Recommendation for a prosecutor

[scott_mcilrath]

First I apologize.I imagine like most forums I've posted to someone has asked and answered this question before.

 

I am with a state prosecutor's office and we need an in house way to print digital pictures for use a trial.

Waterproof ink will be an issue. Mostly 8 x 10 format maybe an occasional 11x17 or even 5 x 7.

 

Networked so three employees can share the printer.

 

Volume; we print 20-30 pictures for trial 7 to 8 times a year on average. We are no different than the rest of

the world we want them immediately not an hour from when we decide to print them. I understand we have to work

around the speed issue.

 

We run HP computers and nearly everything else.

 

Our budget is up to about 1500.00

 

I would really like some suggestions from a very knowledgeable group of professionals.

 

Thanks

Scott

[starvy]

you are not really printing out images that would adorn galleries. as long as the exposed images have good enough definition, clarity and resolution, any medium priced a4 inkjet printer would delivery pictures that would suit you fine. however, it is the waterproof element that would add to the price. so inkjets are possibly out of the question. how about going laser?

[scott_mcilrath]

Waterproof is negotiable. I am in a high humidity and flood prone area but I don't have to go outside to get to the courtrooms. My though in that regard was that if the picture was transported to say the Supreme Court, waterproof ink may help protect against courier problems.

[stephen_delear]

Not sure maybe a Dye Sublimation printer. Film photography might be better for your application as 1) Film prints are water proof and 2) you have an original negative, which may help cut down on defense attorneys arguing that the images have been manipulated.

[scott_mcilrath]

Digital and film is not an issue. We get all of our pictures from local cops and they switched a long time ago.

 

I have read some of the other post and a lot of you seem to like the HP9180. It is in my budget and mentions water resistant ink.

 

Water is a problem only if the picture ends up going to the Supreme Court and the courier lets the package get wet. I can get room my office to the courtroom with out going outside.

[constance_cook]

I'm printing right now on a 9180. They are waterproof and that might be useful for handprints. If you hook it to HP computers, it is already color calibrated. The prints look like those from printing houses.

 

Conni

[colin_mattson1]

Waterproof shouldn't be an issue. Current inkjet prints (on photo papers) are at least water resistant, and often to a degree

that they may as well be waterproof regardless of how it's marketed. Unless the courier opts to run your prints through a

carwash with spinning brushes, you should be good.

 

The B9180 wouldn't be a bad way to go, especially if you can get it discounted. Ink's a little on the pricey side, but it's a

great printer, and the built-in ethernet will save you a lot of headaches in sharing it.

[Ed_Ingold]

My unqualified recommendation is a dye-sub printer. There are no inks to dry out from disuse and the prints are waterproof (spillproof), highly resistent to handling and at least as resistant to fading as conventional photographic prints. The look and feel is equal to conventional lab prints.

 

There are many inexpensive 4x6 inch to 6x8 inch printers (e.g., Canon, Kodak and High-Touch at <$200) and more expensive (and heavy duty) 8x10 inch printers by Mitsubishi, Kodak and Olympus ($1000 to $5000). As an added benefit, dye-sub printers are much faster than inkjets - typically 90 seconds or less start to finish. Paper and transfer film are changed at the same time, so the cost per print is fixed (about $1.80 per letter-sized sheet). AFIK, there are no ledger-sized (e.g., 11x17 inch) dye-sub printers.

 

The drivers for dye-sub printers generally preclude networking or use with a print server. However they can be attached to an host computer and shared by as many users as necessary via a network.

 

You can also get reasonable results using a color laser printer. The prints are fast and cheap (<$0.25 per letter-sized page), but not nearly the image quality of dye-sub, photographic or inkjet prints. Laserjet ink is very durable and waterproof, but the underlying paper is generally not waterproof. There are ledger-sized color laserjet printers for under $5000. If it helps justify the cost, the same printer can be used for all documents, text and graphic, in a workgroup environment, attached directly to the network (without an host). There are no inks to dry out, hence the printer can sit idle for months without problems.

 

Inkjet printers are available in larger sizes, and a ledger-sized printer costs $500 to $800. Pigment-based inks are reasonably water resistant when dry (24 hours). They withstand handling but can be easily scratched. The image quality is very high (better than conventional prints), but the print time can be long (8 minutes per letter-sized page). The inks tend to dry out and may need cleaning or replacement if not used at least once a week or two. In summation, find another way to make big prints (> 8x10) unless you want to tear your hair out trying.

