Best inexpensive fixed lens rangefinder

[keith_slater]

Hi,

I have realized that I don't need zoom lenses, and I enjoy using

rangefinder focusing, size, and the fact they are quite. I currently

have several slr's, pack film camera's, and others. The only 35mm

rangefinder that I have is a petri racer, easy to use, but not the

best glass. I have also owned a konica III, that is gone now. My

question is I have watched several auctions with Yashica's, Canon's,

and others. Most seem to go for around $20. Out of the lot of cheap

rangefinders, which do you find the best? What about russian

rangefinders? I do like having in a built in light meter, and a

filter size that is easy to find. Actually, the petri would be

perfect, however I want better glass. I know some of your suggestions

may range into the 70's Thanks in advance,

Keith

[jay_capodiferro]

Konica Auto S2. Great glass, solid feel. My fixed lens rangefinder of choice.

[Troll]

My vote is for the KONICA S3, but they ain't cheap. Lens is every bit as good as a Summicron 40mm, AE exposure, standard 49mm filters, viewfinder framelines completely visible with eyeglasses, battery lasts 10+ years, weighs less than a Leica CL. In addition to the one that I've been using since 1975 (I'm on my second battery), I have two brand new ones still in their boxes, sitting in my closet just in case.

[BernardMiller]

I have an Olympus 35RC that I really like. Solid, nice glass, fits into the palm of your hand and your pants pocket.

[rob_murray]

Best ones I have found are the Konica Auto S2, Minolta Himatic 9/11, Yahsica GSN, Olympus 35rc, Canonet GIII was good but not as good as

the others I mentioned.

[roman_sonnleitner1]

Do you have any kind of price limit? Any other preferences (exchangeable lenses, compactness, etc.)? There are really a lot of possible choices in this field... Built-in light-meter usually is a problem - on a lot of these older cameras they either don't work any longer, or use unavailable mercury batteries (though there are - not perfect - workarounds).

 

Fixed lens, not so compact: Minolta Himatic 7S, 9, 11; Konica Auto S2 (great glass, great finder, though rather heavy & clunky); Yashica Minister, Lynx (great glass), Electro (no manual option, unfortunately - battery dependent), but the lens is great); Sokol Automat (Russian fixed-lens RF, rather bulky, but with very good lens; supposed to work with modern batteries); various Canonets (the earlier, larger series); and many more...

 

Fixed lens, compact: Minolta HiMatic 7SII (the best choice in this category, IMHO - great glass, solid build, nice design); Konica Auto S3 (pricey, no manual option, IIRC); Canonet QL17 GIII (the most expensive choice, due to 'cult' status); Olympus 35RC (very compact, good glass, though weird 43.5mm filter size) and 35RD (less compact); Konica C35 (very compact, GREAT lens, very cheap - but program mode only).

 

Older RFs with changeable lenses: with price in mind, Russian RFs seem to be the best choice; most of these don't have a lightmeter (except for some later FEDs - which are rather bulky); my favorites are the Zorki 6 and the FED 2 in LTM mount, and the Kiev 4; favorite lenses: Jupiter-8, -9 and -12, Industar-61L/D.

Make sure to buy from a reliable seller with these, though - liek Fedka, Oleg (www.okvintagecamera.com) or Ebay-sellers 'cupog', 'alex-photo', 'grizzly33bear' and a few more.

[nickc1]

I don't have much experience with the Japanese RFs but for what it is worth I would suggest either a late FED 1 (small, pocketable, 'retro') a FED 2 (simple and best quality control of the LSM lot) or a Kiev 4 (overall best design and quality) - I struck lucky and bought a Kiev 4 with a working meter that is Ok with print film, so is 'all in one lump', but I don't mind carrying a small meter if I am also carrying extra lenses etc - and if I want small the sunny 16 rule works for me. FSU rangefinder cameras are all good designs, but shoddily assembled with non existant quality control, so if you get a good one it is good - most are not however. The best specified is the Zorki 4, but the shutter is very fragile and if it has been mistreated at any stage can break. Lens wise there are no bad 'uns in the usual range(35mm, 50mm, 90mm, 135mm - all Zeiss copies), but again quality control is a problem - often to the extent that lenses are wrongly set up from new and have NEVER been in focus. The late 50mm LSM lens with rare earth coating (Industar 61L/D f2.8 55mm) is a cracker and if properly set up can match vitually any other LSM lens. My biased advice is to buy a cheap FSU camera from a recommended source (see reply above) and give it a go - get an unmetered FED 2 or even better a Kiev and take pictures with it.

