How close is too close for comfort?

[natureshots]

I was asked to be a videographer at a wedding this weekend so I was next to the

photographer too many times. Even I was uncomfortable with the photographer's

actions. At times he was too noisy fumbling with his equipment. During the

exchange of the rings, he was about two feet away getting close-ups. This

closeness was not necessary given that he has multiple cameras with wide and

tele lenses attached. When I viewed the video, he was all over the place.

Given the noise that he and the mirror made, I found his in your face style to

be too obnoxious. However, I don't do wedding photography and would like to

hear your thoughts. What do you consider taboos?

[natureshots]

During the exchanging of the rings, should a photographer be next to the pastor or have his lens even closer doing his/her thing?

 

I've already mentioned that he had a camera with a tele lens attached. Forget the videographer and assume he's not there. What are your taboos about wedding photography?

[jimstrutz]

I watched a new photographer do this once. He had never shot a weddding before, and from watching his behavior, I'm not sure he had ever even *been* to a wedding before. He was not only right up front, but walked around the couple several times and even shot a few over the minister's shoulder. He was there for the entire ceremony. I was embarrased. In my opinion, the wedding was ruined by the photographer getting "great shots."

 

I have seen nearly the same done by agressive videographers too. I also don't like videographers parking themselves a little off side and behind the minister. What's with that? Like nobody cares? I've attended some low class affairs, I guess.

 

I perform weddings as well as shoot them. I've never had a rude photographer while I was conducting the ceremony, but I have decided that if it ever happens I will stop the wedding and tell the photographer to sit down. Weddings are not a photo-op, and it's a shame that some people can't see past their own little project.

 

Photographers, and videographers need to remember that the wedding ceremony is not about them, or even about them getting great shots. They need to do the best they can while staying out of it.

 

As a photographer I try to have a talk with the minister before hand, but some of them don't make themselves available. As a minister I *always* have a talk with the photographer & videographers. I don't like surprises. At least not this kind.

[photographydreams]

"This closeness was not necessary given that he has multiple cameras with wide and tele lenses attached."

 

If there was little light, he may have not been able to zoom in like that.

Nevertheless, i would never get that close to the couple during the ceremony - I explain to the couple beforehand that the classic 'close-up' of the rings being exchanged will be staged later so that they can have the shot without me intruding on one of the most special moments of their lives...

 

I always check the rules with the minister beforehand - after all, in a relatively small city, i will probably be working alongside him again!

 

Interestingly, i shot a civil ceremony held in a hotel by two registrars this weekend, and the photo-rules they had were stricter than i have encountered them in any churches! In addition the room was tiny, and the videographer, his humongeous tripod on wheels, and me were all crammed into one corner! Not his fault though, and concerning it was dark, the couple was sitting right in front of a window with the sun behind them, and the registrar was going to decapitate me if i used flash, i was quite grateful for his spotlight!!!

 

Sarah

[steve george]

Thai

 

My general feeling is that you should stand or kneel still in one place during the ceremony - this keeps everyone happy and if you're careful about where you choose to stand you can get the shots you need without running all over the place. I think it's important to always check to make sure I'm not blocking anyone's view too. A lot of the guests will have looked forward to the day for months if not years so I don't want to spoil that in any way!

 

A friend of mine says she can't even look at her official wedding photographs because all they remind her of is how much the photographer irritated her when he was taking them by doing exactly what you describe: getting too close, being intrusively loud moving about and in doing both ruining the intimacy of the ceremony. She says that almost every photograph she looks at just reminds her of where he was standing when he took it and how he was ruining the atmosphere they had paid so much attention to detail to achieve. I can't imagine how bad I would feel if I was responsible for that!

 

I think that "too close" is anything that makes you a part of the ceremony rather than an observer.

[timcorridan]

i consider getting that close ridiculous. i'm suprised every photographer doesn't think the same as I. if a bride and groom gave me instructions like that, i'd be tempted to say no way, i can't. but then i'm just an amateur, not making my bread and butter.

[timcorridan]

http://www.videobycarol.com/Home_Page/Obtrusive_Photography.html

[marv_stasak___southfield__]

I think this discussion points out the need for the B/G and the photographer to have a mutual understanding of what the B/G really want in terms of pix at the ceremony and whether or not they are willing to accept less than tight coverage in exchange for a sense of the sanctity of the ceremony. I have a greek orthodox wedding this next weekend and the priest is allowing full flash coverage. There will be two of us shooting this wedding. I need to talk to the bride to see if she really wants that sort of intrusion or whether she is content with a little less coverage to avoid the "paparazzi" feel.

[john_sack]

One of the comments in this thread suggested that photographers should take up a position and stick to it (i.e., that moving around may be more distracting than staying still). I like that thought.

 

I'm about to shoot two friends' wedding and have done lots of event photography (where I move around a lot). Where would experienced wedding shooters suggest is the right place to be at certain points in the ceremony? Obvious answer: "not in the way", but I'd like something a little more specific...:)

 

John

[david_eicher]

That photographer was lucky he didn't have Father Bluitt as the priest. He would never shoot in his church again and if he gave him lip, he probably would have been knocked out. I hate photographers like that. They ruin a sacred ceremony. You can always restage if you feel you have to get that close.

