Manual lenses on a DSLR

[rachel_f1]

I have been using a Nikon FM2 for a Looong time and i also have 2

excellent Nikkor lenses. I'm tired of using film and having half the

roll be crap - so I'm eager to get a DSLR body.

 

Herein lies the rub: I'd like to use my old lenses on a new body.

I'm not keen on spending $1800 on a D200 - so I thought I'd opt for

a D50 (cheap and cheerful but good according to reviews). The D50

fits my lenses but since my lenses are completely manual - the D50

won;t even recognize the aperture opening - which can wreak havoc on

the light meter.

 

That said (and here's the question) do you think it is still

feasible/wise to use the D50 base regardless of the issue above? I

could use a separate light meter and even 'wing' it - and plus I'd

get to see the results in the viewing screen after the shot is taken

to make adjustments.

 

Do you think this is a wise thing to do?

[james_lai]

What lenses do you already have? If you can't meter with them and don't have a handheld meter, you can guesstimate the exposure and then adjust using the histogram on the DSLR. You could also pick up a new Nikkor 50mm f/1.8 which is cheap (about US$100) but good.

[gene_sisgoreo]

You may also want to look at Olympus E-300/500 with an F mount Adaptor

see: http://www.cameraquest.com/adapt_olyE1.htm

[godfrey]

While I prefer to have a meter available for ease of use, with the instant review of a digital

camera it's not as big a deal as you might suppose to estimate exposure, take a shot, then

adjust via the histogram. After a while you get good enough at estimating exposure,

particularly if you're capturing in RAW format, that you realize much of the big ballyhoo on

fancy metering systems is over-hyped.

 

My concern is that the Nikon D50 and D70 bodies have somewhat poor viewfinder optics

compared to an FM2. The DSLR bodies, given the smaller format of the sensor, are

naturally going to have a smaller frame in the viewfinder, but these bodies have relatively

inefficient pentamirror optics rather than a bright pentaprism. That is the biggest

justification for the D200 to me: its viewfinder is excellent for manual focusing operation.

it's also why I bought the Pentax *ist DS ... it provides a similarly high quality viewfinder.

 

If you can live with the D50 or D70s viewfinder, either of them provides a good entry point

to a DSLR system with your existing lenses. You'll then want to consider what other lenses

you need to obtain the field of view you want with the smaller format.

 

Godfrey

[scott_eaton]

<I>My concern is that the Nikon D50 and D70 bodies have somewhat poor viewfinder optics compared to an FM2. </i><p>*WAY* worse, and the Olympus cameras mentioned above are worse than that.

[etan_lightstone]

I'm not sure how it'd work with the D50.. but I've used manual m42 mount lenses on my Canon 300D. It works fine.

 

As long as you can "stop-down" the lens for the camera to meter.. it should work ok.

 

Normally with those lenses you twist the aperture rim.. but the mechanics of the camera only trigger the aperture in the lens at the moment of exposure. In your case you need an adapter that screw the lever in permanent dof preview.. so when you twist the aperture ring.. it meters correctly.

 

It'll be quite annoying to use though...as it will get quite DARK in the viewfinder.

 

You'll have to frame and focus (and there is no split screen focus aid in autofocus cameras, so that will be quite difficult to do accurately), then once you've composed your shot... twist to the desired aperture.. meter and expose.

 

It's a hassle. you'll probably think its novel and fun for the first month.. then sell your manual lenses and get autofocus ones instead.

[godfrey]

Etan,

 

On the Nikon D50 and D70 bodies, the metering circuitry is not powered without a

compatible lens. There's no option for stopped-down metering with a lens that does not have

the appropriate contacts.

 

Godfrey

[godfrey]

Scott,

 

While I agree with you on the E300 viewfinder, I found the E500 viewfinder to be pretty good.

I hope the new E330 has a better viewfinder than the E300 does.

 

Godfrey

[etan_lightstone]

In that case.. amusingly. You'd be better off using your old manual nikon lenses on an Canon Digital rebel.. by use of adapter. And then buy regular canon autofocus lenses down the road.

[james_lai]

Yep, ironic but true, get a lens mount adapter and any Canon DSLR will work better with old Nikon lenses than the entry-level Nikon DSLRs.

[lex_jenkins]

I use my AI and AI-S Nikkors on my D2H. The viewfinder is bright and crisp enough for easy manual focusing and I get full metering. If using your existing lenses is important you probably shouldn't buy anything less than the D200.

 

OTOH...