[john_elder1]

Ask the opposing defense counsel to do the printing,

[samn]

Like Conni says, HP 9180. Set up is easy, let the printer handle color. HP has excellent service and support, backs their product, is network capable, waterproof on certain materials and water resistant on paper, prints all the sizes you require and prints on many types and thicknesses of media. It has everything you need. Just a little learning curve required.

[constance_cook]

Edward:

 

I left my 9180 for 61/2 weeks without printing with it. When I fired it up, it went through its regular calibration and printed like a charm. The 9180 doesn't clog like the Epsons do with lack of use. I wouldn't let it go for months but with common usage, it's just fine.

 

It prints up to 13x19.

 

Conni

[alec_myers]

I have a B9180 and a Mitsubishi dye-sub - I'd go for the speed and convenience of the dye-sub every single time.

Inkjets are great for art prints, but for run-of-the-mill stuff they're just, well, fussy and fragile.

 

Fuji and Mitsubishi both make dye-subs with 8" paper rolls, that will knock out 30 pictures in 15 minutes (8x10).

For lower volumes Kodak do ones which take packs of sheet paper. All dye-subs use special paper/ribbon-roll sets.

 

The only thing that would make me lean towards a different solution is that you only want to produce pictures a

few times per year - but then my choice would be to outsource, not to use an inkjet.

[alec_myers]

Oh yes, and I forgot to add - with an inkjet you're always either just about to run out of ink in the last cartridge of it's colour that you have, or else you've just run out of ink in the last cartridge. Then it's a two-day wait for those special inks to be delivered. Maybe an extra day because you just missed the courier deadline. You never have any idea how many more pages you can print before changing the cartridge because it depends on how much ink on each page, so someone has to stay and watch the printing. Then there are the paper jams, the smudges because someone thumbed a print before it was dry and - whoops - you've just exhausted another ink cartridge. In a colour you don't have a spare. So that's another two days gone...

 

A dye-sub comes with a fixed number of prints per pack (or roll) so you know exactly how many you have left, and you can stock spare rolls (or packs). There are no paper jams, they just print.

[Ed_Ingold]

Constance: <i>I left my 9180 for 61/2 weeks without printing with it. When I fired it up, it went through its regular calibration and printed like a charm.</i>

<p>

I've known people to smoke all their lives and never get cancer. I've left my Epson 2200 sit even longer and start right up. They got lucky! I got lucky! You got lucky! Maybe we should buy lottery tickets :-)

[richterjw]

My advice for a prosecutor: Move to Birmingham; all our local politicians are apparently crooks. Turns out this has been the case for some time now; who knew? And Southern politics has always had such a good rep. JR

[christopher hartt dallas]

For a brief moment (of insanity), I too, was a (Fed/ADA) prosecutor. I guess it's an OK job until you can be a full-time photographer :-)

 

The HP suggestion is the one to go with. For workgroups and networking, it's unexcelled. Plus, every government office I've ever known about has a deal with HP. You might inquire of your current supplier about a lease. If you can swing it, the HP Z3100 (24 inch model) would be a fantastic and versatile printer capable of exhibits and even fine art printing. The most compelling argument for HP(aside from networking options) is that unlike Epson, the heads don't clog from sitting idle. Also, HP support remains one of the few "English Based" support services remaining in the tech world

[dave_redmann]

Really, I think you should re-think getting an in-house printer. I realize that criminal defense law does not lend itself to the same careful preparation that civil defense law does, but won't prints in an hour suffice?

 

Pictures for a trial or evidentiary hearing very likely should be big--much bigger than even 11x17, more like 24x30 or even bigger. Otherwise the jury (or even judge) is not likely to get a good enough look, especially if you use it with a witness on the stand, who would presumably have the picture nearby. Also, you need them mounted on some sort of foamcore or similar board, to make them rigid. So basically, outsourcing this stuff makes much more sense. In most decent-size areas, there is a litigation support company that can print big and mount in under a day. My guess is that if you develop a relationship with one, then for a DA in a hot trial, they'd get you mounted prints in an hour or two.

