mariah_smith Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 Hi, I'm a wedding photographer and just recently got married. Obviously, I was very selective in choosing my photographer. Long story short...I was horribly dissappointed in my pics and learned quite a few things. They seem obvious but my photog. didn't do them and I make sure to now make them a priority. Thought I might share because I just saw a thread that related and realized some fellow photog's may benefit. 1st - make sure to get the guests!!!!! I don't care how "photojournalist" you are. Stop the guest, make them look at the camera and get at least one shot of every guest (or table). 2nd - be creative but most importantly BE FLATTERING! No matter how artsy the couple is, they really want to look good (and they're attendants and guests also). 3rd - don't be afraid to direct. Your clients are not models and will probably feel pretty awkward in front of the camera. Tell people (politely, of course) how and where to be during posed shots. BTW, get a list of the group shots they want and have it ready!!! All seems pretty basic...but I was burned on all (thinking my photog. knew all this and didn't have to discuss it with her) and know there are a lot of beginner's on this site so maybe it'll help and you won't have to deal w/ unhappy clients. For what it's worth... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill_clark___minnetonka_mi Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 Agree. But isn't important to find that out about your photographer before the wedding? How he'd do that? Find out during the interview process? What should you ask the photographer? What should the photographer ask of you? Lots of things to consider before the wedding day. I just wish prospective clients see me first as I could help them with costume, venue and other important considerations for one of the most important day of their lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colleendonovan Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 I think number 1 and 2 contradict themselves. How many guests were at your wedding? What pictures of you and your groom doing your thing would the photographer have missed because she was busy taking a picture (and a flattering one too) of EVERY guest??? I've never seen a flattering table shot. Why did you assume that your photographer knew 'all this' and so didn't discuss it with her?? We can't give a client what they want if they don't ask for it. I'm sorry you are upset, but this post has my adrenaline going. It was your wedding. You should've taken the responsibility of making sure you would get what you wanted. Photographers are not mind readers and while the best photographers probably make sure they have a list of formals, I have not met one yet who has made sure they took a 'flattering' shot of every person at a wedding. It's next to impossible and you really shouldn't have expected it in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt_needham Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 The weddings I shoot usually have several hundred guests. I'm happy to get portraits of family and special friends, but if the B & G needs a portrait of every single guest I'll want to set up a small studio in the corner with a photographer to run it. And charge the client accordingly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_fenger1 Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 I agree with the above, Pictures of every guest is something that you need to tell your photographer. I do my best to capture every guest, but i always ask for a list of important people, i am sure to get good shots of them. I have done weddings where the B/G didn't want me to interact with guests. If its not clarified i don't think a photo of every guest is a requirement, but some pictures of guests defiantly are... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mariah_smith Posted January 4, 2007 Author Share Posted January 4, 2007 I think I may have tried to be too short and didn't explain thorough enough. I didn't think I needed to tell my photographer to take pics of the guests at the table. I figured that was a given. I did tell her that I wanted artistic shots but the way she chose to do that was very unflattering and I thought she would know to try to make the couple and the wedding party look attractive. Her portfolio didn't show the angles she chose to shoot at my wedding (very unflattering). There were about 100 guests but only 10 tables. It should be a given that the photographer goes to each table and tries to get at least one shot with everyone paying attention. There's usually plenty of time while the b&g aren't doing something you need to catch. I guess some clients don't care about pictures of their guests and don't worry about their artistic shots making them look horrible. I was just trying to pass on that in my experience people want record of the loved ones they had present and no matter who you are, you want to look good in your pics. Sometimes, as a photographer it's hard to remember that because you're focused on the b&g and being super creative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ni_gentry Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 I don't understand..... You're a wedding photographer? And when you hire someone for your own wedding, you don't know what the process is? How is that possible? Don't you know that client/photographer communication is key? How much did you talk with him/her about what their style is like and what types of images you wanted, etc...? <p> And I agree, a shot of EVERY guest? C'mon. And there are plenty of photojournalistic shots that are extremely flattering. But table shots are always bad and boring. I only do them when requested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ni_gentry Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 ... another thing with table shots is that I hate photographing people when they're eating. Talk about unflattering. Who wants to be interrupted and photographed with food in their face? And when they're not eating, chances are that a lot of people are up and about dancing, getting drinks, mingling, etc. It's much better to roam around and look for the action then take the boring route of getting table shots. <p>How many weddings have you shot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allen_d. Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 Your post is getting we wound up as well. If you hired a photojournalist, getting each person to "stop and make them look at the camera" is about the least photojournalistic thing you can do. That is very traditional photography and it is something I make clear to each of my prospective clients about the differences between the two. In fact almost everyone that comes to me does not want the shots where the person is just looking at the camera, i.e. table shots. I don't think you were selective enough about choosing your photographer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roxyandkaidotcom Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 You're not gonna get any love here on the table shot issue. Boring shots of people eating is NOT flattering or fun. If you wanted 'em you should have said so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob_s___san_francisco_bay_ Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 I think most photographers cringe at the words "table shot" :-) I'd rather do body shots myself :-) <p> You really should have had a better line of communication going. Just as you would with your own clients, right? <p> Lemme guess, this photographer you hired was... a beginner? a student? cheap? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
william_pride Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 Mariah, I like the advise & agree. I try to get plenty of guest shots. They may not be the "best of", but at least we'll have record of the attendees. Sometimes they make the BEST photos of the night. I like getting shots as they dance or while they are talking. I normally have time to get a half decent shot of everyone (for the most part). Flattering is sometimes hard. I think it depends on the person. Example: If wedding is focused on bride... and bride isn't... well, exactly lady like during the evening. It's tough. I want to focus on her big night, but sometimes the images just aren't FLATTERING. I usually just read the posts but after reading what people said, I kinda felt bad for what people said. Tough Crowd indeed. I'm sure many silent people appreciated it. KP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlene_beckman Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 Ow, I'm sorry about that. When my best friend got married she was also annoyed that the photographer didn't get table shots. Our photographer specifically said that they didn't take table shots unless the B&G specifically asked-- so we did. I think a lot of photographers don't really like taking table shots and it is certainly true that our friends and relations didn't come out as particularly flattering in those table pics, and our photographers probably thought they were terrible art, but we absolutely loved them because they were OUR friends and relations. I think photographers may tend to forget that a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjogo Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 We don't do table shots -- usually the guests are well under 100..and we do get flattering shots of 90+% of the guest. During the cocktail hour we walk around > turn every four guest towards are camera > request them to have their shoulders touching ( depth of field and uniformed exposure perfect ) and kindly ask for a smile--takes less than 30 seconds ~~ to click every fore some. Whatever few people I may have missed, I gather, once they sit for dinning. I have worked crowds of weddings/corporate for 25 years...we find it is expected in our market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramon_albanese Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 I had to put my 2 cents in here, but Ni Gentry took my thunder. Who wants a shot of the table with food hanging out of people's mouths, fingers up the nose, people turning the other way, four or five empty seats with guests missing, etc., etc., etc. Communication with the guests at the table is almost impossible with all of the commotion and noise going on. I don't take photos of tables and I tell the B & G beforehand! I DO tell them though that MANY, MANY photos of the guests WILL be taken, but in other situations, (entering, exiting, the dance floor, etc. etc.), and upon hearing that, the B & G are very happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allen_d. Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 I think you guys just aren't watching closely enough (at least those that think you have to do table shots). If you do, there are moments, that you can catch which presents a candid, not always flattering, but very real "moment" that MOST people enjoy looking at versus a boring straight on shot. That moment takes more work to catch, but is well worth it. I'll attach a couple that show that you can show a image of someone being there without being a cheesy table shot.