"Hot" gear

[jmf]

I'm looking at a used RB in a pawn shop (not local). I've never dealt

with them before, and I have no specific reason to be suspicious, but

it seems "odd" that an RB would show up there. It's with a big flash

rig and looks like a wedding setup. I've tried to google the s/n and

looked in the forum here. I've talked to their local LE's, and got no

hits. I hate to support some thief. Any suggestions on other

"registries" to look in?

[d_purdy]

There are a lot of potential reasons for a camera like that to end in a pawn

shop. ... the owner died and a family member knows nothing of the photo

world, or someone needed instant money then never came back to pay,

perhaps ask the shop owner if he knows the story or knows for certain it isn't

hot. If it is that cheap and you want it I would get it.

[d_purdy]

Also I currently know a couple of photographers that would love it if their gear

was all stolen. they could get a new digital system with the insurance money.

[tree]

I don't think it's odd to see this. As another response stated, there are multitudinous reasons this could be there. A local pawnshop here in Worcester Massachusetts was advertising both an RZ67 and a complete Nikon F3 system... if only I had some disposable income...

[OCULUS New York]

I purchased what I lovingly refer to as "The Pile" off ePrey from a Pawn Shop seller in Florida. He knew nothing about anything and frankly, didn't want to respond to my basic questions. I got a beautiful Rolleiflex SLX 2, and an equally nice, rare Rolleiflex 3003, and 7 lenses (between the 2), a big Metz flash system, a Sekonic Studio meter, 3 aluminum cases, some film, and extension cords etc., all for $1100.

 

He begrudgingly claimed everything worked, but when it arrived, I realized that he couldn't have tested either without their missing dedicated chargers. He agreed, and offered me a $100 rebate because of the mystery. (The $100 MO was issued by a Hess gas station...).

 

So, it didn't take me long to figure out that this stuff came from the back of somebody's car. But then, just the 50mm wide angle lens for the SLX was worth the price of admission. I've since sold the 3003 and recouped my investment.

 

Think of it this way: sure you may be INDIRECTLY subsidizing theivery, but pawn shops are now so regulated, and always the first stop on any detectives case research, you really have little concern. And besides, ePrey is now the route of choice for most upscale thieves.

 

Here it is after a good scrubbing:

http://d6d2h4gfvy8t8.cloudfront.net/2016244-lg.jpg

 

Cheers,

Ray Hull

[jmf]

Well, no pawn shop dealer is EVER going to admit that they even suspect an item is hot because of the legal ramifications. It did occur to me that it's just a matter of a ticket not being redeemed or someone in need of a quick sale. It does seem most used stuff ends up on ebay anymore (even from estate auctions). Our papers have quit having a "photography" listing in the classifieds.

 

I've tried to do my "due diligence". I guess I can't really say something at KEH has a "clear title". The price is good, but not too good. Who knows? I'll follow up once it arrives.

[paul_sauer]

As someone who has had gear stolen -- an you will, too if you shoot enough and get

around a little -- I would never buy any gear my gut told me is probably stolen. Bad

karma. Bad for your fellow shooter.

 

Most photographers would sell through the auction site, through online classifieds, or

would trade in at a photoshop. A pawn shop would pay the very least.

 

Follow your conscience and your gut.

[rich815]

What's "ePrey"?

[35mmdelux]

I bought a really clean Rollieflex at a pawn shop 10 years ago - paid $180 (US). Nothing told me that there was a title problem. Some p-shops, but not all, reek when you walk in. I'd just turn around and walk out, why bother.

 

I don't think its odd to find a camera in a pawn shop. Some p-shops carry Rolex and diamonds. The p-shop in Las Vegas carries all kinds of weird things. Trust your gut. If the sellers are weirdos, walk out.

[tarashnat]

Ebay...

[dan_fromm1]

Um, here in New Jersey a person who possesses an item that a reasonable person reasonably should have believed was stolen risks prosecution as a receiver of stolen goods. I didn't know this until I sat on a jury that had to decide whether a poor kid should have suspected the old car for which he could provide no receipt or title transfer or even seller had been stolen.

 

Our pawn shops and storefront dealers in used goods are very cautious about what they take in.

 

Other states may have different laws.

