What is Nikon doing?

[greg s]

"Shortage of D200"

 

In some ways they are dam'd if they do and dam'd if they don't. Intro a camera in limited amounts that requires some tweaking and that's news (understandably). Don't produce them fast enough to keep B&H supplied and that's a problem.

 

A D200 is a super complex piece of equipment. We consumers get a bit spoiled with access to all the technological wonders of the day. Glad I don't have the job of keeping the supply line full, making sure QC is fantastic, and not over producing an expensive product. Oh, and don't forget the part of dealing with the repair shop. :)

 

You gotta take a step back and look at the big picture. Anyway, the Out Of Stock msg has allowed me to think my next purchase through... and through... and through... :o

[ilkka_nissila]

Nikon only discontinued some of the manual focus lenses. As we all know, many AF primes aren't as good as their MF counterparts, so discontinuing them is bad for quality, if good for profits.

[bernard_frank]

Chris, Shun,

 

You'll be happy to learn that the LCD protector has been duly ordered by my Nikon dealer

FROM NIKON two months ago, and that they haven't received it yet AND that Nikon just

don't know when they will ship it. So, going to a hundred other places wouldn't change the

fact that Nikon can't deliver it. The problem lies not with the stores or the dealers, it lies

with Nikon. But thanks for the tip, Shun, since I cannot count on Nikon.

 

Ilkka, a LCD protector is meant to... protect the LCD. You know? Protect. Shocks.

Scratches. I like my LCD to be clean, would it only be for later resale purposes.

 

Sorry, I am not the "turn the other cheek" kind of guy. And I think that if more people

complained, at the risk of looking unpleasant, things could go a little better, and

companies would pay a little more attention to their customers.

[anthony_bez]

Bernard, Just curious have you tried to purchase a D200, or 18-200?

 

Last month I purchased some equipment from my local camera store (large chain). I asked about the shortage of D200's and the assistant did not know what I was talking about. They had no waiting list 3 available for sale with more arriving, and a demonstration camera. My Friend purchased an 18-200 with next day delivery after a Google search. The viewfinder magnifier was also mentioned in a post, I received it next day delivery also after a Google search.

 

As for Nikon support, I needed a plastic cover for my top LCD panel on my D70. I emailed Nikon UK, they telephoned back, and it arrived in 2 day's.

 

And film users whining about Nikon ceasing production of 35mm camera's. If people wanted them they surely would make them? But the plain fact is most people don't.

[ShunCheung]

Bernard, as I said, I found a number of dealers indicating that they had the LCD cover in stock. Since I didn't know those dealers and wouldn't just trust them based on what I read on the web, I called K&S to verify so that I wouldn't be posting false info to this forum.

 

If your dealer (and I don't know who that may be) cannot get a product while a number of other dealers can, I would say the problem is with that dealer and I would take my business elsewhere.

A lot of people in this forum have talked about their D200's, some even have multiple ones. While the supply is still tight, it is not that hard to get one as several people have indicated in this thread.

[ilkka_nissila]

Anthony, the reason Nikon can't sell 35 mm bodies (apart from the F6) is because there are a lot fewer film camera users than there are film cameras on the second hand market. However, this is not the same as having no market. It just means that for the time being there are enough film cameras available without buying a new F100, F80, etc. for everyone that wants to use them. This doesn't necessarily mean that it's a permanent situation.

 

The D200 body is perfectly capable of retaining its mechanical integrity in normal use without the LCD cover. The LCD cover is IMO annoying and it reduces the contrast and overall usability of the LCD quite significantly, as well as pushing the face further away from the viewfinder, making it more difficult to use. If you throw your cameras around or don't otherwise handle them correctly, then you may find some use in a screen cover. In two years of use, without the LCD cover, I did not get a single visible scratch on my D70 LCD. And I took it to quite a few places.

[anthony_bez]

Bernard, I thought you were being serious but your rant is over an LCD cover?

 

You may find your local dealer does not find it quite as important an issue as you!

 

Do him and yourself a favor, and just order one online.

[anthony_bez]

Ilkka, I agree with you. My point is if there was a demand Nikon would still produce Film Camera's. But they believe they will never sell the quantity to make it worthwhile. I think they are right.

 

I love my E-Type Jaguar, and people complained when production ceased. But they stopped making them because no one was buying them. The people that loved them already had one.