<div></div> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gary evans Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 In response to Allen's "Real Moments" post, Allen, sometimes get that great "Real Moment" can take way too long. One of the photos you posted is of 2 children, as a father of 2 young boys, and a few thousand frames of them in, I can personally attest to the fact that capturing aesthetically pleasing, candid moments of them can be down right impossible at times. They blink, they turn away from you at the perfect moment, they seem to like clutter (leads to cluttered backgrounds), they don't sit still for a moment, etc. So I would say it's not always possible to catch nice "Real Moments", especially with kids. And sure, people would probably prefer that second shot you posted to a canned table shot. But I can guarantee you that every non-photographer in the world would much rather have the canned table shot of distant cousin Lucy's table than the most artistic shot of cousin Lucy eating her dinner. What do you do if you have a 250 guest wedding? Surely you can't capture great "Real Moments" of even half of them in the limited time you get at the reception... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gary evans Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 BTW Allen, both of your shots are flattering. So they don't really prove your point. I think we can all agree that a flattering candid is nicer than a flattering "smile for the camera" pose... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allen_d. Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 Sorry Gary, I guess I could have picked some less flattering shots!! Yes a big 200+ wedding would prove to be a challenge unless you had a competent partner, which I don't (work alone), and my weddings have yet to be that large. And yes it does take some time for these shots, and often several shots. I even think it's challenging to find that candid moment on guests that are particularly stubborn! Anyway, I just wanted to make the point that you can have a nice shot of someone without them looking directly at the camera. I don't rule out straight shots like those as I have plenty of them, I just don't go looking for them, they find me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mariah_smith Posted January 4, 2007 Author Share Posted January 4, 2007 Woah..I really didn't clearly get across what I was trying to say...and rereading my post I can understand the confusion. I shouldn't have said to get every guest because I didn't mean it (screaming baby in my ear and I should've posted when I could focus more). I was just trying to say "remember the guests". My photog. took exactly 2 pictures of my guests (besides my party and parents). Lesson here is that you should communicate about how many guest pics are wanted...I always assume people want pictures of their guests but I shouldn't have assumed my photographer knew that I did. Also, I meant that you should try to be flattering in your posed pics. My photog. squated and shot up for most of our posed pics and you know how hard that is to pull off without everyone looking huge. And, table shots do usually suck...that was a bad example and yet again the baby stole my concentration :( If I post again it will definitely be when I can focus and the baby's sleeping. Sorry to "wind you all up" I didn't clearly say what I was thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annealmasy Posted January 4, 2007 Share Posted January 4, 2007 I used to go all out trying to get "grip'n'grin" photos of all the guests. And I can't tell you how many guests were so flat-out rude to me. "Excuse me, we're having a conversation here!" or "HELLO, shouldn't you be photographing the bride and groom!" I would usually respond with, "I'm so sorry to have offended you, Bride and Groom just wanted to make sure they had photos of all of their guests." (Which was true.) And you know what? People were STILL rude!!!! (Not everyone, but enough to give me a headache!) So I don't do "grip'n'grins" anymore. I'll ALWAYS take ANY shot someone asks for. But I no longer ask the guests for anything. Now 80% of our guest shots are candid - which I like more anyway. And we may not get EVERY guest, but at least the people we do capture are smiling and happy - not glaring into the camera! ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimstrutz Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 I always do table shots, asked for or not. I try to do them before the meal is served though. Food gets ugly fast. They're not fun to do, but they serve a valid purpose, and some brides expect it is the normal thing to do, so don't bother asking. I also try to get most of the guests in other pictures as well. Some I get to look at me, but most I try to catch in a conversation or activity. I'm figuring that most brides will want to remember who came 30 years later, if not now. Pictures of guests are the most interesting thing in my wedding album. Just who are all those skinny people anyway? :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conraderb Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 Hi Mariah - too bad that you didn't hire me. I'm not joking :-) hopefully your video was better if you had one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbie_caswell Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 I'm with Anne because there is nothing like rude, self important guests to make your head explode after eight back breaking hours. Matt has the best idea. That way it's upon the guests shoulders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjogo Posted January 5, 2007 Share Posted January 5, 2007 We generally shoot film--so every ~not so perfect candid~ is wasted money. We setup every " candid moment"--<div></div> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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