Ikonic Question

[roy_lahay]

Please excuse me. I'm more of a lurker than a poster, but what's going

to be so special about this new camera???

[socke]

First of all, it's a NEW rangefinder taking M-Mount lenses.

[marbing]

The return of the Zeiss Ikon name is a positive thing. I'm not sure if the camera body itself will be earth shattering since there are other non-Leica bodies that take M-mount lenses. I am sure that it will be well-made and will take advantage of modern features but probably won't induce Leica owners to get rid of their M6's.

 

The real interest would be the set of new lenses, not only for users of this camera, for all M-mount camera users. The Zeiss lenses will have a different 'look' from their Leica cousins and there will be people who will be curious to see what they can do.

[roy_lahay]

I know it is a new m camera, but it seems it will be an m7 clone and nothing more.

[peter_evans4]

<p>For me, the brand name is the least interesting part. Look, if you're going to revive a brand name, go for an interesting one, like <strong>Taron Chic, Rollop, Elbowflex</strong>, or of course <strong>Lord Martian</strong>.</p><p>Some people may be interested in the fact that it manages the combination of 28mm framelines and conventional magnification, that it has a bright finder and that it allows shutter-priority AE. If you're terribly interested, you'll already know all about it; if you're a bit interested, wait till disinterested and conscientious reviews of it come out; if you're not yet interested, either "move on 'cause there's nothing to see" or huff and puff about how those wily Japanese can't make anything to rival German technology, how Zeiss has prostituted its good name, how anyone who doesn't use [insert selection of brands here] is a sissy, etc etc</p>

[peter_evans4]

<p><em> it seems it will be an m7 clone and nothing more</em></p><p>It promises to cost a pile of money less. Of course, this may not matter to some people -- after all, crony capitalism (etc.) benefits a certain socioeconomic stratum.</p>

[socke]

Roy, it's everything but a M7 clone.

A few but significant differences are:

1/125th X-Sync

no ttl flash

1/2000th fastest shutter speed

metal shutter

longer rangefinder base

hinged back

[roy_lahay]

Volker, honestly, I don't think it will anything other than something inbetween a bessa and an m7 but with bessa quality. I only own 1 camera, a beat up M4. I just don't get it. I don't think this ikon will sell.

[bobtodrick]

Odd Roy, but for a lurker who only owns a beat up M4, doesn't know what would be 'special' about the Ziess, you've previously posted things that lead me to believe you know a lot more than you let on. I think lurker is spelt T-R-O-L-L.

[jtk]

Sounds like the first significant advance after Canon P...hinge back, same wide rangefinder base. Hopefully the craftsmanship will rise to Canon P standards.

[Andrew in Austin]

Not a cure for Leica lust, but it will be an interesting variation of a theme never the less.

 

Maybe it won't be Ikonic, but it is significant that the evolution of the original C/V Bessa experiment based on an old SLR chassis continues. In this era of digital wonder cameras, any new film based range finder design should be welcomed.

 

Like everyone else, I must say that the Cosina/Zeiss partnership will have to pay close attention to their QC on this one for it to be successful.

[socke]

I think the biggest mistake Zeiss made was telling the world that they outsourced manufacturing to Cosina.

 

So the Zeiss Ikon will allways be a Cosina Bessa for many.

 

Had they outsourced to an unknown factory in portugal and done just enough assembling in germany to stamp it "Made in Germany" it would be a great status symbol for the above :-(

 

For me it's an opportunity to get into M-Mount for the price of a 15 year old M6 but with a two year warranty and less hassle changing film. If the shutter lasts 50,000 or 100,000 shots is no concern for me, it'll take me more than 20 years to shoot 50,000 frames!

 

And with the demise of ISO50 slide film a 1/2000th shutter is very handy.

[claude_batmanghelidj]

I agree with Volker about the branding and manufacturing,for sure. I can't see paying that much for one of these, when I can get an R2a which does the same thing for around $500. For what one of these Ikons will cost, why not just get a nice used M6? Am I missing something here?

[jtk]

Cosina always made bottom tier SLRs...if they doubled prices and delivered average SLR quality, there'd be no market for Zeiss, not to mention Leica.

[r s]

Roy (Frank), I thought you were banned?

[paul t]

" I can't see paying that much for one of these, when I can get an R2a which

does the same thing for around $500. " etc etc <p>

Lawdsakes. It's Groundhog Day.

[joe_blow32]

Forget about it.

 

Go buy a Hexar RF thats been back focus checked.

 

Now that I've got one that actually works properly, I like it alot more than my M7 with a winder attached, plus its about 1/5th the price.

[nathaniel_pearson]

Ikonoclasts...

[joe_blow32]

....plus you avoid all the eye contact from Leica fondlers.

[andrew_hall1]

>Roy (Frank), I thought you were banned?

 

Granovski has at least one other active account (Brandt Fan).

[socke]

Claude, the M6 will be some 15 years old, probably in need of a CLA and without any warranty. Even CLA'd the shutter won't be as accurate as an electronicaly controlled one, max X-Sync will be 1/50th and 1/1000th may be to slow with ISO100 films.

 

The Bessa won't do what the Zeiss does, the rangefinderbase is even shorter than the Leicas!

 

The Zeiss Ikon is NOT a Bessa, it's a new camera which happens to be equipped with a widely available shutter.

 

For a rangefinder user who wants a new camera to take pictures this is a nice thing, for a Leica aficionado it is uninteresting.

 

Since this is a Leica forum, the camera is, in any event, crap.

[dan flanders]

The Zeiss Ikon myth is in full bloom here. Bear in mind that

the German monolith of yore quit the camera business and

completely reorganized their corporate structure some thirty

years ago, restricting their efforts purely to camera lenses

and binoculars (not counting survey and scientific instruments).

They got back into the camera business by licencing their lens

technology to outsources and rebranding products made elsewhere.

"Zeiss Ikon" is now only a marketable trademark, and not necessarily

the emblem of extraordinary quality it once symbolized. Bear

also in mind that the first batch of these cameras did not

possess the legendary Zeiss Icon magic and had to be returned

for quality control reasons. Apparently none have actually

reached the market. They may and probably will be excellent

products but until they have a track record they should be

regarded with the same skepticism accorded other new and untried

products.

[paul t]

Your point is fair, Dan, but for the fact that the ZI is not 'licensed' to Cosina. It is

a Zeiss-funded design. In many ways it's not a big deal - it's an incremental

improvement on the rangefinder concept. But this is a development that Leica

could, and even should have done years ago. For the first time in years, you

can easily and efficiently focus both 90/2 and 28mm lenses on the same

camera. WHen could you do that with a Leica? <p>

Like many others here, I;m not too interested in buying a ZI, because I have

an M4 that does what I need. But I would like to see it succeed, because it

makes the prospect of a digital ZI all the more likely. And that is a camera has

the prospect of being the functional equal, or superior, to a Leica digital M, at

a fraction of the price. I hope...

[aizan_sasayama]

The Japan release date was yesterday!

[paul t]

Is it October in Japan already?