[peter_evans4]

<p><em>Konica Auto S2 (great glass, great finder, though rather heavy & clunky)</em></p><p>Very shiny compared with the "silver" cameras of today, and a bit noisy as well. Takes forbidden batteries. But the framelines don't just move to compensate for parallax, they <em>contract</em> as you focus closer. Few other cameras manage that.</p><p>I saw (at a distance) a fascinating fixed-lens rangefinder the other day: a fifty something year old East German "Belmira" (with CZJ Tessar 50/2.8). The (generously sized) viewfinder is on the right, Moskva style. Film winding appears to be on the left. It could be good for the left-eyed -- but I don't know, as I didn't ask for it to be taken out of the showcase.</p>

[Mike Gammill]

Yashica MG-1's are usually inexpensive. They are battery dependent and are large due to the 45mm focal length. You get aperture priority automation.

More compact, but often overlooked, is the Canonette 28. While about the same size as the GIII, it has an f2.8 lens and is fully programmed. They are usually less expensive than the GIII.

[kerkko_kehravuo]

The best pair with parallax correction, high speed lens, sophisticated shutter, high mechanical quality, etc. is maybe Canonet G-III 17 and Yashica Lynx 14E. I did test photos of both and optical performance is about the same, maybe Lynx slightly, but only slightly, better. Lynx is also quite much larger in size beacause of f:1,4 speed lens. A good Lynx may cost only 50 euros (cheap!), Canonet double much. I would prefer Lynx because of faster lens and longer shutter speeds (1 s vs 1/4 s). Also manual exposure with Lynx is so much more simple, on the other hand it has no AE.

 

Kerkko K.

[ben conover]

Hi, I bought a Fuji GW690ii for $80.

 

The fixed lens is outa this world.

 

The negative size is 55m by 82mm.

 

Cheers.

[rustys pics]

I have experience with the Canonet QL19, Yaschica ELectro, and Olympus ECR. The 42mm 2.8 lens on the Olympus is the best of the lot. It's the same lens as the RD and RC manual rangefinder. The Electro is great too, but no manual exposure settings can be a drawback.

The f 1.9 Canonet may be ideal. It has both "Auto" shutter priority and full manual settings. The lens is sharp, and very good. Everyone seems to be paying outrageous prices for the QL17, so the QL19 is really a value now. Look for a clean one with good shutter speeds.

[mike_elek]

Although it's not a rangefinder, the Rollei 35 (including the T/S) is pretty tough to beat.

 

Other favorites include the folding Zeiss Ikon Contessa, and folding Contina (II) plus the Konica I, which has a very nice lens.

 

Hmmm -- nearly endless choices with many from the 1970s. I felt the Petris were fine cameras though materials seemed a bit flimsy.

 

I had a Konica C35 -- nice little camera though the autoexposure system was a bit limiting.

 

A folding Super Solinette with the Solinar is a good choice, and then there are the various folding and rigid Retinas, plus the Voigtlanders, which seem to be going for a princely sum these days.

 

As always, what's your budget?

[mike_elek]

Another excellent -- although often overlooked -- classic rangefinder is the Signet 35. Great little camera. And much like the others will need serviced before it's usable.

[douglas_green1]

Another vote for the Konica Auto S2. It's lens quality, AND the auto parallax-correcting viewfinder are legitimately Leica-class. No other of these cameras can claim that. It's clearly the class of this field, for fundamental quality - although it is big and bulky compared to many of the newer ones.

 

As for the battery issue, you can easily work around it - I use 675 hearing aid batteries and a #9 rubber O-ring in the chamber to make the size correct. I paid $1 plus shipping for my last Auto S2, but $35-50 is more typical, at least for one that the seller will guarantee works.

 

The Canonet QL17 GIII is almost as good, and much more compact, but they also cost more. Other ones that cost more are the Minolta HiMatic 7SII, Konica Auto S3 (not as well constructed as the Auto S2, but much smaller and lighter), Olympus 35SP and 35RD.

