pics - this is what i mean

[frank granovski]

See the bar on the left.<div></div>

[frank granovski]

And here's that little angel again shot a few days ago. Note the dork bar.<div></div>

[frank granovski]

See the difference with my Nikon FM2T and 135mm E lens? Nothing dorky.<div></div>

[stu weinstein]

I would think a processing problem? Stu

[frank granovski]

And this one with my Nikon FM2T and 135mm E lens. No dorks here.<div></div>

[jan_brittenson]

If it were B&W done yourself I would have guessed inadequate developer volume. But since it's color, presumably done by a roller type processor, the most likely explanation is errors in curtain timing. Verify it on another roll; if it persists get the shutter looked at. (It's probably way off on exposure, as well.)

[frank granovski]

Pretty much every picture from my Leica CL have these bars. Now it's even worse. I never had these bars with any other non-Leica camera, including the ELECTROfying Yashica GSN. Info here:

 

http://www.yashica-guy.com

[frank_scheitrowsky1]

Frank, is you pristine Leica CL still not working correctly? Or are these examples of the old problem before returning the camera to be fixed a second time?

[ronald_moravec1]

I had this problem with both M6 classics and an M3. DaG said it was a common problem with the early M6`s. He relpaced the light shields in front of the shutter.

 

$75 ea and problem gone.

 

On my camera the banding was across the sky and actually extended between the frames.

 

Pray you can get replacements. There were upgraded ones for the M6`s.

[jl-smith]

I assume these examples are close to full frame, and the defect is on the long axis?

 

ok, if I remember my CL, the shutter travels horizontally, like Ms and screwmounts? (the CLE vertically?).

 

If so, this is a variation in shutter opening width, - a narrowing, right along the edge, and probably only occurs at certain faster speeds, which may be why you see it in these outdoor shots. I have had it on one of Leica III, a glob of something was caught on the bottom edge of one shutter edge or the other. At sync speed or slower, the proportion of the open slit that was covered is trivial, but at the faster speeds, it began to encroach on the increasingly smaller slit opening between first and second curtain. It removed with a pair of tweezers.

 

Open your camera back, set it on B, and look at the back edge of the front curtain, or the front edge of the back curtain (when shutter is fully open.). as your shgutter speeds increase, the spacing will decrease, and even small protruberances can be a signficant amount of exposure space.

 

Of course, if I am wrong and the CL has a vertical shutter, then your shutter has a problem with either its acceleration or its braking mechanisms, and it abruptly speeds up (your photos are underexposed), for that precise distance seen. This seems unlikely, such defects usually give a smoother transition of exposure differences.

 

One way or another, you should be able to figure out about where the defect is. Do you hold your vertical shots always with the same camera orientation (shutter release up/down?). The defect is on field left, which woudl mean negative right edge, and if you know how you hold the camera, you will know whether it is camera top or bottom you need to look at.

 

A littel looking is not tragic, just don't go poking too much. Try to keep greasy fingers off the shutter.

[djl251]

This is the one you just had fixed for the second time? Sell it and be glad it's only a camera.

It's not worth the aggravation

[jl-smith]

yea. Ronald may be right as well, likely a misplaced something in the camera cavity, which likely can be repositioned (I do not think the CL had this as a design flaw).

 

The key question of shutter edge effect versus an obstruction in front of or behind the shutter is whether the defect is there and equally evident at all shutter speeds. If it is, it is not the shutter. If it is progressively less evident as shutter speeds slow down, it is more likely shutter (e.g., at 1/2 second, the flakiness of shutter travel or edge behavior is trivial compared to overall exposure (unless you have a completely screwed up shutter and exposure, which you do not).

 

Try to mechanically figure out top/bottom, shutter speed behavior, if it is not obvious, the repair guy needs this information.

[jl-smith]

shoot, I keep on leaving out crucial bits for this type test. A mechanical block in front of the shutter could (depending on position) be lens and aperture sensitive, so try to arrange whatever tests with a constant, wide open lens. That means varying light intensity as you change shutter speeds.

 

Were these shot with the same lens? A 90 mm lens, versus a wide angle? Is there a misplaced baffle in your lens?

[frank granovski]

Thanks for all the info and suggestions. Yes, these pics were taken after it was "fixed" the second time. Regarding the quality of the pics, I had them scanned as one sheet on a photo-copier, sent via e-mail, and then I cut them out via Paint Shop Pro for Windoes 3.11 (16 bit). The scans don't do the actual photos justice.

