Warranty scams

[peter_burns1]

Grey imports?

 

To me that is a BIG CON. In the UK if we were to buy a camera from

the USA or Canada that would be termed a grey import and could only

be dealt with warrabty wise from the country of purchase, same as if

one from the UK was shipped to the USA or Canada. For goodness sake

a genuine Nikon camera is a camera, same with their lenses, when

will they stop this stupidity and give worldwide warranties?

 

The world is getting smaller, there needs to be pressure put on big

manufactureres regarding these ridiculous warranty scams. I am sure

that throughout the world with people travelling the warranty

department work would even out!

 

Can anyone give me a good reason why this cannot be done or is their

something more sinister going on?

[andy_blagbrough]

It is very simple - profit! If you can purchase a new Nikon in the US, pay their local taxes

and have it posted to the UK for less than going to your local Nikon dealer, you are taking

the bread from the mouths of the starving Nikon execs and the improverished UK dealers.

My main gripe is the price of second-hand, non-digital equipment. No apparant price drop

in the last 5 years for Nikon equipment.

 

The world is getting smaller and this problem will eventually go away - just look at what

happend to the proce of new cars in the UK. Until then, just keep moaning. As an aside, I

wonder what the office of fair trading might say? Possible worth a trip down to your local

trading standards office.

[ShunCheung]

The real problem is price differences among countries. Take an extreme example, if people in the UK all buy their Nikon cameras from the US to enjoy the lower prices, Nikon UK will have no income and will go out of business in no time. How do you expect them to pay for all warranty services on cameras that they make no money from?

 

The world is indeed getting smaller and these issues will eventually go away, but we are still a long way from the day where income, prices, and living standards are uniform around the globe. And that is a discussion way beyond the scope of this forum.

[Jerry_]

The 'trick' is to be a "tourist" and in a different country when you purchase a Nikon body or lens from a Nikon dealer. The Nikon warranty would apply...but if you order it from a "dealer" that is not a part of the Nikon organization in your "home" counry, buyer beware and the warranty is not-exactly-what-you-thought-it was.

 

 

 

Don't you think the Land Rover dealer would love to be the 'sole' source of repair parts for all Land Rover vehicles in the U.K. No other repair shops allowed to service a Land Rover under warranty! Such a deal.

 

 

 

Nikon also has a "layer" of management in each country. The higher prices contribute to the salary of each executive, along with the cost of keeping the warranty/repair center open for business. And, of course, some "profit" winds its way back to Japan.

[david_h._hartman]

<em>For goodness sake a genuine Nikon camera is a

camera, same with their lenses, when will they stop this

stupidity and give worldwide warranties? --Peter Burns<br>

</em><br>

They will stop when Nikon customers demand a true World Wide

Warranty. Nikon, Incorporated, Tokyo, Japan is fully at fault.

They are living in a 19th Century World of their own although we

now have a 21st Century World Wide Market. <br>

<br>

Nikon Incorporated could easily end this fraud buy devising a

system were by each countrys importer would be reimbursed

for repair of another counties import or simply paid directly by

Nikon, Inc. for each unit repaired. In many countries the

official Nikon importer is a subsidiary of Nikon, Inc. so Nikon is

refusing to repair a product sold by themselves.<br>

<br>

The passivity of the typical customer and the apologist are at

fault.

[kelly_flanigan1]

Who pays the repair shops health insurance, light bills, wages for the repair crews?<BR><BR>Will GM and Ford honor warranty of a usa car imported into the UK, filled with California emission controlls? :)

[kelly_flanigan1]

The Bessa R I bought new when they first came out was from a Hong Kong Dealer. It was 200 US dollars cheaper than the going best price of the New York City camera dealers at the time, but the camera had no valid warranty in the USA. The camera came in a new box with manual and even an extra set of batteries, and came to the USA in one week, using Ebay and Paypal. Should the USA warranty department be "forced" to repair a grey market camera? Part of the extra 200 bucks one pays with a USA seller is for warranty expenses. Since I work on cameras myself, the 200 dollar extra fee to get a warranty was a poor bet.

