graham_martin2 Posted May 28, 2007 Author Share Posted May 28, 2007 You certainly are right about what you can do with a $1,000. I did some pricing at KEH on a Mamiya 645e plus accesories and here is what I came up with. Would appreciate any comments as to what I should add or delete. Thanks 1) 645 E BODY WITH 120 INSERT MEDIUM FORMAT CAMERA BODY EX+ $275.00 2) 220 INSERT EX $14.00 3) 45 F2.8 (77) MANUAL FOCUS WIDE ANGLE LENS BGN $149.00 4) FRONT 77 SNAP-ON CAP EX $12.00 5)BEATTIE INTENSCREEN PLUS WITH GRID (SUPER, PRO), BGN $45.00 6) 645 E INSTRUCTION BOOK EX $14.00 7)AE PRISM N (SUPER) BGN $84.00 8) SV AE REFLEX FINDER FK402 (PRO) BGN $79.00 Total Amount: $672.00 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelly_hughes Posted May 28, 2007 Share Posted May 28, 2007 Pentax 645 is the answer to both your concerns. It's the only MF system (afaik) that has mirror dampening to reduce mirror slap making it more handholdable than the competition. See <a href="http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/645-mlu.shtml">this page</a>. Cost-wise, the first gen 645 (manual focus only) is around $300 used on ebay, usually including a 75mm 2.8 lens, often in great condition, and other lenses are more affordable than the other brands like Mam, Hassy, etc. All the Pentax 645 lenses are reputed to be great optical and build quality, and typically are around $150 or under. You truly can get a decent kit together with a couple of lenses for around $600. They also have Program mode to behave more like a 35mm, and not all the other brands have that. In all likelihood, you could even get a 645N kit together and have autofocus on one of the two lenses for under $1000, but those cameras don't come up as often as the first-gen 645. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert meier Posted May 28, 2007 Share Posted May 28, 2007 Graham, You can save some money by not buying the AE prism or the SV AE prism, since the 645E has its own built-in prism that is non-interchangeable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
william_f._goins1 Posted May 28, 2007 Share Posted May 28, 2007 I have a Mamiya 645, Mamiya 7 II, a Nikon F100, Nikon F5, and a Canon P&S digital. I shot some 6x7 chromes in Switzerland last October that are stunning! I had 11x14 Cibachromes printed, and you wouldn't believe the quality.35mm is great for sports, kids, parties, some portraits. MF is the best. When digital rivals MF film, I will convert. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graham_martin2 Posted May 28, 2007 Author Share Posted May 28, 2007 So now it's coming down to the Pentax 645 versus the Mamiya 645. Kelly, you are exactly right about eing able to buy a Pentax 645 + 75mm lens for about $300. I found one for right about that price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graham_martin2 Posted May 28, 2007 Author Share Posted May 28, 2007 So now it's coming down to the Pentax 645 versus the Mamiya 645. Kelly, you are exactly right about being able to buy a Pentax 645 + 75mm lens for about $300. I found one for right about that price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graham_martin2 Posted May 28, 2007 Author Share Posted May 28, 2007 So far as lenses are concerned, can one buy leaf shutter lenses for use on the Pentax 645? If so, does that mean I have an effectively faster flash sync speed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bryn_evans Posted May 28, 2007 Share Posted May 28, 2007 Whats up with Bronica ETRS? Its very popular and reasonably priced the lenses are great too. The later ETRSi has MLU and it flash syncs at all speeds with its leaf shutters. Ive been steadily building up a kit from ebay bargains and Ive become a big fan of medium format. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graham_martin2 Posted May 28, 2007 Author Share Posted May 28, 2007 In looking at the Bronica, which I liked for the reasons you mention, I see that they are priced higher on KEH than Pentax. Right now this would be an exploratory purchase and so I don't want to spend over $1,000, but $400-$500 would make me happier. If you look on eBay, Mamiya is second only to Hasselblad in terms of number of cameras and parts (986) compared to only 216 for Bronica. Of course, Pentax only had 162 listings. It was based on accesory availability that I was drawn to the Mamiya. However, the Pentax does have somewhat of a price advantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a_petkov Posted May 28, 2007 Share Posted May 28, 2007 unless you have a dedicated scanner to scan with, 645 will not be a huge improvement over your current equipment. You should try 6x6 or 6x7 to really see the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david_henderson Posted May 28, 2007 Share Posted May 28, 2007 "unless you have a dedicated scanner to scan with, 645 will not be a huge improvement over your current equipment. You should try 6x6 or 6x7 to really see the difference." Strange maths. 645 is 3x the size of 35mm. 67 is about 60% bigger than 645. 645 is a great improvement on 35mm and a jump well worth making if thats what you want to carry/pay for and if you want a camera that handles more like a 35mm. As it happens I use 6x6 and 67- but thats because I prefer those image formats not because 645 isn't a worthwhile jump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seragram Posted May 28, 2007 Share Posted May 28, 2007 If I was you I buy a used medium format like a Pentas 645 or 6x7 and shoot some landscapes with it and compare it to your digital cameras and report back. IF not satisfied just sell it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graham_martin2 Posted May 28, 2007 Author Share Posted May 28, 2007 You know, I think I am over analyzing this. Time to just do it. I am going to buy that Pentax 645 because of the price. If I like the results, but maybe find in the future that I would like one with different features then I can probably sell it for close to what I paid for it. Thanks Sergio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Ingold Posted May 28, 2007 Share Posted May 28, 2007 The Pentax 645 does not have interchangeable backs - one of the prime reasons to go to medium format. The focal plane shutter has extremely limited utility with electronic flash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robert lee Posted May 28, 2007 Share Posted May 28, 2007 "Strange maths. 