mvw photo Posted September 16, 2006 Author Share Posted September 16, 2006 Uh oh! I just went and bought a 530, folling the thread abovce. The idea is that a 530 can be set to manual so that when used as zone "C", I can avoid the "FEL causes zone "C" to flash a mazimum intensity" problem. Apparently not. The moment I set the 530 to SLAVE, it automatically switches from M (manual) to ETTL. So it looks like I just wasted $350, unless anyone has an idea for me? Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mvw photo Posted September 16, 2006 Author Share Posted September 16, 2006 As it happens, *I* have an idea: RTFM! The 430 can indeed be set to manual mode in slave mode. You just need to read the manual that tells you how to do it. Keep the modem button pressed for >2 seconds, then press set button, change setting, and press set button again. Simple once you rtfm. So my flash problem now appears as though it may be solved. Exposure is now easy and the preflashes have gone, so I am guessing blinking will have stopped. Tests on human subjects to follow tomorrow! Thanks all for the suggestions.. well done Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awindsor Posted September 16, 2006 Share Posted September 16, 2006 Michael has worked out how to fire the 430EX in manual mode as a slave and the FEL trick now works perfectly. My earlier suggestion was to use the whole set up in manual using a flash meter. This was "nixed" since he had 420EX slaves. However this is possible even with 420EX flash units as slaves. The 550EX or 580EX can be used to configure a wireless manual flash set up though it cannot mix manual flash output and E-TTL (for that you need to be able to configure a slave - hence the necessity of the 430EX). I don't have an ST-E2 so I cannot say whether this will work with the more limited ST-E2. These wireless manual set-ups do not eliminate preflashes since the master still needs to communicate the relevant power to the slaves but should make the whole preflash process faster since no metering pulses are fired. I hope Michael can try it out for us. I hope that this helps other people with Blink E-TTL problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim_larson1 Posted September 16, 2006 Share Posted September 16, 2006 If you have an ST-E2, things will work fine. The only trick is that the ST-E2 has no "C" group control capability. All you have to do configure the manual background flash into either group "A" or "B". You can mix ETTL and manual flashes. . .you just can't have them exposing the same objects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awindsor Posted September 16, 2006 Share Posted September 16, 2006 Jim, I know how the ST-E2 works with slaves that are set to manual but does it support configuring wireless manual flash with 420EX flashes that do not support manual control ? My understanding is that it does not. If you wish to configure a wireless manual flash with the ST-E2 you must have slaves that can be independently configured. The 550EX or 580EX will allow you to set the manual output for each slave (crucial if the slaves are 420EXs). The downside is that it is all or nothing. Used this way you *cannot* mix E-TTL and manual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awindsor Posted September 16, 2006 Share Posted September 16, 2006 "The 550EX or 580EX will allow you to set the manual output for each slave (crucial if the slaves are 420EXs). The downside is that it is all or nothing. Used this way you *cannot* mix E-TTL and manual." I should have said The 550EX or 580EX will allow you to set the manual output for each slave GROUP (crucial if the slaves are 420EXs). You can only set three independent manual amounts. I have no idea how flash meters would react to the triggering pulses but you can always use the digital camera as a meter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mvw photo Posted September 16, 2006 Author Share Posted September 16, 2006 All: will try the manual setup tomorrow. Meanwhile I am glad to report that the suggested solution (Use FEL, while using a 430ex set to manual as background "group C" flash) works perfectly - I have now verified with the same previously blinking human subjects. I can't say what a relief that is: no more losses due to that silly blink. Fantastic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awindsor Posted September 17, 2006 Share Posted September 17, 2006 I am not sure there is any reason to leave the background flash in group C. I think you can safely include it in either group A or group B. Dropping from A:B C to A:B probably saves a brief preflash so might be worthwhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mvw photo Posted September 17, 2006 Author Share Posted September 17, 2006 Mmm. Interesting. Since "C" is ignored during the preflash metering, would "C" therefore not be the option to use? If I put it in "A" or "B", even though, yes, I, not the camera, set the brightness, it will still be taken into account during all that magical metering. In any case, it is such a relief to not have to worry about blinking anymore. Later today I intend to test manual setup, but for now, problem already solved by using FEL and a 430 as background flash. Feels pretty good. If Canon were just to add a few words to their manuals to explain all this, a lot of work here could have been avoided. But then we would not have had as much fun... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awindsor Posted September 17, 2006 Share Posted September 17, 2006 Once you switch it to M mode the slave is no longer part of any group (I just checked - you can control the channel but not the group). It never emits during the preflash phase it just fires on the trigger pulse. In your set up there is no flash in group C so you should set the master to A:B and hence avoid an unnecessary preflash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mvw photo Posted September 17, 2006 Author Share Posted September 17, 2006 Oh: I must have missed that (the disappearing "C"). Silly me. Yes, you are right, in that case I should just set it to A:B. Will try that later, too. As soon as any unfortunate subjects are silly enough to walk within eashot of me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim_larson1 Posted September 18, 2006 Share Posted September 18, 2006 </i>"However this is possible even with 420EX flash units as slaves. The 550EX or 580EX can be used to configure a wireless manual flash set up though it cannot mix manual flash output and E-TTL (for that you need to be able to configure a slave - hence the necessity of the 430EX). I don't have an ST-E2 so I cannot say whether this will work with the more limited ST-E2. These wireless manual set-ups do not eliminate preflashes since the master still needs to communicate the relevant power to the slaves but should make the whole preflash process faster since no metering pulses are fired." Ah. I did not fully comprehend this part of the post from Alister. As many times as I have been through the manuals. . I had not seen the two pages that describe this trick! Fascinating. Clearly, the ST-E2 lacks controls to configure manual flash output. What I meant in my earlier post, is that there is no restriction on placing a flash set to be fired manually in a group using ETTL flash. The only problem is that metering for the ETTL flash units will not take the manual flash output into account. This should work if the manual flash is exposing a something completely different (say. . a background) than the ETTL flash. In this regard. . the ST-E2 should work the same as the 580EX master (except for the complete lack of "C" group) <p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awindsor Posted September 18, 2006 Share Posted September 18, 2006 Actually the manual flashes don't belong to any group and work fine with the ST-E2 (they just fire on the triggering pulse). One of the reasons I am particularly taken with the wireless manual flash is that this may work on any camera (in particular on my 6x6 film camera). This eliminates the need for optical slaves and allows the use of the 420EX slaves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mvw photo Posted September 18, 2006 Author Share Posted September 18, 2006 All - many apologies for not yet having tried the manual mode suggested by Jean-Baptiste. I am on my way to Los Angeles shortly, due back Wednesday night, so I will get to it then. So, to LA today, do I carry the 5D or the 350XT? And 24-70 2.8L or 17-40 4L? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mvw photo Posted September 18, 2006 Author Share Posted September 18, 2006 I mean "...suggested by Alistair". temporary brain malfunction brought on no doubt by packing for the short trip to LA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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