[Jerry_]

"Should the USA warranty department be "forced" to repair a grey market camera?"

 

 

 

No. But what business organization is up to saying "No, you cannot spend your money here and get your '_______' product repaired." here?

That is just plain dumb. Would you expect a Boeing jet owner [airline] to be forced to order oil filters from Boeing even is the original manufacturer had the same oil filters on the market, as an example?

 

 

 

Nikon is a business. They are (my guess) refusing to service a product made by the 'company,' and having less money in the till as a result. ....Good business practice?

[kelly_flanigan1]

With the optical equipment I repair, the factory supplies the parts and some labor credits to fix warranty items that are legitimate, ie serial number block is correct. The grey items I get no free parts, no credit for my time to fix the item. Maybe in a socialist European country there is free health care, and special programs to pay ones light bills? :) Customers often "just dont get it"; they want to buy grey items and have a local fix it for free. Maybe they have government pensions and have never run a business of their own? It is not a "Warranty scam" buy the makers; just a "Warranty scam" by cheapskate buyers who dont understand how repairs are paid for. Warranty costs are real costs and have to be paid by somebody. I fail to see why the bitching really makes any sense. Grey market items are often cheaper because the warranty cost is not included. This was true even 1/2 century ago with some consumer items.

[kelly_flanigan1]

With some optical items I work on the grey market item has an older build, and thus uses sometimes a module, o-ring ,knob or part with a different vintage. Once we had a rash of focus knob failures, then factory fixed the parts. They a year later the grey items hit the USA market, and the knob problem resurfaced, as the older build of the grey items came ashore. <BR><BR>There is also refurb market, where "weekend warriors" use the item, return it for their money back, and the units get sent back as bad. Most all have nothing wrong with them, but maybe a spec of dust. These items are resold as "refurbs" with a full or truncated warranty. The cost of "eating theses returns" is part of the extra cost you pay for many items in the USA.<BR><BR>Lets face it, most folks want something for nothing. They want a free rental. They want to buy at grey prices and have a local repair done free of charge. They also want to buy out of state or country to avoid paying taxes. They dont want their local tax guy to know either. :) They want new paved local roads, but dont want to pay any taxes. :)

[david_h._hartman]

Even genuine Nikon product that leaves a Nikon factory any where in the world should include a World Wide Warranty for the 21st Century World Wide Market. If Nikon Corporation would get off their duff and do this the fat lady could sing.

[jwenting]

No scam at all. Your US purchased item has a warranty card issued by Nikon USA which states clearly where it is valid (USA only).

That's what you paid for, that's what you got.

 

If you'd not wanted that you should have bought it elsewhere where they issue a warranty that's valid where you want it to be.

 

Tough luck, next time read the fine print.

[l_roth]

I'll take Nikon Canada's 2 Year Warranty on my D70s over the Nikon USA one year, any time.

 

Peter FWIW, Minolta has international warranties on their equipment. If you really want to buy a camera/equipment in the US, and get service at your convienence in the UK.

I probablly would have gone with the Maxxum 5D, had they not left Canada.

[david_h._hartman]