[jimstrutz]

Well, how about getting the bride's mother to scooch over just a bit and make a little room for you? :) Actually, I think the grooms mother's position would provide a better view of the bride.

 

If there were two of you, a pre-staging one photographer up front with a quiet camera can work well. But you still need the perspective from the back of the house for some shots. The up-close stuff can be re-staged a lot easier.

[timberwulf]

It's all up to the agreement the photog has with the bride and groom and the officiator of the wedding.

 

To say "it's not the photographers day" is correct, but if the photographer has been asked by the bride and to get in close to get those particular shots, and the officiator of the wedding agrees that is alright, then it is up to the photographer to do those shots contractually. In fact, getting those great shots at a customer's request is the entire reason you're there. :) Saying "no, I won't do that" only because you don't feel it is "right" defeats the entire purpose of serving your customer.

 

Now, that doesn't say you try to get those shots anyways if they're not requested. I always stay well out of the way and as quiet as possible when my discussions with the officiator and the bride and groom do not include specific requests for those shots (or when the officiator says he'll knock me out if I get too close ;) ). I think the point to be made here is that sometimes you'll have customers that want those shots, and as long as they are ok with you being there, and the officiator doesn't mind you being there, then getting in close at critical moments for detail shots is perfectly alright. :)

[picturesque]

There are rude photographers and videographers alike, unfortunately. As for your question, I personally don't get within about 6-8 feet from the couple, if that, and almost never get behind or cross behind the officiant or even get onto the altar. This is for 99.9 percent of ceremonies in churches. The 1% I do is when I hear the officiant say that there are no photography "rules" and get what you want when it is happening. This is because an officiant told me this once and I was still discreet, and when I asked for recreations, the officiant refused. Also, all the guests where getting up on the altar and behind the officiant as well. Another time might be for an outdoor ceremony where I can cross behind the officiant behind shrubbery or a gazebo or far in the distance enough not be a distraction.

 

Otherwise, I do move around if permitted, but avoid standing right next to the videographer (noise) and when I do need to get somewhat close to the couple, I move in, take the shot and move out again, very quietly. If I see a video cam set up in the aisle, I try to stay out of it's line of sight.

[natureshots]

Thank you for all your responses. It seems that there is a general agreement that certain actions of the photographer/videographer are inappropriate, unless of course, there is a mutual agreement among the bride/groom/minister that they are ok. Requesting the invisibility factor is similar to customers requesting zero defects per million in the semiconductor business that I'm in; it's impossible but it doesn't mean that we shouldn't strive for it.

 

I've not ventured into social event photography and I appreciate many of the excellent suggestions here, such as making sure there's an agreement among the parties and staging.

 

Sarah, many wedding photographers have zoom lenses with constant max apertures that make me drool. With these lenses, light shouldn't be an issue but maybe shakiness or depth.

 

Tim, LOL! That just cracks me up!

[vladimir_pcholkin___washin]

It is about person. Neither photog or video guy need to be to close, we all have zooms and telephoto lenses. I had one wedding 3 years ago where video guy got behind wedding party and a minister. He was on all my shots 3 feet away from the B&G. B&G and their bridal party were very unhappy(he also had a bright video light). It took very fancy and costly retouching to get him out of the ceremony shots.

I just shot big Indian wedding 2 days ago and video guy had a big camera with very powerful light. I had a choice of loosing my background and have people on the black or have blurry ghost images of everyone. I usually get into the dancing crowd to get action shots. He just put his camera on a high tripod, turn on the light and shot everything from there. So wherever I went his light was always with me. You welcome to see actual samples on my website. I already posted all pictures. Next time I will have a long talk with video person to try to get possible compromise.

[steve george]

John - for where to stand here's my approach, others may have better / different ones though.

 

Basically if the venue is small I stand at the back in the middle - this gives good angles to get the couple in, the exchange of rings and so on. Wide open at F2 helps isolate them from potentially distracting backgrounds such as the registrar.

 

If the venue is larger and the registrar allows it then I go on the grooms side, paralell and slightly in front of them, and off to the side just past the furthest away chair / seat in the pew. That way I'm not blocking anyone's view and shouldn't even be in anyones peripherel vision, while at the same time having a good angle to shoot the procedings.

 

Hope that helps.

[brandonhamilton]

It is always my practice to photograph the ceremony, not participate in it. I'm never farther forward than the front most row of people, and always do my best to stay completely out of the way and silent. I have gotten GREAT close ups of the ring exchange, as well as a great closeup of the ceremony kiss, from the back of the main isle with my 200.

[laurel_jensen]

Coverage is important and if you are working alone it's necessary to move about. I find it easy enough to do by making sure I don't cross in front of people's line of sight (in other words, walk around the periphery)and then move in closer for a few shots at various points and then back out again - like the spokes of a wheel.

 

I take care to move slowly - not at a snails pace or with hesitation - but softly and respectfully.

 

Getting people used to the camera and photographer during an event that lasts several hours is a skill. You can't be in their faces but you also can't just stay on the outside as an "observer".

 

I've found that attitude is most important. Knowing that you are a hired "guest" with a job that by it's very nature is intrusive and doing everything you can to mitigate that intrusion by walking softly and slowly (while still getting your shots)helps people to trust you and begin to actually include you in the event.

 

Once included, you'll get those dynamic, personal shots and participants will love you for it.