[ilkka_nissila]

I recall that Nikon's announcement noted that the cameras and lenses were discontinued basically in order to clear factory space and improve their capacity to compete in digital. They didn't exactly say that no new units were sold. But obviously Nikon doesn't see themselves as a niche manufacturer. They used to produce just about everything imaginable for 35 mm photography. Now they just make 12-24, 17-55 and 70-200, a series of consumer zooms and the DSLRs. (Ok, a couple of other products are also made.)

[anthony_bez]

Ilkka, Just produce 3 lenses?

 

Is my 85mm 1.4D purchased two weeks ago old stock? I do not think so as they have been in short supply. I'm sure I have missed your point?

 

I do think they have the balance of there products about right. Two film SLR's with the F6 still regarded by most people as the best 35mm camera. That few people want to purchase. And an expanding range of Digital camera's that people are queuing up for.

 

My last film camera purchase was 15 years ago, and but for being sucked into the digital revolution. I would happily use my old cameras until they ceased to function. Now I am tempted to change digital cameras every two years. Because sites like this convince me I need too? Nikon has to cash in while the demand is strong.

[Jim_Tardio]

Try calling Nikon. They do sell parts directly to consumers. I remember buying a new film door for my old 6006.

[david_h._hartman]

<em>I haven't quite figured out the purpose of the LCD

cover, I can't think of a reason why people would want to get a

replacement --Ilkka Nissila<br>

</em><br>

It serves basically the same function as a lens cap (at least

that's how use it). <br>

<br>

Best,<br>

<br>

Dave Hartman.<br>

<br>

---<br>

<br>

All the Nikon apologist are out and making little or no sense.

This is logic v. emotion, I cant bear it. Im going to

go play with my camera, my camera and my ancient Norman P2000X. I

cant find the counter balance for my boom so I guess Ill

press a led pouch form my SCUBA gear into service.<br>

<br>

Good Luck Bernard! The forces alighted against you are formidable.<br>

<br>

Best,<br>

<br>

Dave Hartman.

[vivek iyer]

The LCD cover is there to be knocked off, misplaced/trampled upon and go searching frantically for a replacement.

 

A grand conspiracy by all the dSLR manufacturers! Nothing less!

[ilkka_nissila]

Anthony, your 85/1.4 is probably just fine, apart from being ripped off of 50% of the useful imaging area (and consequently, information projected by the lens). If you shoot wide open with the 85, I bet you see very low contrast compared with what you get at f/5.6. If you increase the contrast to compensate, you get artifacts. This problem would be reduced by the use of a 35 mm sensor or film simply because you would be using lower spatial frequencies in the MTF.

 

I've got another fine Nikkor prime similar in quality to your 85/1.4: the 105/2 DC. It produces images with color fringing at wide apertures while the 70-200mm AF-S VR doesn't. In fact I get sharper images with the zoom at f/2.8 than the prime, when the D200 is used. The same is true of most of my prime Nikkors: they produce artifacts not present when the latest digital-optimized lenses are used. Basically with 35mm film, each lens had its own niche where it produced the best results. Now the best results are obtained by 12-24, 17-55 and 70-200mm Nikkors. Nikon hasn't updated all but a few primes to be digital friendly and this shows. In the end most existing lenses end up unused once you get a taste of the latest zooms.

 

In any case, a FF DSLR with 20 MP would also show these artifacts but if the pixel count were just 10 million, the artifacts would scale down by 1.4 in terms of visibility.

[ilkka_nissila]

David, a lens cap is used to protect the lens, which is a part of the optical system of the camera. Dust and scratches on the front element may show in images. Dust and fingerprints on the LCD have no effect on the images. And the camera isn't really intended to be used with the cover on. You can use it, if it is a piece of jewelry to be showed around in pristine condition but really in my opinion it interferes with the normal operation of the camera and serves no useful purpose as long as you treat the camera as it should be treated.

[ilkka_nissila]

And at least on my D200, the cover is difficult to take off and put back on, unlike lens caps.