<em>I'll take Nikon Canada's 2 Year Warranty on my D70s

over the Nikon USA one year, any time. --L Roth<br>

</em><br>

I live in Southern California. Should I buy big ticket Nikon

items from Nikon, CA to get a better warranty?<br>

<br>

---<br>

<br>

<em>Tough luck, next time read the fine print. --Jeroen

Wenting<br>

</em><br>

Jeroen, <br>

<br>

Its not the customers responsibility to understand

the internal practices of Nikon Corporation. The lack of a world

wide warranty is absurd. Its a shell game.<br>

<br>

Besides this Nikon USA is reactive and self-centered. Ive

had several hostel and several rather cool responses from Nikon

USA over attempting to get information over the phone about a

used Nikon products origin.<br>

<br>

Nikon will not repair so called gray market products at any cost

and yet they will not help a 35 year loyal customer avoid buying

a used gray market product. This is a double cross and customer

hostile. You would not accept this kind of treatment from many

other manufactures of commodities. The world has changed and

Nikon is not changing with it. I dont give a damn how Nikon

gets each importer or subsidiary paid. That is Nikon Corporations

responsibility and not the customers.<br>

<br>

---<br>

<br>

Kelly,<br>

<br>

What the hell do paved roads and socialist European governments

have to do with warranty issues? Nikon is dumping essentially

unwarranted products on the world market. Nikon Corporations is

irresponsible and Nikon USA is customer hostile.<br>

<br>

Nikon USA is so uptight they forced an end to free PDF manuals

for Nikon products in European. I exchanged four e-mails with

someone at Nikon USA with a customer service managment title

regarding manuals for the D2H and WT-1. The first three replies were

hostile followed by an apology and later complete photocopies of

both manuals. It would have been cheaper to just send me regular

printed copies and far cheaper to just let me download them from

Nikon, UK.<br>

<br>

When the D2X came out Nikon USA offered a Non-Printing PDF manual

on their website. Id like to think I had a little something

to do with this. I can almost hear the augments in a committee

meeting for and against free PDF downloads before this compromise.

Nikon USA needs to learn a lot that they never should have been

forgotten about customer service. Its costing them

customers. I use downloaded manuals to make purchase decistions.<br>

<br>

Ive spoken to one store owner of my acquaintance, two

general managers and one sales manager about Nikon USA and they

all dislike dealing with Nikon USA. There is a clear trend here.

I went to a store that Ive had an open account with since

1977 and asked to see a Nikon D1. They told me Nikon USA would

not let them sell it. This is a company that date from or before

the first Nikon post war sales in the US. This is loyal franchise

dealer that helped make them what the are today and they screwed

them. At the same time I could order a Nikon D1 if I choose from

PC Connection, a company that cant give me personalize

service, a company where Im not known on a first name basis

by all the sales staff.<br>

<br>

I have a good friend who has been a camera repairman for

about 20 of the 25 years Ive known him. He doesnt

like dealing with Nikon USAs parts department but notes

that Canon USAs parts department is very helpful.<br>

<br>

Nikon Corporation, Tokyo, Japan and Nikon USA have major customer

service relations problems, both retail and wholesale. The gray

market appears to be a major part of this problem. Nikon needs to

think more about pleasing it's customers and less about itself.<br>

<br>

---<br>

<br>

Even genuine Nikon product that leaves a Nikon factory anywhere

in the world should include a World Wide Warranty for the 21st

Century World Wide Market. If Nikon Corporation would get off

their duff and do this the fat lady could sing.<br>

<br>

Regards,<br>

<br>

Dave Hartman.

[marcus_andrewes]

So, what happens if I buy a Nikon here in NZ and am on a shoot in - say - the UK and the

camera fails, but is under warranty.

Am I then forced to abandon my shoot, loose the fees and return home to get the camera

fixed?! Surely, Nikon pro gear should be repairable under warranty anywhere in the world -

like my Leicas are.

I do not much care if the $300 plastic versions have restrictions on warranty (although why

should they?) but the pro stuff certainly ought not to.

And in response to the line about "if UK buyers all buy their stuff from the US Nikon UK

will go bust" I say - aw, diddums!! Surely that is just world commerce and if the UK rice is

matched to the US one (instead of UK customers being ripped off) then it won't happen,

will it?!

Anyway - just try to buy a D200 here in NZ! No chance - the next 3 shipments are all pre-

sold, apparently. I can get one off the shelf in the US, Singapore or UK though for less

money!

[l_roth]

Dave - Just wanted to point out that Nikon Canada treats us Canadians better than Americans.

Probablly a no brainer for Nikon, as Canada is only 10% of the US market.

[peter_burns1]

Firstly I would like to state that if my Nikon camera is faulty within the warranty period, why the hell should I have to pay for faulty goods because I am in another country that has full Nikon service facilities?