 

IM not so humble O, there's seldom any real advantage to using AI and AI-S Nikkors on a Nikon dSLR. There are various reasons:

 

1. I can manually focus very quickly. I cannot manually focus as quickly and precisely as my D2H with an AF-S Nikkor. No point fighting technology.

 

2. With a good AF-S lens the D50 won't care that the viewfinder isn't as bright and crisp as the FM2. It will still autofocus quickly and precisely. So while you may not get the visual feedback you're accustomed to, you'll still get well focused photos. The faster the lens, the better the autofocus. A 50/1.8D AF Nikkor an autofocus quicker than a slowpoke variable aperture AF-S zoom.

 

3. The D50 and D70(s) viewfinders aren't bad. They just aren't up to the standards of the very good FM2(n) finders, which are nearly as good as an F3 finder (I have both and often prefer the FM2N for low light shooting because the red LED meter readout is very visible). OTOH, any dSLR finder is better than most P&S digicam finders, which are like peering through the bottom of a soda bottle. I've managed to take good photos with my Olympus C-3040Z digicam in very dim lighting despite the distorted, dark tunnel vision optical finder.

 

4. The new DX and "digital ready/optimized" lenses are no hype. They have superior multicoating, especially on the rear elements, which greatly improves contrast, color saturation and apparent sharpness by minimizing flare. dSLRs introduce a unique problem - the shiny sensor reflects light back toward the rear element of the lens, which in turn reflects light back to the sensor, in an infinite loop. This produces veiling flare, a type of flare that is not readily obvious as ghosting or iris shaped artifacts. It casts a sort of fog over the image, reducing contrast, color saturation and apparent sharpness. My 85/2 AI-S is very sharp wide open on my film cameras but only mediocre on my D2H because the optics weren't designed with a dSLR in mind. Ditto my 28/3.5 PC-Nikkor, which is excellent on my film Nikons and just okay on my D2H. Not only are contrast, saturation and apparent sharpness reduced, but chromatic aberration is much more apparent.

 

While some folks criticize the smaller image circle of DX Nikkors and similarly designed third party lenses because they are not fully compatible with 35mm SLRs, the advantages offered are well worth the compromise.

 

As an example, the 18-70/3.5-4.5 DX AF-S provides contrastier, crisper looking photos on my D2H than my older 28-85/3.5-4.5 AF Nikkor, which is a good performer on my film cameras. An exception is the older style 35-70/2.8D AF Nikkor, which is good on any camera, but this is Nikon's best buy in their entire zoom lineup.

 

Only a couple of my manual focus Nikkors offer excellent optical performance on my D2H: My 105/2.5 AI; 300/4.5 AI ED non-IF Nikkor. My other favorites for film Nikons are disappointments: 28/3.5 PC-Nikkor; 50/2 AI; 85/2 AI-S; and a handful of good third party lenses.

 

I think the D50 is a good choice for the available light photographer because it offers, arguably, the best low light, high ISO performance of any Nikon dSLR regardless of price. I've seen several full resolution photos from this model at ISO 1600 and they have far less luminance and chroma noise than my D2H at 1600. The compromise is that the D50 is not fully compatible with Nikon's excellent CLS flash system. But that may not be a major factor in your decision.

 

So if you buy a D50 plan on buying at least one really good AF or AF-S lens as a complement. The 18-70/3.5-4.5 DX AF-S Nikkor "kit zoom" (because it has been offered as a kit with the D70 and D70s) is a good low budget choice. Don't bother with the newer and less expensive variable aperture DX zooms. They aren't as well made and don't match the optical performance of the original kit zoom.

 

If the budget can swing it, you might consider the 17-55/2.8 DX AF-S Nikkor as an all purpose lens for the D50. Depending on your shooting style this lens might serve you well for most of your shooting. Between the fast aperture, which aids quick autofocusing in low light, and the Silent Wave Motor, it would autofocus very nicely with the D50.

 

A rock bottom budget lens that's an excellent performer is the 50/1.8D AF Nikkor. While it lacks the SWM of the AF-S Nikkors, the fast aperture really helps with quick autofocusing in available light shooting. It's one of my favorites for shooting public school sports indoors, such as volleyball and basketball, since most high schools have inadequate and uneven lighting.

 

Anyway, don't feel pressured to buy more camera than you really need. As much as I like my D2H and appreciate the viewfinder quality, I've considered the D50 as a backup for available light shooting because of the quality results at high ISOs. It would beat the socks off my current backup digicam, an Olympus C-3040Z.