645 is 3x the size of 35mm ... 645 is a great improvement on 35mm" I agree with Anastas actually. Graham mentioned that his current kit includes a D200; 645 on a cheap scanner will produce noticeably inferior images relative to this. That extra film area on 6x7 really does help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graham_martin2 Posted May 28, 2007 Author Share Posted May 28, 2007 Oh well, I just bought a Pentax 645 on eBay. I got it at a reasonable price. If I don't like it I will just put it back for auction. However, I do see that one can get both 120 and 220 backs from KEH. Wouldn't that make it interchangeable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg_jones1 Posted May 28, 2007 Share Posted May 28, 2007 With all due respect to Ken Rockwell, don't listen or be overly influenced by his reviews. He is but one person who has his opinions. Generally I agree with pretty much all of his conclusions. However, I recall reading his review of the Mamiya 7 and there was whining about the size of the rear lens cap. Boy, now that is something to base a purchasing decision on..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graham_martin2 Posted May 29, 2007 Author Share Posted May 29, 2007 Rockwell's review was, as usual, mixed. While he did complain about the cheap feel of the Mamiya 7, he also said that it was a great camera and that he had won a trip to Hawaii with a picture he had taken with that camera. Poor old Ken, everyone has an opinion of him. Personally I find his reviews quite helpful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wing8 Posted May 30, 2007 Share Posted May 30, 2007 There are other range finders, Fuji's GA 645's are auto focus and auto exposure. They're cool cameras but I like my Fuji GW670II, slows me down a bit but that can be a good thing too. I love digital too, but it is the reason I can finally afford a MF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yuri_huta Posted May 30, 2007 Share Posted May 30, 2007 "Oh well, I just bought a Pentax 645 on eBay. I got it at a reasonable price. If I don't like it I will just put it back for auction. However, I do see that one can get both 120 and 220 backs from KEH. Wouldn't that make it interchangeable?" Welcome the Pentax 645 world Graham. While you can get 120 and 220 backs, there is no dark slide (or counter) to use to switch the backs. With the low cost (relative) of these bodies, I just picked up some more bodies for when I want to shoot other types of film. I have picked up some 645n bodies in rough shape and sent them to Pentax for repair (includes calibrating shutter and meter) for a reasonable amount. There are many nice lenses out there for reasonable prices if you wait and watch. One thing to keep in mind is that you can use Pentax 67 lenses on your 645 body by way of an adapter. I have one of these and use my Pentax 67 35mm fisheye lense on my 645n body (as well as 6x7 body). I plan on getting some more 67 series lenses, so that I can use them on both the 6x7 body and 645 bodies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graham_martin2 Posted May 30, 2007 Author Share Posted May 30, 2007 So does this mean that with the Pentax 645 I have to use up all the film before changing inserts unlike other makes where you can change mid-stream? Is there an advantage of Pentak 67 lenses over 645s? Also do the 645 lenses come in both manual focus and auto-focus like a 35mm SLR? Why aren't the lenses interchangeable between 645 and 67 in the same way that a Nikon lens can be used on a whole variety of models without an adapter? I'm not knocking the Pentax system. I am just trying to learn the differences between the two formats. Is there any kind of adapter that will let me use my Nikon lenses on the Pentax camera? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gregory_c Posted May 31, 2007 Share Posted May 31, 2007 Do not buy the Mamiya 645E, there is no way to tell if you have a 120 roll or a 220 roll. The The Pentax 645 insert is actually part of the back of the camera and you can see the film length written on the insert. I had the 645E, used it at 1 wedding and sold it. About not being able to change film backs, that is not the end of the world, I have a Hasselblad 501 & almost never swap backs mid-roll, just plan ahead, shoot & 120 rolls. I own a Pentax 645 manual focus & love it. Get the Pentax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adrian_wilson6 Posted June 2, 2007 Share Posted June 2, 2007 Hi Graham, You must by now be exhausted with the replies, however I would not recommend MF for weddings, the gear is just to heavy and the facilities for " Action " photography do not exist with MF. Having said that if you are interested I would look at the Bronica ETRSi. As regards scanning an Epson flatbed takes a hell of a lot of beating, for price any quality of output, special film holders are available to enhance the scanner and are not to expensive. Hope this helps. Kind Regards, Adrian. P.S. I have had Imacon and a Nikon LS 8000 but would without hesitation recommend an Epson flatbed for speed and performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graham_martin2 Posted June 2, 2007 Author Share Posted June 2, 2007 Thanks Adrian I went ahead and biught a Pentax 645 manual focus including a 75mm lens for under $400. It only has had 10 rolls of film through it so it is virtually brand new. I'm just now running my first roll of 220 film through it. The Bronica was also one that I had been considering, but the price on this one seemed a good way to get my feet wet without spending too much. I'm bidding on a 135mm leaf shutter lens, but am not sure yet how to operate the shutter. I'm going to have to see if I can find some instruction somewhere. I have a Canon flatbed scanner that has film and slide holders. I have to go and find them. We moved recently, and things tend to get lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aaron_w1 Posted July 13, 2007 Share Posted July 13, 2007 GrahamLet us know how you get on with the scanning, I have just brought a Mamiya 67 and have not got a scanner yet would like to know how it compares to your D200.Aaron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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