 

It is just one MAJOR SCAM, I wonder how much Nikon saves throughout the world by people buying camera's in different countries and not claiming on warranty's. I was asking a general question because I travel a lot and as one poster has stated if your camera becomes faulty whilst somewhere else in the world then you have to pay. Nikon should honour the warranty worldwide and as someone stated perhaps a claim could be made to the country of origins warranty department internally.

 

Living in Europe we perhaps see thing differently to some of those in the US, we are learning about a common market and also the sharing and responsibilities that this entails, it would just be nice to see major international corporations take the lead and expand that worldwide. I guess it could make a slight difference to international travellers purchasing when it came down to choice between Nikon and a worldwide warranty, and Canon and local country warranty, would a Nikon worldwide warranty entice you away from Canon say?

 

Nikon is a major corporation, they should change with the times, the grey market is swings and roundabouts, some things cheaper in some places and some not. I understand that Nikon in the UK are forcing dealers to add at least a large compact flash card in a packaged deal with the camera, if not a Nikon lense. I bought my D200 in the UK where I live, so don't give me the lecture on grey goods, I got the camera and a 1GB San Disk extreme III CF for 1,250 British pounds including 17.5% tax (around USD$2,200), if it becomes faulty when I am over working in the US, then I have to pay for warranty work, how can that be right? It isn't, it's a plain RIP OFF!

 

I am glad that there are only a few people living in the old blinkered world and that the majority here are getting the hang of international trade and the needs for the 21st century in this new ever shrinking world :-)

[kelly_flanigan1]

The grey Nikon lens items are sometimes several hundred dollars cheaper in the USA than legitimately imported full warranty Nikon Lenses. The added NON grey item costs helps pay for some of the actual warranty costs. Folks want a grey market price, and want a full warranty for nothing. For this to happen some of the actual warranty costs need to be tacked on to the grey market prices.<BR><BR>The 85mm F1.4 Nikkor I bought new was 200 + dollars cheaper as a grey import, with no warranty. For me it was a no brainer, I have never had a Nikkor need to be fixed under Warranty ever, and I have been shooting Nikon gear since 1962.<BR><BR>The warranty issues of grey versus non grey are real old issues, they were around 4 decades ago when folks rarely whined. <BR><BR>The warranty issue of not giving a free warranty to grey items is not a scam. It is just the policy of many companies, even in other industries. The real scam is folks whining about something for nothing. Why not pay up for a real warranty? <BR><BR>The actual warranty costs need to be accounted for. Local repair shops dont work for free. <BR><BR>In order to have a universal worldwide Nikon warranty, the company would have to add REAL warranty costs into each item sold; and thus service all items, even grey ones. Would this wipe out the grey market? What would be the real difference? Would B&H and other make more or less profit with a universal Nikon warranty? <BR><BR><b>Would you be happier if all Nikon prices rose in pricing? This would pave the way for a universal world wide warranty.</b><BR><BR>With a universal warranty, maybe some folks would look back and dream of the lower cost grey items they use to buy!

[david_h._hartman]

<em>if it becomes faulty when I am over working in

the US, then I have to pay for warranty work, how can that be

right? It isn't, it's a plain RIP OFF! --Peter Burns<br>

</em><br>

If you carry your paperwork with you everywhere you go and you

have a failure in the USA you will be covered. If you loose your

paperwork youll be screwed because Nikon USA will not

repair your camera even for an out of warranty fee.<br>

<br>

A true world wide warranty can and must be paperless. There is no

reason why the original documents cant stay safely at home.

Dont traveler have enough concerns without carrying a

portfolio of sales invoice?<br>

<br>

Anyone who truly cares about the Nikon will not support these

customer hostile policies. If I were Canon Id got for Nikons

throat and install a true world wide warranty system first. Canon

USA already will repair gray market for a fee.<br>

<br>

Peter, if you have a failure while traveling in the US youll

need a backup camera or youll have to buy another camera in

the US and face the paper work problem if your Nikon USA camera

needs repair in the UK. Is this anyway to run an international

corporation?<br>

<br>

Best,<br>

<br>

Dave Hartman.

