Petition for M8 user selectable lens profiles

[hankg]

Well, Leica seems a bit reluctant to provide users with this option. Let's see

how many users would like to see menu selectable lens profiles in a future

firmware update.

 

"The undersigned M8 users respectfully request that Leica include an option for

user selectable lens profiles via the menu as soon as is possible."

 

Sign here:

 

http://www.petitiononline.com/M8menu/petition.html

 

Your email will remain private, even from me. Might be a good idea to put your

country in the comments field.

[vivek iyer]

I hope they will do it. With this option, they can do away with the barcode reader in the M mount and the coding business. Would make everything cheaper as well.

[35mmdelux]

great idea.

[markdemeny]

I added my name.

 

It seems like it should be an easy thing to do - with my D200 it's *very* easy to set this information. I think that's part of the appeal of the M platform - they have a good ecosystem with plenty of lenses by other companies to appeal to all budgets and needs. The fact that Leica is trying to lock things in a bit is concerning - especially when they don't make all lenses for all uses (a 15mm, for example)

 

I don't use my 'user profiles' for anything (there aren't a ton of options I need to quickly swap in/out) - I figure user selectable lens profiles would be a good candidate for that.

[jose_angel]

Is there any similar way to ask Nikon for a FF pro-level camera? (D3X, D300 or whatever)

[jose_angel]

Sorry. I see how it works. I have been driven by my frustration.

[jose_angel]

Moderator, please delete my <i>stupid and sterile</i> posts.

[doug herr]

Maybe I'm missing something - what's the purpose of user-selectable lens profiles? Is it to avoid putting the code on your existing lenses?

[hankg]

"Maybe I'm missing something - what's the purpose of user-selectable lens profiles? Is it to avoid putting the code on your existing lenses?"

 

Some lenses cannot be coded (that includes all non-Leica lenses). In addition coding costs $150. per lens and takes at least 3 weeks.

 

Before the IR problem became known 6-bit coding was an added feature that you could purchase if you desired, not a requirement. Now that we know the effect of cyan shift on wide angle lenses it has become a requirement to overcome a shortcoming of the camera. That being the case I think it's only right that Leica restore the situation to 6-bit being a convenient option to those that want it and can afford it.

[stuart_richardson]

That (which is 125 dollars per lens, plus shipping and being without the lens for weeks), as

well as the ability to use the vignetting reduction and cyan fringing correction with lenses

other than those made by Leica...like Zeiss and Voigtlander lenses...or older unsupported

Leica lenses for that matter.

[doug herr]

OK, I can understand the desire to avoid coding the lens. For non-Leica lenses and the older lenses that can't be coded, you have to <I>have</I> a lens profile before you can select it. I doubt Leica will provide the profiles for older unsupported lenses, or for Zeiss or C/V lenses. Might be better to ask DXO to create the profile and apply the profile at the RAW conversion stage. You sure won't get Leica to provide lens profiles for other-manufacturer lenses. I'll bet DXO charges something for their software though.

[fjords]

lens coding is and analog solution to a digital problem. a symptom of old school brains

trying to grasp an elusive digital reality. Menu lens selection, yehh a difficult solution for

those who couldn't even see the infra red in the spectum.

[fjords]

or for those who can spell:)) spectrum

[stuart_richardson]

Doug -- I don't think people are expecting Leica to offer profiles for the non-Leica or older

Leica lenses. The reason it is still important, however, is that Leica's profiles closely match

what you would need for the non-Leica lens. For example, the vignetting and cyan fringing of

the 21mm Elmarit ASPH is very similar to the vignetting and cyan fringing of the 21mm

Biogon. So if you tell the camera that your biogon is an elmarit, then you will have corrections

that are very good. If you don't, then you will have dramatic cyan fringing and some

vignetting.

[doug herr]

Stuart, I agree that Leica ought to allow manual lens profile selection, even if the profiles were only a good fit with current Leica lenses. I suspect the suitability of the 21mm ASPH's profile for the 21mm Biogon is a fortunate coincidence. Didn't DxO or maybe someone else offer a DIY lens profile creation kit? I'd think something like that would be more generally applicable than coincidental near-matches to existing profiles.

[stephen_w.]

"...the vignetting and cyan fringing of the 21mm Elmarit ASPH is very similar to the vignetting and cyan fringing of the 21mm Biogon."

 

But not when using a Super Angulon, correct? Other than this comment, I don't have a horse in this race.

[hankg]

"Didn't DxO or maybe someone else offer a DIY lens profile creation kit? I'd think something like that would be more generally applicable than coincidental near-matches to existing profiles."

 

DXO needs the aperture information, which is not supplied by the M8. The existing profiles can serve as "generic" profiles for non-supported lenses. You pick the one that gives the best result. If it takes care of 80 or 90% of the cyan-shift you'll be OK. The rest would be correctable in photoshop if you wanted further correction. But for wide angles, especially ultra-wides without any in camera corrections the cyan shift can be so severe as to make the files useless.

[doug herr]

"<I>DXO needs the aperture information, which is not supplied by the M8.</I>"

<P>

Not to be argumentative, but wouldn't this also be true of Leica's profiles?

[stuart_richardson]

Cyan fringing and the digital vignetting from the sensor remain more or less constant

regardless of aperture, so they do not require the aperture to correct it.

[doug herr]

Sounds like an opportunity for an enterprising photographer/programmer: custom profiles for any lens that will fit the M8.

[hankg]

"Not to be argumentative, but wouldn't this also be true of Leica's profiles?"

 

I don't know. The M8 does have an idea what aperture you are using but does not put that info in the EXIF. Vignetting changes with aperture but I have no idea how Leica dealt with this.

[larry_kincaid1]

The M8 can only take whatever information is in the bar code for each lens. There is no aperture information in there, so none can be passed on to the camera. It executes aperture priority by simply reading the light meter and adjusting the shutter speed electronically. Inexcusable to use physical coding when the user can simply select a lens from a menu on the screen. Does this suggest I should get the Zeiss 25mm lens rather than its 21mm lens?

[doug herr]

"<I>Inexcusable to use physical coding when the user can simply select a lens from a menu

on the screen.</I>"

<P>

I disagree. When you consider the number of possible lens profiles to choose from it's much

quicker and simpler to rely on the bar codes.

[hankg]

"Inexcusable to use physical coding when the user can simply select a lens from a menu on the screen."

 

"I disagree. When you consider the number of possible lens profiles to choose from it's much quicker and simpler to rely on the bar codes."

 

The much easier and more reliable option of automatically reading the 6-bit code would remain for those who have lenses that are coded. We are talking about one additional menu choice for the many who have one or more lenses that can't be coded or that they choose not to code:

 

1. Lens detection on

2. Lens detection off

3. Manual -select lens profile from a sub-menu

[t_nu_tamm]

Larry, M8 probably estimates the aperture by comparing the readings from it's TTL and

external (blue dot) lightmeter, there is no reason why it would not work with third party

lenses, only when camera could knew their focal lengths...