Indoor photographs at Christmas

[kentigern]

I've recently bought a late model M3 + a 1980's 50mm Summicron and I'd like to

take some indoor shots this Christmas with it - predominantly indoors, under

artificial light, of the family opening presents, playing party games, drinking,

eating etc. etc.

 

I've already put about four films through it and have been really rather

disappointed with the results: I don't know whether it was me, the camera

needing some adjustment, the film stock (admittedly out-of-date Kodak print

film) or the exposure. I've got an old Gossen Bisix 2 lightmeter, but am not

convinced it's giving me the right readings (currently suggesting 1/250th at F4

400asa for my study after dark with the main 60w light on).

 

Can someone please suggest some rule-of-thumb exposure settings that I can use

as a reference point - the available sites on the internet that I've looked at

seem to suggest 1/30 at F2 for 400asa film - is this borne out by experience?

[bs]

I think that it's decidedly closer to what I've seen personally. I mean if you're metering off a sheet of bright white paper directly under the light source you might see a reading that high, but on average I feel fortunate to get 1/30 @ 2.8-4 with a single shaded 60 watt light source at a few feet.

 

Good luck with the holiday pics and Merry Christmas.

[pablito_pistola]

Yes, for the lighting conditions you describe at ISO 400 my guess would be 1/30 at f2 or

2.8 depending on how close your subject is to the light source. And color neg film can

take a good amount of overexposure.

[michael s.]

1/250 is certainly way too fast, David.

 

With an f/2.8 lens mounted in what I suspect is similar light, I've tried 1/30 and even 1/15 -- all while knocking on wood, etc. And at that my photos show both some subject motion and camera-shake, but (i)I'm far from the world's steadiest shooter; (ii)sometimes I like the blur; and (iii)I often like the darkness.

 

Much depends upon how close your subject is to that 60w light source, too.

 

Though you didn't ask, color cast is another issue to consider if that's color print film you're using. You can filter for it (but again at the expense of more light loss that you cannot afford there), use b & w film, or use a chromogenic b & w 400 speed film. Both Ilford and Kodak make that film. Or you can do what I've sometimes done -- shoot the 400 color film that you have with the expectation that you'll later convert to b & w if you get a keeper.

[michael s.]

I was typing while the person above was posting, so I see that some of my suggestions are redundant.

 

One more thing, and if it's so elementary as to be insulting I'll apologize in advance: I've done better at these slower speeds when I've steadied the camera, or myself, on something that's not moving.

[kentigern]

Thanks for your responses already. I should have mentioned that I'll be using black and white - either HP5 or Rollei 400asa. Oh, and no flash either.

[carbon_dragon]

Well if you have another light meter, try comparing. If not, try calibrating with the sunny 16 rule. Go outside on a sunny day and see if it comes out f16 at about 1/ISO of the film. If not, then the meter either needs new batteries or it might have a tired selenium cell. Now in my experience, no 2 meters every read exactly the same.

 

with ISO 400 film, typically I find I can get comfortable exposures inside with my leicas, but that's not as exact as the sunny 16 rule, or better another meter to compare. Meters are pretty cheap too, so it wouldn't hurt to have a spare. Any other camera you have that can show you exposure settings world work to compare to too.

[stephen_jones4]

Somewhere between 1/30 at f2 and a 1/15 was what I always worked to with a 60watt bulb lighting the scene (in either case, people may well move...)- so I agree with above. Note that 400 speed b+w film tends to be better rated a little slower if you like shadow detail. Also, light fall off is rapid (distance to light source squared) so it can be quite dark in the corners of a room. Also, change your light bulbs to energy saving ones - that way you can have 100 watt brightness for only 15watts. Ho Ho!

[thomas_sullivan]

you will see a chart called "Exposure Value Chart" from which you will be looking for the lighting situation that most resembles what you will be shooting in. When you find that, write down the EV number. My guess you are probably talking about an EV of 5.

 

A little further down the page you will see a chart called "Exposure Factor Relationship Chart B". Find the Column with the ISO you will be using.....400 is what you said....and then go down the Column to an EV of 5. Then follow that Row over to the column with your Aperture up top....let's say it's f/2.8....the two intercect at 1/15 sec shutterspeed. Personally I'd push the film to 800 (but then I do my own B&W developing so it don't cost any extra) to get that 1/30 sec shutterspeed.<br><br>anyhow.........<a href="http://www.fredparker.com/ultexp1.htm"><u>The Ultimate Exposure Computer</u></a> by Fred Parker.

[leica ron]

I've found that due to the 'heft' of the camera, my M3 appears more stable at 1/15th than my M6 feels.

 

I've been pleasantly surprised by the good results shooting at f2 at 1/15th with my M3.

[bs]

I'm not sure how you feel about processing, but I usually run my HP5 at 800 or 1600 and have it proccessed into positives for scanning by dr5. HP5 @ 800 in dr5 is wonderful and scans beautifully.

 

Check them out www.dr5.com

 

No affiliation other than being a very happy customer.

[billc1]

Here is my 2 cents: Use fuji film for indoor color shots. Change your light bulbs to the Reveal type. They produce more of a whiter light. For as light meters go sounds like your model is ok. Kodak is more yellowish and if it has expired get rid of it.

[jtk]

Shoot color neg 800ei. EIGHT HUNDRED. Forget tungsten Vs daylight, you'll easily fix it with Photoshop or your lab will. Forget the meter, since you don't trust it. It'll just confuse you.

 

Shoot everything at f2/30 where things are bright enough to read the newspaper without too much discomfort and most shots will look great. If you can't hold 50 steady at 1/30, you're too well lubricated.

 

The smart thing would be to shoot a roll in advance, process and print, see what works. Find a Walmart or Walgreens or...

[jtk]

Shoot color neg, even if you want B&W prints. It sounds like you're not yet experienced enough to confidently use B&W film for the situation, if you consider it important.

[g-man1]

Perhaps you can use a digicam to take some test shots and test the exposure?

[Uhooru]

Well for sure your old meter sux. Don't use it. The 2-4 at 1/30 or so is more in the range with 400 speed film.

[mitchell_kirschner]

You've received a lot of good advice above.

 

Just a quick note about metering. I'm not familiar with your meter model or your prior experience with a handheld meter, but metering is a skill unto itself. If you metered very close to the light source, especially in "reflective" mode, you will get a reading that's way too "fast". That's because meters by themselves are single-minded and stupid. They want to reduce everything to middle grey (the color of a grey card). My advice is to read up on handheld metering technique. It will pay off when using your M3, as well as enable you to better assess the accuracy of your existing meter.

 

Good luck and enjoy the picture-taking!