Leica to discontinue reflex line?

[terry_m1]

A Leica shooter/friend of mine on the east coast told me last night that, while

he was recently at the Leica Gallery and other places, he heard that the new

leaders at Leica in Solms will be discontinuing manufacturing reflex cameras

and lenses in order to bring the company back to profitability. Has anybody

else heard this?

[richie chishty]

April 1?

[35mmdelux]

Cut off nose to spite face? Not yet.

[skip_williams]

It seems likely, especially with the DMR now discontinued. I can't see them continuing to pour money into the R rathole. It's plausible that they would migrate some of the Leica R lens design and technology to another lens mount. Maybe some of the lenses will be appropriate for the 4/3 mount and they'll appear in that guise?

[albert knapp md]

Say it aint so, leica !!

[stuart_richardson]

I have heard the opposite...that they are going to bring out a full frame R DSLR. In any case,

the M8, all its problems aside, has been a huge sales success and Leica is in its best financial

situation in years. But, like you, this is all hearsay, albeit from people who have always been

right about what they have told me about the goings on at Leica.

[stuart_richardson]

Rereading what you said though, I would not be surprised if they suspended production for

awhile. They may have enough R lenses and bodies around for the moment that they can

stop production and wait for them to sell out. If they bring out another body it will sell more

lenses and they can start up again. This would not surprise me at all....stopping production

to clear a backlog is very different from discontinuing an entire line...especially when they

have all the R&D and manufacturing done.

[len_smith]

Stuart Richardson wrote:

 

> In any case, the M8, all its problems aside, has been a huge sales success and Leica is in its best financial situation in years.

 

Where on earth did you hear that? Or is it what you would like to believe?

 

It is difficult to believe that the M8 has been anything but a financial disaster for Leica. The recall, the "free" UV/IR filters and the ongoing intensive development work will all cost Leica big bucks.

 

Hopefully, once all the problems have been sorted out, Leica can settle down to selling and supporting a great many M8 bodies and enjoying a bottom line that is no longer red. But it may be some months before the beta testing program can be convincingly claimed as having ended.

[jerry_kirkwood]

I thought it was beyond insane if Leica planned to continue the R line, that they announced the discontinuing of the DMR without introducing a replacement or even confirming there will be one. But Leica's decisions have never followed common business logic and neither, so it seems, do most of their customers. The reason Jenoptics stated for renegging on the Sinar deal was that Leica had uncertain leadership, and that does appear to be the case.

[stuart_richardson]

Tony -- that is what the dealers I have talked to have said (more than one). That the amount

of sales of the

M8, the 28mm f/2.8 ASPH and other lenses has far outweighed the cost of the recalled

bodies and the UV/IR filters. Frankly, I would like them to be in a good financial situation, but

I don't have any reason to lie or make this up. It is just what I have been told by people I

trust. If it is wrong, then that's unfortunate but I am not going to lose any sleep over it.

[35mmdelux]

Although camera sales have increased by a fair margin, first-half fiscal year 2007 shows substantial negative cash flows. The operations side (sales) shows positive cash flows, but investing and financing activities are in the tank.

 

http://www.leica-corporate.com/assets/file/download.php?filename=cp_file_1579.pdf

[blakley]

<i>It is difficult to believe that the M8 has been anything but a financial disaster for Leica.</i><p>

The dealers I've talked to have said that the increase in sales of M lenses has been very significant and that M8s continue to be sold as fast as they can be stocked. This hints at a strong financial benefit from the introduction to the M8 - the report Paul cites is not "first-half fiscal year 2007" but rather "first-half fiscal year 2006/2007", and was issued in September 2006 - long before any financial effect of the M8 started to be felt. The next half-year results (which I guess should be out very soon) should give better evidence, but I wouldn't be surprised if we have to wait for the September 2007 report before we can begin to assess the M8's financial impact.

[terry_m1]

I have an R7 and an R8. I also have the 19mm (latest), 24mm, 28mm PC, 35mm Summicron, 50mm Summicron, 60mm Macro, 80mm, 90mm (latest), 100mm APO, 135mm, 180mm APO, 280mm APO, old 350mm Telyt, and old 400mm Telyt lenses as well as both APO extenders and several zoom lenses. I use these and my R8 far much more than my M6 TTL. Even though I do not need any more focal lengths on the reflex side, I wouldn't hesitate to replace some of the old lenses if Leica, continuing to produce its reflex line, could reduce its prices greatly and produce new versions of them. Unfortunately, Leica's continuation in pricing its products so high still prevents millions of people around the world from being able to buy its cameras and lenses new. In the latest Leica News brochure I got a few weeks ago, new CEO Steven Lee says "We are thinking about serving even more customers. Think of the expansion of the system as an expanded product line that will contain new camera bodies, lenses and accessories to broaden Leica's reach and impact." Yet, he fails to indicate how the heck he is going to accomplish his goals successfully with German employees' high wages and salaries and Leica's existing costly price structuring. I think of Jim Morrison singing "Strange Days" when I consider the lack of details in Lee's statements.

[35mmdelux]

Bob, in financial accounting, "first-half fiscal year 2006/2007" means first half of fiscal year 2007, which is Leica's latest financial report.

 

Leica's fiscal year runs through March 30. So, at this time Leica knows the full results of fiscal year 2007. They will massage the numbers and should produce the FY 2007 Annual Report within 30 days.

 

 

Have a Nice Day..

[35mmdelux]

There is nothing wrong with fair wages, which may seem high in some countries that offer poor pay scales.

 

The pricing structure is the nix of the issue here.

 

Best - P

[derek_stanton2]

I wish they'd make some Canon-mount SLR lenses....

[Bill Blackwell Images]

The story is that Leica will be introducing a new DSLR line.

 

It would be foolish of them not to utilize their current R lens mount. In any case, at that point, the R9 would likely be discontinued.

[neilambrose]

<p><em><strong>"German employees' high wages and salaries and Leica's existing costly price structuring."</strong><br/>

 

There is nothing wrong with fair wages, which may seem high in some countries that offer poor pay scales. </em></p>

 

<p>Actually, it's the employment costs that are prohibitive. Not the employee salaries, but additional regulatory costs that the employer has to pay on top of salaries (employee insurance, corporate taxes, health care, pension fund). I believe that Germany is currently the most expensive country in the world to run a business that has employees.</p>

[andrew robertson]

"German employees' high wages and salaries and Leica's existing costly price structuring."

 

I thought that a lot of Leica stuff was made in Portugal, which has some of the lowest

average wages in western Europe!

 

Don't they basically build everything in Portugal and then slap the red dots on in Germany,

thus enabling them to put MADE IN GERMANY on the product?

[stephen_w.]

Months ago I asked about local content required to slap a "made in...blank" label on it in the EU and never got a straight answer.

[gary_pinkerton1]

Is discontinued the same as selling all you had manufactured?

Leica is always so tight lipped about stuff, who knows, they may be working on a DMR II, or, as I last heard, the R10.

[35mmdelux]

"Actually, it's the employment costs that are prohibitive... "

 

Huh?

 

"Employment costs," in addition to salaries are part/parcel of fielding a worker. I applaud the Germans for their health care and pension funding, something almost non-existent in the USA today.

[cabophoto]

Neil,

 

>>I believe that Germany is currently the most expensive country in the world to run a business that has employees.

 

you believe, but you don't know...

 

Carsten

[guy_mancuso]

I would not count on Leica discontinuing the leica R line there is much talk on the future of it.

[billc1]

Their biggest costs isn't wages, its the high quality materials they buy. They make the best lenses using the best materials, FYI.