[godfrey]

Etan and James:

 

My only disagreement with your notion of buying a Canon body to use with older Nikon

lenses is that with the Canon body plus adapter setup you don't get auto-diaphragm

operation. I would find that more inconvenient than the lack of metering on a D50 body.

 

I agree with the other respondent who suggested buying at least one current series Nikon

lens designed for the DSLR body, whichever one you end up purchasing. It makes good

sense as it will allow you to exploit all the capabilities of the new body while retaining use

of lenses that you've had for a while.

 

I did this with my Pentax *ist DS kit ... I started with one current series DA lens and a brace

of older manual focus lenses. After finding which focal lengths worked well for me, I

upgraded all my lenses to current series, AF enabled models. I still manual focus them a

fair bit of the time, but I like the newer lenses for their improved performance and ability

to work with all functions supported by the body.

 

Godfrey

[John Crowe]

I use a Nikon 14/2.8, 200/2, and 400/2.8 on my 10D and Elan and much prefer having metering rather than auto aperture. Of course the two telephotos are ALWAYS wide open, so its a no-brainer. So it depends on what lenses you use mostly and how you use them.

[jcuknz]

I would like to assure you that it is quite possible to use old manual film lens with some DSLR so long as in Manual Mode it gives you a read-out of what it thinks of the combination of aperture and shutter speed you have choosen. I am using Pentax lenses with EOS to M42 adaptors in a D60 and apart from the fact I have to 'work for my living' and don't have some smart AF/AE system doing all the drudgery for me there is no problem.

 

You simply take half trigger in the D60 and under the viewfinder is a plus/minus two stop indicator and a yellow indicator. So long as you are within the 2 stop either way you can quickly adjust to give the 'correct' exposure or deliberately under-expose by a bit etc.

 

I have this indicator in my Pro-sumer cameras so I would be suprised if all DSLRs don't have it when in M mode. But I have heard that the D50 is not as 'simple' as one would expect and has funny defaults when not working with it's 'proper' lenses. So just make sure the camera you buy works like my D60 and you will be AOK :-)

[david_feindel]

I just sold my last AIS lens, so I can't verify this on my D-50, but... I believe the green LED "in focus" light comes on in the viewfinder when you're properly focused. So although its not AF, it does help you overcome the *not real good* viewfinder. So pick your exposure and shoot. I agree with the above opinions--buy at least one AF lens. Used is an option if $ are at issue. But the D-50 is wonderful. Very, very good high ISO pictures.

[ron_goodenow]

I have an Olympus E-300 and an odd set of manual lenses which I use with adapters (OM and PK mounts). Ok, the viewfinder isn't perfect, but with the new M1 eyecup I get extremely good results. Remember, with many 'prime' lenses you can let a lot more light in than with kit lenses for focusing. On the 300 these manual lenses only require manual focusing and settings in fully auto or aperture priority. The camera does the rest. There are two caveats -- the camera's spot metering mode doesn't work with manual lenses (the center weighted does) and the 4/3rds sensor doubles 35mm focal length. This all said I am doing a higher and higher percentage of my photography with these lenses. They are fun to use and require a bit more concentration, which can make for better photos. Oh, and with the Oly's dust shaker you can be constantly changing lenses and not worry about sensor dirt. As for the 300 itself, I am extremely happy with its build quality and overall performance. There's a lot of anti-Olympus yakking in this group by people who haven't used an Oly, but at the very least you might want to check out the 300 or 500.

[douglas_green1]

Among the Olympus models, the E-1 has the best viewfinder, and you can switch the focusing screen to a Katz-eye split image screen that makes manually focusing reasonably easy. IMHO, the E-300 is slightly better than the E-500, but both are somewhat tougher than the E-1 for manual focusing. Ironically, the E-1 is slightly slower at autofocusing than the E-300 and E-500. As for the E-330, I don't know, as I've never touched one, but I would expect that the viewfinder is basically the same as the E-300 - However, some reviewers have stated that the best use of the new live view function is for manually focusing on the LCD.

 

But, for fast manual focus lenses, I've been able to get decent results without too much problem with the E-300.

[eskoufos]

I use manual focus lenses on my D70 very frequently, especially mirror telephoto lenses (there is no problem with those), 8mm fisheyes and 50mm f1.2. What I do is I take a picture using the sunny 16 rule, check it on the LCD, if it does not work, I manually adjust the aperture or shutter speed. With the post photo editing (photoshop), you can allow yourself some margin without worrying about getting a perfect exposure directly off the camera...

[stwrtertbsratbs5]

Some of the older lenses may need to be converted to "AI". The good news is that it does not cost much.

 

http://www.aiconversions.com/