Leica vs Voigtlander 28's Experience?

[ronald_breeze]

Given that money is no object (yeah, right) does anyone have any experience or opinions (this forum is

never wanting for opinions) about the Voigtlander 28mm F1.9 Ultron vs the Leica 28mm F2? Better yet

has anyone used either or both on an M8? I have already read Irwin Putz and Luminous Landscape on

these lenses but they were tested on an RD1. Thanks for the input and please let's not start any running

diatribes about the M8.

[jari]

I have only shot CV Ultron 28/1.9 with Leica M2 or Bessa T. I think it's quite good even wide open. Here are my shots with it <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/jsuominen/tags/ultron28mm19/">http://www.flickr.com/photos/jsuominen/tags/ultron28mm19/</a>. Sorry, no experience with Leica M8 or Summicron-M 28/2 lens.

[ev1]

Another option is the Zeiss Biogon M 28mm f2.8.

It's more expensive than the CV but much less than the Leica summicron 28.

Incredibly sharp edge to edge, great color and contrast, and well made.

Its a large lens, but I imagine that the summicron is as well.

Flickr has Biogon 28 group if you would like to see some images from it.

[kelly_flanigan1]

Here I use an old orion-15 on my Bessa R, zorkis, feds, lennigrad and leica M3. I used the Orion -15 for almost a year on my Bessa R, before reading in 2000 on Photo.net that the combo wont work. It probably doesnt on some newer Bessa Rs and other Orions; but mine doesnt foul anything, and meters correctly too. These F6 28mm LTM's were cheap until folks started to rediscover Russian LTM cameras..

[james mitchell dc]

I second the Zeiss 28/2.8. Great lens for the price. I used to own a VC 28 Ultron, and I like the Zeiss much more. No regrets on the loss of a stop plus. I have never used a 28 'cron, and would love to have one, except for the price. Pictures that I've seen from good photographers make it look like the best 28 available.

[lol1]

James: Please can you let me know what it is you prefer about the 28mm Zeiss over the Ultron.

[james mitchell dc]

Lawrence, I remember less contrast and lower color saturation with the Ultron--purely personal on my part. Although, I sold my Ultron at the time as I didn't like the 28mm focal length. Now, not only have I rediscovered the 28 for film, but I like it a lot on my Epson RD-1s and especially my M8. My fiancee says I'm a snob. So why doesn't she buy me a 28 'cron??? Cheap Filipinas...

[frank]

Ronald

 

I guess common sense is that the Summicron 28/2 is comparable with the Elmarit 28/2.8 (4th version), some even say, the Summicron is a tad better. I have an Elmarit 28/2.8 and an Ultron 28/1.9 and I used both lenses (with some others) with an M8.

 

The Elmarit is the better lens, but: Even at full aperture the Voigtlaender's vignetting is very low, sharpness in the center is very good, the edges are a bit on the soft side. Don't worry, this lens can be used at f1.9. for low light photography. At f4 I couldn't see ANY differences (!) to the Elmarit 28/2.8, to the new Elmarit 28/2.8 ASPH. or to the Zeiss ZM Biogon 28/2.8. Even the edges were tack sharp. Given that the 6bit lens coding is no object for you I recommend the Biogon 28/2.8: excellent optical quality, excellent build quality and a very reasonable price - even in comparison to a used Elmarit 28/2.8. If money matters, I can highly recommend the Ultron 28/1.9.

 

BTW the only thing I disliked with the combo Leica M8 - Ultron 28/1.9 were ugly red color fringes that became visible in contrasty parts (bright and dark cuts side by side) of the subject. At f.4 the fringes improved but they were still visible. I don't know whether these color fringes also occur with the Summicron 28/2.

 

Best regards

 

Frank

[Rob F.]

Ronald: I have the 28mm Summicron, although not the Voigtlander. I've gotten many good pictures with the Summicron, at full aperture and stopped down. I do feel a need to mention that the lens does exhibit considerable vignetting, which although not usually a problem, became apparent in a shot I took last Summer that included a field of grass. The uneveness of this lenses' illumination was disturbing to me in this one shot. When it's the sky that's darker in the corners, the effect is not unpleasant, and is easily accepted. In a shot that includes no large areas of uniform luminance, the effect goes unnoticed. But this one shot made me a little ill. I thought I ought to mention that before you shell out bug bucks for one, in case this is important to you.

[jason_b.]

I was suprised how mich I noticed the difference between the leica 28/2 and the VC 28/1.9. It

comes down to clarity and contrast - which I tend to notice more than sharpness. The leica

lens just has this quality of "clearness" - I feel like the prints just take me to what's in front of

the camera. The VC was ok, even a little glowey which some of us like, but it felt a little

muddy. That, and the focus stiffened up so I returned it, and being so pissed off at having to

do that dropped 2K more on the Leica. I'm glad I did it though and would not switch back no

matter what.

[Rob F.]

Not to hijack the thread, but while on the subject, does anyone have experience with the 28/3.5 Color-Skopar? At middle apertures, say 5.6 to 11, how worthy is it to pinch-hit for the Summicron? I've thought of trying one for daylight shooting because it looks so nice and compact.

[alan_morton2]

VC28/3.5

I have the VC28/3.5, and it produes images of superb quality, excellent contrast and tonality, and quite brilliant acutance.

From f4 thro' to f16, it is comparable, (identical upto 20" prints using Ilford Delta 100), to my Summicron Aspherical 35, (1999 build.)

It is a delight to use, small and excellent build qualty, I find my Aspherical Cron just so "heavy" in comparison, ...it stays at home more often, now I have the VC.<div></div>

[frank]

"Not to hijack the thread, but while on the subject, does anyone have experience with the 28/3.5 Color-Skopar? At middle apertures, say 5.6 to 11, how worthy is it to pinch-hit for the Summicron?"

