8750 banding/posterizing

[pbajzek]

I've been happily printing with an HP 7660 for 2 years, and based on that experience I

recently purchased an 8750 for larger size and, reportedly, better B&W quality. My first few

color prints were stunning (and are actually hanging in a gallery right now), but this

weekend I started printing some B&W images and I've noticed a really pronounced banding

in some areas (not the "end of print" banding that some have mentioned, but a severe

posterization of tones). This is mostly visible in some high-contrast areas, and hilight

subtleties are lost. This has also affected a few color images, but seems most prominent in

B&W.

 

The banding areas are somewhat visible on-screen if I do a soft proof in Photoshop using

the 8750 profile (HP Premium Plus paper). Adding some noise helps smooth things out a

bit, but does not solve everything. I never had any issues of this nature with the 7660, and

I'm surprised that this newer, better, more expensive printer would have problems like

this. Has anybody else experienced this? Any insights aould be welcome.

[constance_cook]

Hi Peter:

 

Things to try:

 

1. Set a higher dpi in whatever program you're using as you resize the image.

 

2. (Don't skip this!) When you check the Print in Greyscale box go down to the sliders and move 'Saturation' up one notch.

 

3. If these things fail, tyr a different cartridge.

 

I have not had this problem with my 8750. It has been trouble-free but I do know that the solutions listed above should work either alone or as a group.

 

Printing in B&W only will reveal areas with blown highlights that you might miss in a color print.

 

If it doesn't work, c'mon back.

 

Conni

[pbajzek]

Hi, Conni,

 

Thanks for the quick reply. Unfortunately I have a comeback for everything...

 

1) One of the images I'm printing hasn't been resized at all, so there are no additional

pixels "available" (if I understand you correctly).

 

2) I'm missing the "Print in Grayscale" check box w/ saturation slider. Neither the

Photoshop interface nor the HP imaging software seem to give me this option, unless I'm

overlooking something, which is possible. Where should I find this? I have the option to

select Grayscale in the color management pull-down menu, but then the saturation

window is grayed out.

 

I should mention that this isn't only a hilight problem (the hilights do not seem to be

blown out). I'm getting some banding in certain midtone areas as well. Very frustrating, as

the overall look of the B&W prints is spectacular, until one notices this flaw.

 

Thanks,

 

Peter

[pbajzek]

In fact, upon further review, the most obnoxious banding actually seems to be happening not

in the hilights, but in the transition from shadows to midtones. Strange.

[kevin_campbell]

The fact that it's visible to any extent in a soft proof suggests that the printer may just be doing what it's been told to do.

 

What are your Photoshop and printer driver settings - quality,color management, paper type, etc? I take it you actually are using HP PPP paper? What is the nature of the image you are printing (pixel dimensions and depth, color space). What ink cartridges do you have installed?

 

I haven't seen anything like this in 4 Photo gray 102 cartridges of output.

 

Kevin

[pbajzek]

Kevin,

 

I'm using only standard HP inks and Premium Plus paper, and have these selected in my

print settings. Your point about the soft proofing is a very good one, and I've spent the

afternoon trying to figure out what's going on. It seems I may have had "beginner's luck"

on the first few files I chose, none of which seem very unusual to me, but all of which

show banding when viewed with this printer profile.

 

However, I tried out some other images and found the banding to be greatly dimished

(though not *entirely* absent, once I know what I'm looking for). Interestingly, the bad

ones are all digital shots and the better ones are film scans. I may need to adjust my

conversion technique to accomodate this printer. Still strange that these problem images

print fine on my 7660. Anyway, many thanks for the input.

 

Regards,

 

Peter

[constance_cook]

Peteer:

 

The drivers are very different in the two printers. The 8750 and 7960 both carry professional drivers while lower models carry more intuitive drivers.

 

I really think your problem is with your digital camera file transfer.

 

But I just printed a B&W 4x6 and noted what was available. First, I got no banding and it was a digital photo from my D200 that I flipped from color to B&W in CS2. I resized the image in CS2 and inserted 300 dpi. I went through the usual setup until I got to setting the 'color' tab. When you click the color tab, before you click 'print in greyscale', click on advanced and you will find the 'saturation' slider. Move it over one notch. Then go bak and click in greyscale which does grey out the 'advanced' box. Don't worry about that. The saturation slider stays where you left it. Print your photo.

 

Be sure to go back and put the saturation slider back over to the left before you go back to prining color pics.

 

I do think though, that the problem is with the digital file.

 

Conni

[constance_cook]

And now I converted a scanned film file and printed it with no problems.

 

Kevin is right about the printer doing what it is told. Try to look at your files and if you can, retrieve the original file and print from that.

 

You mentioned that you had no problems with the 7660 but are you attempting to print the same files? From the same camera and workflow? Check everything that you may have changed before you changed printers.

 

I have never had banding on any of the 5 PhotoSmarts I've owned. It's pretty rare with these printers. Five years ago there were paper feeding problems which were pretty easy to solve if you thought about it, but you shouldn't have to. And I recall a couple of complaints about pizza wheel marks but I think they went away after a few prints.

 

The drivers for the top end of PhotoSmarts is exceptionally good. Although I 've had (and still have) several of these printers, the 8750 required me to read the instructions a bit before just plowing in. I never had to do that before but it offers so much control and so many options that it's no longer a 'plug-'n-play' like it eas. You can do regular things right out of the box but when you get into what you can do with the options, it's like a candy store.

 

Conni

[pbajzek]

Hi again, Conni,

 

I agree the control offered by the 8750 is very impressive, which is one of the things that

attracted me to it in the first place. As I said, I'll have to adjust my workflow to get the best

results. I'll say that the non-problematic images I've printed are really amazing. Thanks again

for your time.

 

Peter

[ian_scholey]

Peter,

 

What rendering intent are you using in PS ?

Try swapping between perceptual and rel col. does this make a difference ?

 

Sometime the gamut compression of rel col can introduce this type of effect. Also some papers dont handle shadow detail that well and can block up.

 

Ian

 

http://www.colourperfect.co.uk