Replaceable focus screen on Mamiya C220f?

[russ_arcuri]

Just received a C220f to replace a slightly problematic C220. Funny thing is, this camera appears to have been modified to accept interchangeable focusing screens. Removing the WLF reveals a hinged mechanism which when released and lifted (the hinge is on the front edge), allows me to simply lift out a focusing screen from between two metal "book covers," if you catch my meaning.<p>

 

This particular focusing screen is quite a bit brighter than the original screen on the C220 I'm sending back. This is a nice bonus for me, since I found the 220's screen difficult to use with the 180/4.5 super attached.<p>

 

Unfortunately, though, the screen is also very well-worn, with inked-in 4x5 ratio marks for verticals (in red) and horizontals (in black). It was obviously a workhorse camera for a portrait photog. It's also scuffed up quite a bit. So now I'd like to replace it.<p>

 

The problem is that I don't know whether to order a screen designed for the C330f or C330s. Mamiya's own replacement screens are listed seperately in B&H's ad, so I assume that one will not fit in a mount intended for the other. How do I know which screen mount has been retrofitted to my C220f? As I mentioned above, it hinges at the front. Also, the screen is wider at the back than at the front... it kind of looks like this:<br>

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hinged edge of mount

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Another question: Are any of Mamiya's replacement screens (which B&H is selling off for only $20 - $30) significantly brighter than the C220's screen? I don't know if this screen I want to replace is a Mamiya, or a Beattie, or something else. If I can replace this one with a screen of approx. equal brightness, I will. But I'd also prefer to pay $20 or $30 for one of the clearance Mamiya screens than $110 for a Beattie, if that's possible. A split image screen would be nice but not necessary.<p>

 

I apologize for the absurd length of this question. Thank you in advance for any advice you can offer.

[russ_arcuri]

Feeling slightly embarrassed after finding the answer to one of these questions in Graham Patterson's Mamiya TLR pages. Apparently, my C220f has been retrofitted with the interchangeable screen mount from a C330s, as it hinges at the front and catches at the back.<p>

 

So I guess the only remaining question is the one of brightness... are Mamiya's split image screens for the C330s significantly brighter than the C220's non-interchangeable ground glass screen?<p>

 

Thank you again for your consideration.

[mark_hubbard]

Russ, two questions about your new "f": Does it have the focus-lock (like the RB) on the left focusing wheel? And does it have the newer WLF that has hinges in the middle of the side plates (and do the side and back plates come all the way up to the built-in magnifier)? I think it's a real bonus that your 220f was retrofitted for the newer "s" screens. I'd bet the new screens are brighter, but I'll leave it to Graham or others to say for sure. It sounds like a good one. -Mark

[russ_arcuri]

Mark - no, it doesn't have the focus lock. It isn't listed as a feature of the 220f on Graham's Mamiya pages, so I'm guessing the "f" designation is just a coincidence.<p>

 

The WLF appears to be the Type 1, although not the one listed in Graham's pages as original equipment on the 220f (it has the sportsfinder.)

[graham_patterson]

There is a chance that the C330s-type screen isn't a retro-fit, but original. My documentation on the C220f is sketchy, at best. I'm surprised that Mamiya would put an advanced feature like this on the 'budget' model. The WLF finder isn't much of a guide, as these were easily swapped.

 

<p>

 

If anyone can comment on C220f screens from direct observation, or from a manual, I'd like to know, and if necessary make corrections.

[russ_arcuri]

I don't know whether you'd consider this data authoritative, but the B&H web site only lists screens for the C330, C330f, and C330s. Likewise, Brightscreen's web site only lists models of their products for the 330 series.<p>

 

Unfortunately, I did not get a C220f manual with my C220f; I have only a photocopied C220 manual.

[russ_arcuri]

Hmmm... some more data to confuse the issue. I had some problems with the C220f mentioned above, so I traded it for another one in better shape. Surprisingly enough, the new one also has a replaceable focus screen, and this one looks less like a retrofit and more like the camera was designed this way. I'm starting to think that the C220f really did come with this feature. Doesn't ANYONE else here on MFD have a C220f?