[manh_le]

People have covered most options and questions, and indeed there are lots of options.

 

<p>I just want to add my 2 cents: which camera quirks can you live with? (or, live without).

[john_wire]

Inexpensive, pretty small, good fast glass, easily repaired, unmatched autoexposure, electric leaf shutter, quiet, rugged, auto parallax correction, etc, etc..........

 

If a Zorki 4 I purchased ever arrives I'll see how it compares with my other stuff. Regards.<div></div>

[stwrtertbsratbs5]

The new Zeiss Ikon - the lenses are so expensicve that I can only afford one, so it may as well be fixed lens!

 

Robert

[bacsa]

If you decide you want that fixed lens to be a bit wider, say, 35mm, go for the yashica electro35 CC. Excellent f/1.8 lens, shutter with very slow speeds, modern battery usage, good view/rangefinder, small black body. It's a shame they didn't make as many of them as of the GSN's.

[keith_slater]

I would like to spend around $30.00 plus a little for shipping. I looked at the Russian sellers, however anything they sell will be at least $20.00 shipping. On a $30 camera, will I see a big improvement over the Petri? I have decided this will be my last camera purchase of 1 year. I need to put my buying on hold. Another thing, It has to work. My long suffering wife would not be happy if I bring home another non working camera. If anyone on this list has something they would like to sell, Free free to contact me.

 

One camera which I have and would almost meet my needs is a Lacon C that my aunt gave me. It uses scale focusing, however I could buy a shoe mounted rangefinder. The thing I can not live with however is it has no strap lugs. Only has a beat everready case. I hate eveready cases anyway. Odd filter size also.

 

Thanks Everyone,

Keith

[rustys pics]

If you're in the 30 dollar range then a yaschica Electro G or Canonet QL19 can hit that mark. As for working? Well, caveat emptor. Check local camera shops or thrift stores. EBAY gets sketchier every day....but there are good bargains. I got and entire Electro G outfit, including system case, two lenses, Vivitar flash and small tripod for 35 bucks!

There was a certain amount of risk since all was untested, however.

[terry_scott]

For a fairly lightweight 35mm coupled rangefinder (c.r.f.) from the '60s, one I'd recommend is a Yashica Minister III.

 

I have one. Good lens - a five-element 45mm f/2.8. The meter has a selenium cell, so no (mercury) batteries to worry about. Mechanically-timed speeds from 1 to 1/500 plus B. Handles nicely.

 

Mine is almost spotless and works well. If you find one, check out (among other things) that the self-timer works smoothly. Also look for any haze on the viewfinder glass. If all is well and the price is right, go-for-it.

[terry_scott]

P.S.: The Minister III has strap lugs so you're okay on that point.

 

But consider too a wriststrap that fixes into the tripod screw. I kept one when (years ago) I let go of a Minoltina cine camera that it came with. It's a better bit o' kit than many a neckstrap.

[bacsa]

Thirty $ plus shipping is quite restricting. Are you prepared for some do-it-yourself repair, like, cleaning of vf/rf, adjusting rangefinder, cleaning a stuck shutter, replacing light seals? If yes, it's doable; if you want a working example for 30$, you have to be very lucky. One option is to buy a bigger lot with a bad description and sell the rest; you might end up with a camera for free.

 

An example: I bought seven rf's for 50$ which with shipping it went up to 100$; one of them was a minolta hi-matic 9 that had a partially stuck shutter (some exercise and cleaning helped); and two canonet ql17 GIII's of which was perfectly working and the other one badly busted on top w broken vf windows (but working). All three needed new light seals. But the deal was good. The rest four were not interesting so those and a bag I have sold for 35$, so finally i ended up with three great rf's for 65$ plus some handwork on them.

 

Alternatively you can try www.rangefinderforum.com where a few people regularly offer rf's they repaired themselves, for 30$ you can get a decent one (not the top models) which will certainly work.

[afildes]

The Olympus RD and RC have a good reputation but the real Oly nuts go for the SP and SPn.

Spot metering option, fast lens, all manual options and so on. You probably won't find a

cheap one though, especially in black!

I also have a FED 2 which I love - mine is in decidedly unoriginal black chrome and was

inexpensive too. Used with a Metraphot shoe mount meter (made originally as a cheap option

for Leicas etc.)