[pppp]

Thanks, Frank. You made my day with those captions. Your'e one in a million.

[al_kaplan1]

Frank, the South Florida Fishing Club is having our annual pig roast tomorrow since we cancelled the dolphin tournament because of the hurricane. Maybe I'll put the 15mm VC lens on my CL body to shoot the pig roast. It just might be possible that the problem occurs only when the CL is in close proximity to roasting pigs. Have you tried using your CL to photograph any kosher barbeques? Then we can narrow down the problem to charcoal smoke or roasting meat, and/or what kind of meat.

[frank granovski]

Both those dork bar pics were taken with the 90mm lens. With the 40mm, the bars are also there.

[jerry_lehrer]

Guys--- He has had that problem before. His pet technician, Horse, has proven hiself incapable of repairing it. Sherry could fix it within a very short time. But that would take away Frank's ability

to bitch and moan. Pathetic.

 

Jerry

[awahlster]

It is a shutter curtin problem this happens on almost any camera with a cloth focal plane shutter if the right conditions of adjustment happen. I have had the same effect on a Canon FD mount body.

 

If I remember correctly there was question as to the skill level of your chosen repairman Frank I strongly suggest you seak out someone properly skilled in the CL for the next fix.

[andrew_hall1]

>His pet technician, Horse, has proven hiself incapable of repairing it.

 

Let's give Horst the benefit of the doubt - after all, the unfixable pristine camera could very well be conjured up by his itchy fingers, just like the endless flame baits.

[andrew_hall1]

...and of course, I don't mean Horst conjured up the camera.

[________1]

You got this camera at Beau Photo in Vancouver? Did it not come with *some* kind of warranty?

[Robert_Lai]

Frank, I verified on Stephen Gandy's site that the CL has a vertically running shutter. When you turn the camera on its side to take a portrait (i.e. long axis of the frame is vertical), the shutter travel ends up on one or the other side of the final picture. Essentially, you STILL have tapering of the shutter. That is, the second shutter curtain runs faster than the first, leading to a progressively narrower slit as the curtains run across the frame. At the end of the travel, the slit has narrowed so much that you have noticable underexposure. This would be evident only at high shutter speeds. Want to prove it to yourself? Try a flash picture - look, no more bands as the flash fires only when the film is fully uncovered by the shutter curtains, and before the second one makes its run. Your camera still needs servicing of the shutter spring tensions so that the curtains run at the same speed.<p>This also happens with Nikons after about 20-25 years without a CLA. My FG has a vertically running Copal square shutter with aluminum alloy blades. I decided to try out my new 300mm f/4 AFS on the FG, and found a co-operative seagull at my local park. To my disappointment, the dreaded tapering band showed up as I fired at 1/1000 (f/4) on a roll of Fuji Velvia 50. The dark band to the right of the frame is the same problem that you've got with your CL. There is also a bit of light falloff with this lens wide open, so there's a bit of darkening towards the corners also. That's a lens issue and not a shutter issue. Closed down to f/5.6, the lens gives even illumination. In my case, the local repair shop (a monopoly in my town) wanted $150 to adjust the shutter curtain travel. Since I paid $125 for the camera, I couldn't justify fixing it. Instead, I sold it off at a loss on ebay for $36. I DID honestly describe the problem that the camera had on the auction, and I also included this seagull picture to show what I was talking about. Since your CL is considerably more expensive than my FG, and you seem to love it, you may want to get it properly adjusted.<div></div>

[fjords]

Frank, develope your limitations, crop the dorkness.

[Robert_Lai]

I should also add that your Yashica Electro will NEVER EVER have this problem, as it has a leaf shutter in between the lens elements.<p>Leaf shutters can get sluggish. Try taking the Electro out at dusk, with a tripod. Try various shutter/aperture combinations for the same scene. See if 1 second, 1/2 second, etc., give you the same exposure if you adjust the aperture appropriately. They should. If the 1 second exposure is MUCH more exposed than the shorter shutter speeds, your Electro's shutter may need cleaning. Of course, slide film helps when you're trying to verify proper operation of your camera. With colour negative film, imperfections in exposure by a few f/stops can be corrected for by the printing lab.