cjbryant Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 Hello everyone. I have a quick question. I have been getting a lot of callslately for dates that I am already booked. I just tell the person who calls thatI am booked and give a few names of people to call. But I have been thinking. What if I use my reputation to get the calls, book thewedding and then hire someone else to shoot it for me and give me the images onCD? Obviously, I would tell the bride that I would not be the one shooting, butI would be the one fulfilling the orders and album. Also, I make an agreementwith the other photographer about the use of the images. Has anyone tried this?If so, has it been successful for you? Thank you for your help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edsel_adams Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 Many of us started out working under this type of arrangement. The big caveat of course is the skill and dependability of your shooters. It's your reputation on the line, and it's you that will get hauled into court. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nancy s. Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 The biggest problem will be finding reliable shooters who will produce YOUR style. Of course, if you hire them as contractors and 1099 them, it is their butt on the line if there is a problem and it goes to court, not yours. I learned this recently. They are a private contractor to whom you have subcontracted the job, and they are ultimately repsonsible. You do need to get them to sign a subcontract agreement. Fact is, if a contract shooter does not produce to your expectations, you actually have the right to withold payment. I heard about this happening.. although the shooter was using equipment provided by the studio and the equipment failed due to poor maintenance etc. Even so, the studio had the right to not pay the contractor as the product produced was inadequate and the money had to be returned to the client. This studio sub contracts a LOT of work and then 1099's the sub. The owner makes his living this way. So, yes, it can be done. On the other hand, if you hire a shooter as an employee, which requires you to withhold taxes etc. per a W2 arrangement, then it is your company on the line in the case of a suit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott levine Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 Before you dive in to a pool of headaches, you may want to consider dropping your first three packages and adding one more at a higher price. This way you can make a living without feeling restless every-time someone call for a date that is already booked. It is about quality not quantity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_h.1 Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 "Of course, if you hire them as contractors and 1099 them, it is their butt on the line if there is a problem and it goes to court, not yours." Whoa! Hang on minute. Be careful here. Many believe that if you label a hiree working for you as an "independent contractor" or issue a 1099 to them, that means the hiree is automatically an independent contractor. Not so. The determination of whether someone is an independent contractor or an employee is based on a continuum of factors that tend to either show the hiree acts under the control of the hiring person or that the hiree acts mostly independently. If most factors show control, then the hiree is much more likely to be an employee. The hiring person can face huge problems if they did not get workers compensation and unemployment insurance, collect taxes ect. ect. Many learn this the hard way and it can be extremly costly when this happens. And, yes, your "butt will be on the line". Consult an attorney for your jurisdiction about advice on whether the situation you envision amounts to an employment relationship or as an independent contractor matter. Of course, you could make hirees employees but that can be burdensome. Another issue to watch out for is to be sure its clear in your contract that sustitutes are allowed and that the results of their shooting are likely to be different than yours. Photography is a very subjective art and people often hire photographers for their style and unique abilities. Again, rely on a lawyer to give you advice on these issues before you engage in them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Michael Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 Our company employs photographers (and assistants). I have absolutely no idea what the legal technicalities for `subcontracting`; `hiring; or ` employing` are in your area, as I assume you are located in the USA. But as general advice to your question, the key issues requiring consideration are: 1. The technicalities re above, regarding responsibilities and entitlements. 2. Copyright. 3. Quality of work; the contrasts and comparisons of work and style to yours. 5. Reliability, in all aspects, including quality control, appearance, interpersonal and client skills. 4. Overall cost benefit to your business. You might read: who owns copyright David Blair , feb 01, 2007; 09:57 p.m. (A thread in this forum), it highlights a copyright issue. It might not be specific to your question, but it will give you an idea of the depth of consideration you need to give to the key points (and perhaps other matters also). As lateral thoughts: you might consider a reciprocal arrangement with a network of others in your area, or investigate the potential of and issues with a `finders fee` arrangement. Regards WW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Michael Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 PS: I think Mr Levine makes an excellent lateral thought also, IMO, potentially it has much more on the cost benefit side to your business, than the two other ideas I offered. WW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annealmasy Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 Speak with your CPA about this. There are tax and liability implications in hiring sub- contractors. Make sure you know all the legal ins and outs before you make this move! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_h.1 Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 "if you hire them as contractors and 1099 them, it is their butt on the line if there is a problem and it goes to court, not yours." There is another reason this is not always so. The issue involves your contract with the client. If a photographer obligates themselves to get someone's wedding shot, the photographer is obligated to get it done. It does not matter what status, IC or employee, the actual shooter has. The client contracted with the original photographer, that's who is going to be on the hook unless the terms of the contract shift the responsibility to the other shooter(s). As you can see, it is unwise to rely on advice given by us here. See a lawyer for reliable advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
picturesque Posted February 7, 2007 Share Posted February 7, 2007 This kind of arrangement isn't to be taken casually or lightly, since there are pretty serious consequences all around if something goes wrong. It just isn't a quick and easy way of reeling in more money, so if you are serious about this, do your homework, and be prepared to spend some money just to set up arrangements and cover yourself, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjogo Posted February 8, 2007 Share Posted February 8, 2007 Just "sell" the referral to another photographer ...a finders fee per se. Less headaches and you are out of the loop. I buy weddings ~ paying between 75-400 to fellow photographers.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jayme wier Posted February 8, 2007 Share Posted February 8, 2007 This isn't about subcontracting photographers but... as I was perusing your website, your prices in your bronze and silver packages do not match your price comparison chart. -Jayme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ibdnzgr Posted February 11, 2007 Share Posted February 11, 2007 I've had two brides insist they want to hire me, and both on dates I've already booked. Of all the open dates the entire year!!!!! I have a reliable second shooter, but was concerned about all the issues discussed here. Try these links for some info on copyright and work for hire status. Please give me some feedback, as this is indeed an important issue. http://blog.fotolia.com/us/legal/copyright-law.html http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m4422/is_n4_v11/ai_15312603 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now