 

Rob

 

I also did my personal 28mm-comparison with the Voigtlaender 28/3.5. It's very compact but you have to pay the price for this compactness: Using the aperture or focus ring is fiddly, vignetting is quite high with the M8. In this discipline at f1.9 the Ultron 28 mm is far better than the tiny 28/3.5 Color-Skopar at f3.5.

Even at f5.6 or f8 I can see a difference in resolution in comparison with the two Elmarits 28 mm, with the Ultron 28 mm or with the Zeiss Biogon 28 mm.

I guess for photographers who are on a budget the Ultron 82 mm is the best choice - despite its size. IMO the ZM-Biogon is the best (well-balanced)lens of all the 28mm-lenses. When Leica introduced the 28mm-Summicron I thought about an upgrade (from my Elmarit) and asked myself: How often do you really need an aperture bigger than 2.8? Well, I still use and love my "old" Elmarit, complemented by a cheap Ultron 28/1.9.

 

:-)

 

Frank

[frederick_muller]

My first 28mm in leica mount was the 28mm VC Ultron. I liked its results, but later on bought a 28mm Summicron. I was surprised when I found the Ultron seemed to flare less and every time I went out, I took the Ultron instaid of the Summicron. When the opportunity came to trade away the Summicron for a 50mm Lux Asph, I let the Summicron go.

 

I have two other 28s now, and both are very good, if slowish. The 28mm f2.8 Hexanon-M is outstanding in all respects, but is a stop slower. I think it is actually sharper than the Summicron and the Ultron, but if that stop matters to you, it's a big difference. Hence, on many occasions, it's the Ultron that comes with me and not the Hexanon. The other is the 28mm f3.5 VC Skopar which is super-compact and very slow where 28's are concerned. It also has much more distortion than any of the others, but it is a charming little lens and I love it for its compactness and build quality. I can honestly say I don't miss the Summicron at all.

[frederick_muller]

One more note on the 28mm Hexanon-M, which may be "a well kept secret" amongst M-compatible lenses. I was told once that the block diagram for the 28mm Hexanon-M was identical to that of the last pre-aspherical 28mm Elmarit-M. Maybe that's why I've found it standing up so well to the Ultron and the Summicron. I would be interested if anyone else who's seen the block diagrams could confirm that.

[frank]

Yes, the Hexanon 28/2.8 is a 1:1 copy of the excellent Elmarit 28/2.8 (4th version). No wonder that lab test results of both lenses are identical. I liked the Hexanon very much but sold it because of its very stiff focussing ring and because of an offer for a like new Elmarit for a very low price.

[frederick_muller]

Frank, thanks for confirming that. I too have noticed that the focusing ring on my Hexanon-M is tighter than the one on my Ultron. The difference is that I actually like it that way, as the Ultron seems a tad loose. I feel like I get a very firm, positive focus with the Hexanon while sometimes I worry the Ultron's focus might slip between focus and composition. That aside, the Hexanon should be considered as a contender for any lens set that needs a 28.

[paulr]

Alex Shishin has done many photos with the RD-1 and Zeiss 25mm.

 

http://www.photo.net/photo/4770735

 

Another vote for the 28mm F1.9. I did notice some fall off in the corners at F/1.9.

However, its insignificant. Build quality is very good and the price is right. USD $500 with

a shade.

 

I have purchased used Leica lenses over the years. I would not purchase any new at this

time because of the price point. $3200 for an 28mm F/2? No way.

 

I think too the Zeiss 25mm is worth looking at if you want a bucks up lens and don't

require the extra stop.

[Rob F.]

Here are some shots to illustrate my comments about vignetting with the 28mm Summicron. They are scanned on my Konica/Minolta Scan Dual IV at the lowest JPEG compression setting. Originals are on Velvia 100. The vignetting on the actual slides is not quite as severe as I remembered it. In the scans, it comes out exaggerated.<div></div>

[Rob F.]

The foreground shadow probably worsens the impression of corner darkening.<div></div>

[Rob F.]

But look at that sky. Almost as severe as my 21mm SA. Also the scanner is not giving the full image width. It's more pronounced when you can see all the way to the corners.<div></div>

[Rob F.]

In many pictures, even wide open, the light falloff, although present, is not a problem and may even go unnoticed. The scratches showing up in the scans are not actually on the slides. Wonder what's going on?<div></div>

[kelly_flanigan1]

Heres my 30 dollar 28mm F6 orion-15 wide open at f6:<BR><BR> <IMG SRC="http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y148/ektar/Orion15/Frame18XXXPnutFullnofaces.jpg?t=1165780293"><br><br><IMG SRC="http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y148/ektar/Orion15/Frame18XXXPnutcroplogo.jpg?t=1165780450"><br><br><IMG SRC="http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y148/ektar/Orion15/tripods-437.jpg?t=1165780539"><br><br><img src="http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y148/ektar/Orion15/tripods-438.jpg?t=1165780613"><BR><BR>

[bill_marshall1]

Sheck Sean Reid's just published review of "28 mm lenses on the M8." Zeiss, Leica, & Cosina/Voigtlander are all covered in the review. It's a pay site but reviews are superb & it's well worth the small fee.

 

www.reidreviews.com

[35mmdelux]

I have the last Leica 28mm/2.8 pre-asph model and I find its mechanics outstanding. Its fairly compact but nowhere near the compactness of the f/3.5 VC. I got this one mint cond for the price of a new Zeiss Biogon. I found it a tad slow (K64)in the rainforest the other day but I did carry a small Gitzo Basalt tripod in case. Faster film would have helped.

 

I should get my K64 back within the next few days and we'll see the results..