[david_h._hartman]

First a guy complains that he cant find an LCD cover in

stock at the usual suspects. Then they all come out of the wood

work and complain about the guy whos complaining. Then I

come along and complain about those who complain about those who

complain about those who complain about Im confused.<br>

<br>

Excuse me<br>

Oh will you excuse me<br>

I'm just trying to find the BM-3 LCD Cover... <br>

Has anybody seen the BM-3 LCD Cover?<br>

<br>

(Have you seen the BM-3 LCD Cover?)<br>

I ain't seen the BM-3 LCD Cover!<br>

<br>

(Where's that confounded LCD Cover?) <br>

<br>

--Apologies to Jimmy Page & Robert Plant.<br>

<br>

---<br>

<br>

A friend tells me Nikon is often in short supply with parts. It

used to take months at times to get a back cover for the N80 and

N65. I mean out of stock for 6 to 8 months at a time. When youre

a camera repairman its great fun to have to tell the

customer month after month that you cannot do a simple repair on

there camera for lack of the confounded back cover.<br>

<br>

Ive heard complaints (face to face complaints) regarding

Nikon from two store owners, two general managers and one sales

manager. These are customers too. Nikon needs to improve its

customer relations on all levels.<br>

<br>

---<br>

<br>

In the late 60s and early 70s it could take years (literally)

to get a 105/2.5 Nikkor-P Auto. One camera store owner finally

marked his purchase orders <strong><u>Fill All Or

Cancel</u></strong> to get a 105/2.5 to close up an

insurance case where the customer had all his equipment stolen.

EPOI finally found a lens for the guy. It took over a year to get

it. The camera store owners name was Bob Godwin. A great guy and

very helpful person when I was learning fine B&W printing and

large format photography.<br>

<br>

Regards, <br>

<br>

Dave Hartman.<br>

<br>

---<br>

<br>

Ilkka Nissila,<br>

<br>

<em>The F6 is selling quite well in some places ~~~ Also, I

need them for black and white and for certain effects which work

out better with film than Nikon digital and to avoid the

mannequin look.<br>

</em><br>

Many good points here. I agree with you more than you know. This

is one of those times...<br>

<br>

<em>Got a second battery for the D200. In the manual it

says do not use under 0 C temperatures or it may damage the

battery. They have got to be kidding really.<br>

</em><br>

According to Battery U its not that bad but it is very

important <u>not</u> to attempt to charge a consumer lithium-ion

battery below 0*C (32*F).<br>

<br>

<em>It is important to know that consumer grade lithium-ion

batteries cannot be charged below 0�C (32�F). Although the

packs appear to be charging normally at freezing temperatures,

the cell impedance goes up and the acceptance of the ions on the

anode is drastically reduced.<br>

<br>

What is most troubling is the plating of metallic lithium that

occurs on the anode. The higher the charge rate, the more

pronounced the plating will be. A prolonged charge at cold

temperatures will eventually compromise the safety of the pack.</em><br>

<br>

More here...<br>

<br>

<a href="http://www.batteryuniversity.com/partone-14.htm"

target="_new"><u>Charging at high and low temperatures</u></a><br>

<br>

<em>Lithium-ion works within the discharge temperature

limits of -20�C to 60�C (-4�F to 140�F). The performance is

temperature based, meaning that the rate capability at or below -20�C

is reduced due to the increased impedance of the electrolyte.

Discharging at low temperatures does not harm the battery<br>

<br>

It is not recommended to discharge lithium-ion at

temperatures above 60�C. A high discharge rates combined with

elevated temperatures can cause self-heating, an effect that

could permanently damage the separator and electrodes of the

cells.<br>

</em><br>

More here...<br>

<br>

<a href="http://www.batteryuniversity.com/partone-15.htm"

target="_new"><u>Discharging at high and low temperature</u></a><br>

<br>

Best,<br>

<br>

Dave Hartman.

[ilkka_nissila]

Ok, so no charging the battery in the car when it's cold. That's good to know. Still, I would like to be able to use my camera in -30 C. In fact, the first winter when I'm back home I will put the D200 to the test :-)

[bernard_frank]

No, Anthony, my rant is not about a LCD cover. It is about a LCD cover and...

 

- the D200 banding issue still not solved,

 

- D200s still sold WITH known banding problems,

 

- the D200 sent to Nikon for repair of the banding and returned to its owner with the

banding not repaired,

 

- the shortage of D200 and the never ending wait, probably because - as you mention

yourself - Nikon has decided to favor the big electronic stores instead of the real photo

dealer, thus becoming another mass-market company a la Canon,

 

- the shortage of 18-200 zooms,

 

- the creep in the 18-200,

 

- the 18-200 sent to Nikon to repair the creep and returned to the owner after a seven

week wait with the creep not repaired,

 

- etc...