[paul_chuah]

Yes, I do own a C220f. And the good news is that Beattie has produced focusing screens for this model, only recently. Safer to buy your screen from Beattie cos you won't know if the cheaper screens do fit your camera since there is no mention of compatibility. If you noticed the hinge on the frame of the screen, yes, this can be lifted only after unscrewing the tiny screws that are holding them down.(Haven't done that for a long time since I last cleaned them). For the benifit of Yashica Mat 124 owners, you'll be glad to know the Beattie screens are also now available for your cameras.(Just happened to check their website recently). Hope I'm of some help.

[mark_wickens1]

I just picked up a c220f and it also has the same removable focusing screen with hinged mount. I guess thats how they made em'...

[jonathan-wong]

<p>The Mamiya C330S and C220F shares the same focusing screen footprint. Beattie supplies the dedicated screen in B&H : # BEFSSIDGMC3Q Mfr # 83365<br>

The brightness is significantly brighter, and a joy to use. The C220 Professional and older C330F screen uses another foot print.<br /><br>

<br />The reason Mamiya discourages changing of screen on the C220F, is, I suppose, the sponge that presses down the screen onto the reference surface of the hinged mechanism, will turn into power after all these years. On many old C220F, the sponge has become bad, falls off, and very sticky. This would ruin the screen/mirror if not carefully removed. Therefore, changing the screen may require the service of a professional service technician. <br /><br>

<br />There is a work around. Use masking tape to slowly remove the screen, and stick out the disintegrated sponge. This may take up to an hour or two. Completely clean out the gunk, you can later replace the screen. You can use the C330S A matte, another original screen, or the Beattie. If you intend to fit in a Beattie, make sure the sponge is completely clean up and replaced by a new, narrow strip of good felt. Otherwise, you risk killing the new screen.<br /><br>

<br />In other designs, such as Rolleiflex F, the screen is pressed down by two strips of metal in the screen holder . The metal will of course never disintegrate. <br /><br>

</p>

[philippe_grunchec]

I'd like to give my C220 (not F!) a Beattie screen, but I cannot contact them: does anyone here have an email address?

Thx in advance!

[orsetto]

Before anyone jumps in with a "dead thread alert" - yes, I'm aware the previous post was a grave-digger. Nonetheless, the question still has relevance as people continue to re-discover the Mamiya TLR system.

 

This type of premium screen is not as widely available as it once was, given the very high cost: expensive aftermarket screens made sense when the average cost of a camera was much more than the screen, but today thats often reversed: the cost of a premium bright screen is often more than the complete camera is worth (exceptions being the Rolleiflex and Hasselblad).

 

As owner of an extensive Mamiya TLR system myself, I would recommend looking into selling your older C220 and buying the newer C220f instead. The C220f and 330S by default come with a MUCH brighter contrastier acrylic original screen, with a MUCH improved light-tight WLF. If you sell your old 220 and shop carefully, the 220f can be acquired for the same or less cost than something like a Beattie or Maxwell screen. The C220f also offers an easily user-replaceable screen feature, and can use all the optional split image, microprism and checker screens made for its sister 330S model. These 330S screens are not common, but turn up periodically on eBay for about @ $50 new old stock.

 

If you'd really rather invest the money to upgrade your old 220, the Beattie screen technology is supposedly still available thru successor company Reflexite. They don't sell direct, but refer you to affiliated dealers in North America or Europe. The "find a local dealer" page is here, and you can choose from six screen variations here (scroll down to Mamiya C220 group). Note removing/replacing the screen in an original C220 is VERY tricky: there are several tiny shims that are easily lost, and the brackets that affix the screen to its mounting frame are a huge PITA to screw back on. Also, you'll probably need to make your own shims to prop up the new screen, because you'll not be re-using the now-redundant original fresnel condenser. Most C220 owners would likely need to pay a camera repair tech to install the new screen, piling on even more cost.

 

Personally, I found it much more practical and economical to sell my C330f and C220 seven years ago, and replace them with the more modern C330S and C220f. The newer models look a bit plainer and blacker, but the improved screen and WLF make them vastly more usable. Mamiya enthusiasts are fortunate to have the C220f/330S alternative: owners of other TLRs like Rolleiflex have more limited (and expensive) screen upgrade options.

Edited December 28, 2018 by orsetto