Mamiya & vs. Hassy X-Pan

[anthony_de_cristofaro]

I am considering getting into a more panoramic format and my research

indicates that the Mamiya 7 has a 35mm panoramic adapter. I am

comparing it to the Hasselblad XPan and have a few questions.

 

Does anyone know about filter use with either camera and have advice

or pointers? I assume the Mamiya 7 will accept the P-series Cokin

filters I use with my Hasselblad 503. However, will the X-Pan give

me any vignetting problems with the same filters (especially

graduated ND filters on landscapes)?

 

What about lens quality? I know Fuji makes the camera for

Hasselblad. Do they make the lenes as well? How do the Fuji (or

other maker) lenses for the X-Pan compare with the lenses for the

Mamiya lenses?

 

Has anyone heard if Hasselblad is considering a 35mm panoramic insert

for its' 120 bodies?

[chris___10]

I would go with the X-Pan. It will be cheaper overall then the Mamiya, and since you already have a Hasselblad 503, you don't need another camera to shoot MF with. The x-pan will give you panaramic or regualar 35 for a better price. I have heard that the lenses on the blad are outstanding! As for using the filters, a graduated ND filter is going to be really hard to use on both of these cameras since neither of them are SLR's. They are both viewfinder cameras where the viewfinder is seperate from the picture taking lens. You can put the filter on the lens, but you won't really know where to place it accuratly since you can't see its effect.

[jim_chow]

The XPAN is made by Fuji. In Japan, it's called the Fuji TX-1. Everything is the same, except it has wood grips and and a natural titanium finish...oh, it does cost hundreds of $$ less because it says Fuji rather than Hasselblad on it. :-)

[Spearhead]

Let's try answering all the questions.

 

Square filter systems cause problems with rangefinders. The filter system is visible in, and in some cases interferes with, the rangefinder and viewfinder. Even the smaller Cokin is a problem. Vignetting won't be a problem if you can get by the other problems. If you are working in a slow and controlled environment, you can probably take the filter on and off, but it seems like a lot of work.

 

Although some people use ND filters with rangefinders, it's fairly difficult.

 

Lens quality of both cameras is just fine. No-one is going to say "You should've used x instead" with either of these cameras.

 

Now regarding which camera to buy - unless you are severely cramped space-wise or addicted to automatic wind, I can't see any reason not to buy the M7 (and there are ways around the cost issue.) I can't even see any reason not to use 120/220 in the M7 all the time, even for panoramics, since the image size is the same as in 35mm when cropped to pano format, but you get the opportunity to have full 6x7 format photographs on the same roll. With 220, you can get 20 shots, panoramic or not.

 

One more recommendation on both these cameras - if you haven't used rangefinders before, rent one first. Some people don't get comfortable with it.

[j.martin___]

I thought Chris had a good point in suggesting taking into account what other equipment you already have. I opted for the Mamiya in part because I did not already have an MF camera. That said, another factor is how much panoramic you are going to do. If the answer is a lot, you might be concerned about the panoramic markings in the Mamiya 7 viewfinder, which are not the easiest things to work with in terms of framing your panoramic shots.

[lennart_estrvm]

X-pan seems to be the choice for you. The Fuji-lenses are excellent and the camera is wonderful to hold, like a Leica, with great precision in focusing and aperture-setting. The shutter is quiet and the total performance is just great!

[_____]

The XPan/TX-1 is a fair bit wider than the Leica M6. In fact, I was surprised at how much bigger it was than the M6 when I had a chance to hold one. It is almost the size of a Mamiya 7 except that the XPan/TX-1 is a little shorter. Considering that you are already familiar with medium format in the form of a Hasselblad I would urge you to consider the Mamiya 7. Unless there are emulsions that are only available in the 35mm format that you can't live without, shooting 120/220 allows you to crop down to a 35mm panoramic format anyway. And even then there is always the 35mm adapter for the Mamiya for such emulsions. The XPan/TX-1 is currently limited to two lenses. The Mamiya gives you an increased film area should you decide to shoot 'normal', not pano. With the XPan/TX-1, you are limited to 24X36mm for these occasions. Also, it is not discreet like the Leica M6. And as long as that is true, you may as well carry the one that can ensure you a larger film area. That said, Fuji makes nice lenses and if you're tired of the pedestrian black of the XPan, the Fuji TX-1 is available in titanium grey with a fetching wooden grip and similarly finished lenses in Asia.

 

That said, familiarity with medium format and the way you worked with it, an increased film area, and flexibility would lead me to choose the Mamiya 7 instead.

[kenny_c.]

If you do your own darkroom, the Fuji 6x9 or equivalents could be a very good panorama cameras. Just crop to get 1:3 ratio photo. It has advantage over the X-PAN and M7 with 35 adapter is that you could push your subject up (or down), kind of shift, to have your film plane parallelled to your subject. Do not lock in panorama only camera.

The use is limitted. just a thought.

[jeffrey_scott]

I may be getting into this discussion a little late since I have just recently found out about this forum, but I borrowed an X-PAN from a customer of mine and found it to be a piece of trash! She only had the camera a few months but it looked like it had been through a war. The rangefinder would not focus to infinity, some screws were missing, the self-timer wouldn't work, both the 45mm and 90mm lenses severely vignetted and a lot of the black finish was already worn off. If it were marketed as a Fuji for say $1000.00 for the whole system this might be excusable; as a Hasselblad it is an embarrasment.

[Spearhead]

The last comment is, of course, a statistically insignificant single sample. By the same logic, I could claim quite the opposite by mentioning that a noted Mexican photographer used the XPAN for shooting the hurricane devastation in Central America last year, hardly a lightweight environment to be in, and his camera was in excellent working condition. This comment, while true, is as meaningless as the above comment.

 

I still don't know why anyone except someone using primarily 35mm would get the XPAN instead of the M7, or why anyone would use the panoramic attachment in the M7 instead of cropping roll film.

[janm]

What about scanning? There are still no good affordable medium format scanners, but my HP S20 PhotoSmart scans panoramic 35 mm at 2400 dpi.

 

/Jan

[hil_niloy1]

Mamiya needs the dedicated viewfinder for any lens other than

the 80mm or the 65mm. You also don't get as good wide angle

lens compared to the Xpan. Not quite practical if your

main objective is panorama. It's also bigger and more $$$.

 

Other than that, you are to choose between the two dual formats:

120/6x7 + 135/24mm x 65mm; or 135/24x35mm + 135/24mm x 65mm.

 

The XPAN's low quality back was true on the early release.

Hasselblad has fixed the problem and has free replacement.

Anyone has this problem can call Hasselblad for details. (No,

I don't work for Hasselblad, but I got my replacement).

 

According to the Hasselblad Manual, Hasselblad has dicontinued

their special order item A2035 (or A3520?): the back that gives vertical 24mm x 54mm on a 35mm film). XPAN is their answer for

the requirements. I'd assume Hasselblad will not consider the

135mm insert.

[anthony_de_cristofaro]

Hil brings up an interesting item -- the special order/discontinued A2035 back. Does anyone have one of these for sale used that you don't use anymore? I would be a good prospect! Then I would not need another camera and set of lenses...