 

all this added to the now forgotten encryption scheme of the D2X WB, with the corollary of

having to buy Nikon Capture on top of the $5,000 D2X, and numerous other "llittle" things

make for worsening relationship between Nikon and its customers.

 

Now, I'm sure some of you will be glad to know that I did ask Nikon, on their Internet site,

about the unavailability of small parts and accessories like the LCD protector (I am not that

stupid), and that all I got as an answer was a phone number - and not a toll-free one at

that - where my experience is that no one there ever knows what you're talking about

anyway. I also asked them about the D200 banding issue, and I got a "Thank you for your

feedback" answer.

 

Maybe you like spending thousands of dollars on some products and get this kind of

support from the company. I don't.

[vivek iyer]

Bernard, Though there are eager beavers who would love to burn the likes of you at stake, don't be disheartened.

 

You do a bigger service to Nikon than some of these Nikonistas who would tow the official (or pseudo official) "Nikon" line.

 

Criticism is good. If there is no criticism from the user then they have already switched. That does nothing good for Nikon either.

[ilkka_nissila]

Yes, that's true. Criticism helps to improve products. I firmly believe that our relentless complaints about the D70 helped in making the D200 a much nicer camera.

 

Still, it holds true that Nikon is run more by bean counters than it once was, when they just made equipment for professional use.

[shoots]

I was going to upgrade to the D200 but after continuing to read these accounts I decided

not to. If any one said to me, the banding, lack of supplies, customer support isn't really a

big deal I would ask them how much they consider there hard earned money or time

worth? Not to mention simply the principle of the matter. If a product is said to perform a

certain way and it does not, then I expect the manufacturer to own up and fix it!

 

There are a lot of sheep in the world, taking what they are handed in exchange for there

paycheck, and letting corporations get away with slop. I read it all the time here, "don't

worry about it, just go take pictures" " just live with it" " don't rock the boat" "Don't make

to much noise" "don't expect to get what you are promised" I am sick of those people! If

you ask me they are best friends of those companies that turn out shoddy equipment and

provide bad support. And one of the reasons so many products are not thoroughly tested

before being released.

 

How long did it take the consumer (ginny pigs, involuntary beta testers) to discover the

banding issue after the release of the D200? NOT LONG! You would think that Nikon would

have discovered this early on. Maybe they did, seems hard to believe they didn't know

about it. I can see it now, in a board room somewhere at Nikon they discuss the issue and

decide to release it hopping most of the people who get a DEFECTIVE D200 are sheep.

 

Well, Bernard, Im not a sheep and I wont buy any more Nikon until they live up to there

products promises! Here that Nikon, NO SALE!

[ilkka_nissila]

Troy, the banding problem is greatly exaggerated. All digital cameras produce artifacts at the pixel level. The D200 I've got is no different in this respect. It produces very high quality images and all the banding discussion ... well, it's just pathetic.

 

In this case the advice "go and take pictures" is just right because there are very few real images that are affected by banding. With 2800 images on my D200 in two weeks, not a single one shows banding that I can see so far. It's not about being sheepish, it's just that the camera works just fine and what problems remain are 1) insignificant compared with other issues and 2) the lamp shot banding cannot be fixed because it's within the design of the camera.

 

There are much more significant things for Nikon to focus on than short banding on lamp shots.

[lahuasteca]

I've been looking for the MC-30 remote release cable for my F100. I think it also works on

D200. B&H is out of stock, KEH doesn't list it, Precision Photo in Boca Raton, FL (good place

for odd parts), has it out of stock, it's not listed at the Nikon Mall. Is the MC-30 remote

cable still being produced? The alternative remotes are very expensive.

[wayne_murphy8]

Okay, try this. In Australia now, Nikon authorised dealers (say about 20) each have at least

20 D200s on order for deposit paid customers (including me). There are no, nil, zip

D200s in australia from authorised dealers and there has not been a single camera

delivered in the last month. The local agent has advised dealers that there may be no

D200s delivered in April.

 

If you think that is customer service, than you are on another planet.