[kelly_flanigan1]

Peter, Here in the USA most all legit camera dealers will tell you what the warranty is with grey versus non-grey. Many times the grey items are warrantied by the camera store. Legally most all will openly explain these matters, thus there is no scam. Do the UK sellers hide these issues? Normally on an expensive item one wants to understand what the warranty is, and where it is valid. In the USA a scam is a fraudulent business scheme. Financial fraud is a deception practiced on another party to cheat them. One would think that the mother county would have basic fraud laws in place.

[ShunCheung]

Sorry Peter, what you wrote is simply untrue. If you purchase a Nikon product through the legitimate channels in the UK, it should carry a world-wide warranty that, for example, Nikon USA would honor. However, you must have the appropriate paperwork. Otherwise, how do you expect Nikon USA to know whether the item is within the warranty period or not.

 

If you indeed have plans to be in the US for an extended period of time, you should let someone at home know where the paperwork is and mail that to you should your Nikon product requires warranty repair.

 

Again, in the US, there are a number of authorized repair shops that are more than happy to repair gray-market Nikon products for a fee. They tend to have a faster turn around and a bit less expensive than Nikon USA repair. Once an item is out of warranty, I prefer to send it to those places anyway.

[peter_burns1]

Thanks for the replies, I didn't know that I could get my camera which was bought in the UK repaired in the US under warranty with no fee. I have a friend who bought a Nikon camera in the US and the Nikon warranty dept in the UK would only repair it if he paid, otherwise it had to go back to the US. So does the warranty only work one way e.g. UK to US and not US to UK?

 

Having checked some of the US prices it seems that we get ripped off in the UK all ways possible, so much for buying in the UK, but then again I guess I am supporting the UK workers, shame Nikon get out of so much warranty work this way. I certainly don't see any benefit for us in the UK price wise, it is already expensive, see one of our top dealers site for price examples and how we suffer over here, and they are very good prices at that compared to RRP! www.parkcameras.co.uk

 

No wonder people are driven to this so called grey market, but what is so 'grey' about the Nikon goods we could buy in the US, it's legitimate for you and grey for us! Perhaps you could all come over here and buy our expensive 'grey' (to you) Nikon gear and see what it feels like. No wonder you all have the best equipment and lead stress free wonderful lives if you can get greyer kit even cheaper than you already have legitimately, which already seems cheap to us!

 

WHAT do you spend all the money that you are saving on?

[ShunCheung]

Peter, when we buy Nikon products imported through Nikon USA, they do come with a one-year, world wide warranty. In fact, it contains a list of Nikon service facilities around the world. I think DSLRs may be an exception. In any case, I would expect Nikon in the UK or Europe to honor that warrenty.

 

Gray-market products exist simply because there are price differences around the world, and naturally people would like to take advantage of the lower prices. When people bypass the official importer, it directly threatens their very existance. Those are the issues we are observing.

[marcus_andrewes]

If this is all so complex, why do I NEVER have a problem with warranty cover worldwide for

my Leics M cameras? They even get 2 year "passports" that will mean that Leica replace them

for free no matter how I damage them, as long as I can return the bits to them!

To be fair, I've never tested the warranty - Leicas rarely break - but I have absolute

confidence that they will honour their responsibilities wherever I am in the world.

As for having to carry paperwork, three words: Internet and serial number and database!

[mike_ujvary]

I bought a nokon F5 from Thailand for less than half of the price in england, and when I drove a motor bike off a mountain in sumatra, and into a river the camera took a pounding and a ducking and surprisingly carried on working for quite a long time several months before it needed a repair which included a new top and bottom plates, as all nikon cameras carry a world wide warranty the work was done here in england for free under that warranty, so what are grey imports - to me they are the ones that the camera manufacturer dont give world wide warrannty.

I have a large collection of nikon camera equipmentand most bought overseas and will carry on doing so. screw the over hiked up price's here in the UK.

 

Mike