 

Also, if you really need something, unexpectedly, your local Walgreen's or whatever can give you 8x10's in an hour, often 24 hours a day.

 

I'm skeptical that there are any printers under $1500 that can give you a decent-quality color 24x30, much less a 40x50. And after you print, you need to mount.

[michaelchristensen]

Why ask here? .. You should be contacting the FBI office in Washington DC .. they have image experts who easily can address the questions .. and then some; and nothwithstanding what police in various departments do with photos and other information technoligy .. they generally rely upon consumer technology for the phtographs you're talking about.

 

The FBI has a standard for handling and printing digital media as well as staff experts to answer a lot more questions than merely being concerned about waterproof inks. Your budget is too low for a States Attorney's office. My department spends 10 times that on digital imagry products .. and we are a suburburn law enforcement organization with 50 employees (small by many standards).

 

And don't discount film for serious crime scenes or death penalty cases .. I mean digital serves adequate needs for documenting the typical burglaries, domestic violence, etc. .. but defense attorneys are getting savy on how we manage digital information ..

 

You can contact B&H also. In fact, that's probably who has the FBI contract .. give them your parameters for print sizes and they can tell you what Epson (insert brand here) printer to buy to meet your needs..

[steven_clark]

Pigments inks from an inkjet are ridiculously waterproof. I remember one of the old tricks of the Epson weekend demos was a little Durabrite ink print on matte paper in a plastic jar filled with water. The prints would literally last for months until they had to be replaced because the paper was starting to turn into pulp. So, if what you want is color up to letter size what you're looking for is a current model Epson with Durabrite inks, or a decent color laser. If you NEED to have that ability to make larger prints on site, the Ultrachrome ink is still pretty water resistant so an Epson R1900 would do for up to 13in across and an Epson Pro 3800 would do for 17" across and better ink economy with a built-in print server for instant networking. That's as far as I know, I only window shop one brand at a time.

[mel_unruh]

Scott,

 

Since you're already an HP shop, contact your HP rep and get a demo of the B9180. Its a fantastic printer from a name you already trust. It's very well built and like your other HP equipment, it will work whenever you need it. Its familiar technology and will do the 5X7', 8X10, 11X14 and yes, even 13X19 without a problem. As an added bonus, you can also print text on plain paper, card stock, greeting cards, invitations, etc, which may be handy in an office setting. Its worth taking a look.

 

Mel

[iangriffiths]

Ok, I may be missing something obvious here, but couldn't you just laminate the pictures once printed? I've done quite a few prints for humid areas bathrooms, pools, etc and found that this was the easiest way to protect them from water damage. That way, any A4 printer would do?

 

Regards

 

Ian

[Uhooru]

I'm a paralegal so I understand the time pressure. One thing you want to be sure is that when you go to print, its ready to go. Sometimes inkjets, when they sit for a while, will tend to clog. You don't want to be sitting there the night b4 trial trying to figure out how to get a print:)

 

So you may just want to keep that in mind when evaluating the printers. I think some of those above take that into consideration, but I just wanted to stress it.

[User_503771]

The HP printers I've used have the print heads in the cartridges, not fixed in the printer. So if, by chance, something clogs, just replace the cartridge and you're ready to go in short order.

[kris-bochenek]

how about used Epson 4880 or 4800 if you can find one. I saw couple of them on Ebay the other day.

if the waterproof is a must why not to laminate the images that cannot be so expensive.

KrisB

[constance_cook]

Edward:

 

Best and only really great laugh I had yesterday! I have bought fewer than five lottery tickets ever and then only because friends wanted to buy as a group. I won small once.

 

But no kidding, I do leave the 9180 for two+ weeks all the time with never a clog. I will print more this winter but spring/summer I slow to almost quit printing. I save whatever I want to print until the weather stinks and I'm inside not by choice.

 

At the same time I was printing after the 6 1/2 week hiatus a friend spent three days almost full time unclogging his Epson. Late on Sunday afternoon he called and said he might come over so I said sure. Then he said he was coming to kill me in frustration after he found out I had my printing done.

 

And yes, I do think I'm lucky but not about printers. While I'm by no means wealthy and hanging in in middle class, it's more than OK. I can still think and see so there it is.

 

Conni