry interesting. Oh, these decisions are hard. FUN, but hard. :-) Thanks, Tamara</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerry_friedman Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 <p>I bet all the cameras in question are just fine. But, like Dean, I chose the Ricoh GX200 and have been VERY pleased. I would have liked a longer lens but the 24mm wide angle is just wonderful. PLUS (!) you can add a really excellent wide angle lens which takes it 19mm, which is wonderful. I shoot raw+jpeg and find this really very useful. I can rapidly view all pictures in jpeg and choose the good ones for working with (Photoshop elements 6) in RAW, which is far far more flexible than editing jpeg. I use a MAC and find this combo just fine. -- AND, the GX200 is really flexible because you can make sooo mannyyyy adjustments. Yes, it takes a little longer to master, but not to use. You can start with a more auto setting and go from there. I love the camera's small size, its very useful extra viewfinder, and the quality of the build. Also, something else very important to me: you can shoot from as close as 1 centimeter, or about a third of an inch. -- I am sure ALL fine cameras have their strong points but I happen to like the GX200 and have not found the smaller sensor or the lack of extra lenses a problem. Do, your self a favor: GO TO A STORE WHERE YOU CAN HANDLE THE CAMERAS! Best wishes to you and remember this: which ever camera you select, you will earn to love it, to use it to the best advantage and get so used to it that should you pick up a different camera later on, you will long for your first choice. I have come to love the way the Ricoh works but had i chosen otherwise, I am sure I would feel the same way about that camera. As long as you choose quality, you will love it.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamara_ishmael Posted February 11, 2009 Author Share Posted February 11, 2009 <p>Thank you, Jerry -- I appreciate your advice very much. I plan to visit an independent camera shop on Friday, and I am anxious to hold the cameras. I'm not ready to buy just yet -- we are in the process of trying to sell our house, and until it sells we are holding tight to our cash. I love doing the research, though, and especially appreciate the time and thought everyone has put into their responses to my inquiry. I can't wait until I have made my choice and can go with money in hand! :-) Thanks, Tamara</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff_bubis Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 <p>I just purchased an LX-3 and love it. I also use a Mac - and therin lies the issue. Yes - SilkyPix does run on a Mac. However, it is, perhaps, the single worst piece of imaging software I've ever used. The interface is lacking. It is slow. The quality of the RAW conversion is abhorent. Usually, I use Aperture, but it is not currently compatible. So... What I'm doing is saving the original RAW files on a discrete area of my HD. I downloaded the trial of LightRoom and I'm trying that, but would prefer not to buy it as it seems foolish to have bother LR and Aperture (and I prefer Aperture mostly due to the comfort I've developed over the years). I'm sure the problem will be rectified in future software updates, though. I can't recommend the LX-3 enough - especially for wide angle shots (a wide angle converter is also available). Get one while you can - the cameras are on backorder and prices are climbing. Enjoy!</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamara_ishmael Posted February 12, 2009 Author Share Posted February 12, 2009 <p>Thanks, Jeffery -- I thought I had heard (read) about software compatability issues with the LX3 and the Mac. I am leaning that direction, although since Bill (earlier post) suggested the Panasonic G1, I'm looking at that, too. Either way, I think I'll be happy. Thanks for your input! Tamara</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill_tuthill Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 <p>I don't think Silkypix is that bad, but I come from a Linux and Windows background, so I can't evaluate Macyness. <a href="http://www.photozone.de/silkypix-v303">Here is a review of Silkypix 3.0</a>, the version that comes with the G1. We use an older version that came with the FZ18 and 3.0 looks better. You just pop the SD card into your reader, open that directory in Silkypix, select convert to TIFF, and walk away. Or you can buy an Adobe product with RAW conversion, which purportedly runs faster. Or you can shoot in JPEG.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamara_ishmael Posted February 12, 2009 Author Share Posted February 12, 2009 <p>Thank you EVERYONE for sharing your experiences & thoughts. I have decided to go with the LX3, and I'm hoping the black will be back in stock by the time I have cash in hand for it. I am excited about this decision, and I look forward to posting some photos when the time comes. Thanks again! Tamara</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerry_friedman Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 <p>Hi Tamara! Best of luck selling your house. Be patient because these are crazy times. At my age I have sold about 5 houses so far and one thing i have learned is that you ONLY need ONE buyer. So, even if things look down, you never know when THE buyer will show up. 18 months ago I wrestled with a potential buyer of my house over every single dollar and every single thing he could come up with. After dealing with him for over six weeks of haggling, one day another buyer showed up and paid the full price, which almost knocked me out of my socks.<br> Just remember one thing; quality in a camera works every time and the biggest difference between any two comparable cameras is how they feel in your hand. I am left handed for instance, so you can imagine how that might count. But also, small hands are different from big hands and the layout of buttons and the logic of how a menu is laid out are all things that can make a difference. In the end, ALL of these good cameras have so many things they do well that it will take a while to learn how to use your camera to best advantage.<br> You are a sweetie so keep us all informed of how things are going.<br> Happy Valentines Day!</p> <p>Jerry</p> <p> </p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catrike Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 <p>Another vote for the LX3. I shoot RAW only and process the files on Adobe Camera Raw and Photoshop Elements 6. The G1 looks interesting but remember it weighs two and half times more than a LX3 and is not pocketable. Good luck on your decision making process.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamara_ishmael Posted February 12, 2009 Author Share Posted February 12, 2009 <p>Thanks, Jerry & Dave. <br> Dave, do you use a pc or Mac? I was considering getting Iridient Digital's "Raw Developer" to work with raw files from the LX3 on my Mac. <br> http://www.iridientdigital.com/products/rawdeveloper.html<br> Anyone have an opinion on this? <br> Thanks, Tamara</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter_foiles2 Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 <p>Tamara-<br> Although not as well known as some other other raw convetors out there (being a mac only program does not help) there are many that consider it among the best if not the best convertor available. I use Mac and LR 2.3 with my LX3, G1 and collection of dSLRs and use Raw developer from time to time. It does an excellant job of rendering fine detail.</p> <p>Part of the issue you may have heard with the LX3 and Mac may be related to how Panasonic handles their image files. For both the LX3 and G1 the in camera processing or the supplied software automatically corrects for some of the distortion and light falloff that occurs as the edge of the frame. I believe that the Adobe convertor products do this as well. So on a Mac the argument can be made that you are limited to using Adobe or the supplied software if you want to match in camera jpegs.</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catrike Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 <p>Tamara: I am using a pc but PSE6 w/ACR is available for Mac. See <a href="http://www.adobe.com/products/photoshopelmac/">http://www.adobe.com/products/photoshopelmac/</a></p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron_breeze2 Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 <p>Tamara the Mac issue is really a non issue. Adobe has a FREE stand alone dng. file convertor that can also be used in conjunction with other imaging software. Just go to the Adobe site and download it. </p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tamara_ishmael Posted February 15, 2009 Author Share Posted February 15, 2009 <p>Thanks, Peter, Dave & Ron! I will look into all these options. I really appreciate the helpfulness of this community! Thank you, THANK YOU! :-) Tamara</p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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