[lee_shively]

Standard practice around here (and I'm sure elsewhere as well) is for the local police to check pawn shop items on a regular basis. They review reports of stolen items and check serial numbers before the stuff gets put out for sale.

 

Pawn shop people in my area are careful about possible stolen items. They don't want to buy them and they don't want to sell them. They report suspicious sellers to the police. The stuff they sell may not be in great shape or have the best prices but it's a virtual guarantee that it's "clean".

[jmf]

If you tell the police you've had a $500 dollar item stolen, they'll hand you a report to fill out and thats the last that will be done about it (unless they break up a ring and find a house o'loot). Heck, Denver police wouldn't even dispatch a car, they just sent the form in the mail. I think we can forget about a detective checking shops unless it's part of a bigger investigation, or some periodic crackdown on them.

 

I agree, the last place a photographer would sell this is a pawn shop (which is what triggered the question in the first place). Maybe an unclaimed ticket, a PO'd spouse (but honey, we just had drinks...), someone needing cash quick to prevent knee injury.

 

I can't get a read on the shop, but they are a major ebayer and at least have a good rep there. I did do what background checking I could and didn't turn up anything, so I went with it

[joseph_linzner]

Jim the Paw Shop Laws vary with Jurisdiction. In Toronto, Ontario the government has legislated that a pawn shop owner must record a dailing intake sheet including serial numbers of all items and with identification of the person leaving the goods. This is collected daily by the police and entered into their stolen items computer. This is the reason behind the fact that goods can not be sold in the first 30 days. Secondly a buyer from a pawn shop is protected under the Sale of Goods Act (varies with State/Province) which all contain a provision that "a bona fide purchaser for value without notice" is protected in case there is a title problem later on. Your choice whether to purchase will also depend on the purchase price. I recently purchased a Mamiya RB Pro S with 90mm lens, wl viewinder and 120mm back with an extra chimney finder for $225.00US on E-bay. It appears that there is a massive dump of the bulky 6x7 cameras in favour of digital ones. This is especially true with wedding photographers. If the pawn shop offers you a good deal go for it and pay for it via Visa which can be reversed if there is a problem.

[Spearhead]

Many states (maybe all by now) have laws that require holding items for a period of time (30 days in California) to see if they are stolen. Also, many states (maybe all by now) require that all items a pawnshop receives be itemized including serial numbers and sent in to the police on a regular basis. These types of laws have cut way down on the amount of stolen merchandise being pushed through pawn shops. Not that it doesn't happen, but it's a lot less likely.

[roger krueger]

Pawn shop laws are only useful against stupid thieves or in isolated cities.

 

When I had gear stolen even the San Diego police admitted that something stolen in San

Diego just gets sold in Los Angeles--or even Escondido, an adjoining separate-city

suburb--and none of their theft report vs. pawn report checks will pick it up.

 

So they nail stoned teenagers occasionally, but any thief with half a brain is undeterred.

[Spearhead]

Statistics show that licensed pawn shops are well under 1% in terms of outlets for stolen goods. Flea markets are much more common.

[johnmarkpainter]

I used to buy LOTS of things from Pawn shops. (mostly Music gear)

 

I can tell you that there is a lot of stolen goods in Pawn shops (I have recovered several

items for friends!) BUT just because it is in a Pawn shop doesn't mean it is stolen. It

might mean that it hasn't been well cared for though.

 

Generally, somebody needed quick cash. I pawned a guitar to pay my Heat bill

once....happily, that was a long time ago.

[jmf]

Externally, the camera would be a 9+. There's dust on the bellows but they seem light tight. There was a roll of vps160 in the film back and a rectangular tripod plate on the base.

 

Closer inspection was not pleasent. Even though the exterior showed almost no wear, the interior was another story. Every, and I mean EVERY light trap seal was goo. The film back, the RB adapter, and the back of the body. Goo. The cocking lever moved fine and I dnd't hear any "odd" noises. The lens (the "C" 90mm) was another piece of work. dusty with incipent element seperation visible when wide open (but not 1/2 a stop down. What I would guess are smoking deposits on the focusing screen (they cleaned up with screen cleaner). Almost makes me think it sat in someone's attic.

 

I think we can definitively say it wasn't pawned by a photographer.

 

The whole mess (plus a sunpak 622) ran about $250. It REALLY looks low milage (other than the seals)