30D makes Sigma lenses go bananas

[don_b__south_africa_]

Hi

 

I have two Sigma lenses: a 30mm/1.4 and a 10-20mm/4-5.6. They worked perfectly

on my 350D, so much so that I sang their praises.

 

Then I upgraded to a 30D body. And the Sigma lenses started front-focusing. The

10-20 is not too bad, partly because of its huge DOF, but the 30mm -- a

favourite lens of mine -- has become unusable at anything brighter than f/11.

 

Anybody else had a similar experience, and how was it solved?

 

Sigma South Africa has been very responsive, and indeed claims to be importing

special calibration equipment from Japan to solve my problem. But I remain

perplexed as to why the lenses should perform so differently on the 30D and 350D.

 

My Canon lenses -- three "L"s -- are fine on both bodies.

 

All theories gratefully received.

 

See http://www.pbase.com/glassbottle/focus_problems

 

Don

[yakim_peled1]

A new symptom to the old compatibility issues of the past?

 

Just joking. It's been too good to resist the temptation.

 

Happy shooting,

Yakim.

[neild]

I suspect that Canon do everything in thier power to make off-brand lenses go 'funny' and introducing a new body is an ideal opportunity for them. It's almost as if they want you to buy only Canon-brand lenses: the cheek of it!

[digitmstr]

>>My Canon lenses -- three "L"s -- are fine on both bodies...All theories gratefully received.<<

 

Canon's policy (as I understand it) isnot to share their tech specs with 3rd party lens manufacturers. It's up to these manufacturers to come up with a product that works using reverse eng. Judging from the posts in this and other forums it seems that Sigma has issues while others (like Tamron and Tokina) don't.

 

In the end, it's SIGMA's problem to solve, and not Canon's (or Nikon's).

[ken munn]

If Canon is upsetting it's customers, then it's Canon's problem.

[digitmstr]

>>If Canon is upsetting it's customers,<<

 

How are the doing that? They cannot possibly be responsible for or support issues having to do with PRODUCTS THEY DO NOT MAKE.

 

Tell me, if you buy a car and the maker plainly warns against using one type/brand of gasoline and the engine malfunctions after you decide to use it anyway, who's to blame?

[pto189]

<i>If Canon is upsetting it's customers, then it's Canon's problem.

</i><p>

If you buy Canon,or Nikon, cameras and use only third party lenses, they don't mind to upset you because they don't want your business. Please feel free to buy a Tamron DSLR to use with your Tamron lenses.

[mark u]

No specific theories - the important thing is that hopefully Sigma is gaining experience in setting up copies that don't AF brilliantly. Good ones that AF dead on do exist - and are stunning:

 

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1029&message=18102453

[don_b__south_africa_]

Ummmm, I think it actually *is* Canon's problem, in the sense that I might well not have bought the 30D if I'd known I was about to enter a world of pain with two of my existing lenses. And it's not as if I shun Canon lenses -- I've dropped tons of money on them.

 

If anything, Canon would do well in the eyes of users like me to make sure that new bodies DON'T derange off-brand lenses, if possible.

[don_b__south_africa_]

And, as a matter of interest, does any other maker, such as Nikon, publish its lens communication spec? Because, if there is one, I would be sorely tempted to switch brands to the "open source" one.

[bobatkins]

It's Sigma's problem. Tamron and Tokina lenses do not suffer from these incompatibility issues, yet Sigma lenses have been plagued with them for at least 10-15 years. It's not just digital. I remember WAY back when a Sigma 400/5.6 lens that had been working just fine on an EOS Rebel and EOS 630 wouldn't work at all on an Elan!

[digitmstr]

>>I might well not have bought the 30D if I'd known I was about to enter a world of pain with two of my existing lenses.<<

 

NO offense but, where have you been the last 10 years or so? SIGMA lenses have been known to have problems, with many different bodies.

 

It was your decision to buy SIGMA vs Tamron or Tokina. If you think the SIGMA lenses are the mainstay of your kit get a SIGMA camera (though I have heard about problems with those too).

 

Makes no sense to me NOT to buy a GREAT camera body because two of your Sigma lenses don't work.

 

It is SIGMA's problem and in fact, they offered to fix it THEIR problem. Isn't that enough for you?

[henrik.ploug]

The picture you show on the website:

 

http://www.pbase.com/glassbottle/image/61028758

 

does not seem frontfocused to me. It looks like the camera has focused on the fence which is closer to the camera than the house.

 

This is not to say, that your lens doesn't frontfocus. Just that the picture isn't proof for this.

[yves_jalbert]

I'm starting to think there should be a forum dedicated specifically to this issue! (laughs). This question appears on a daily basis (or pretty close) - no offense Don, your question is valid and it's a common issue.

 

Bob Atkins is right. It is a Sigma problem and they (Sigma) have been working with their clients to fix this. For additionnal documentation I'm pointing you to other threads which discussed this issue recently. They are related to your issue and cover the Canon 20D, 30D, XT, Canon and Sigma lenses.

 

 

Canon EOS 20D front focus problem (May 31)

 

http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=00GlWN

 

What needs adjusting? Body or Lens? (May 30)

 

http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=00GlAT

 

70-200mm / 2.8 / Canon vs. Sigma (May 30)

 

http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=00GkdW

[don_b__south_africa_]

Yves, thank you very much for the pointers to those other threads. If nothing else, it's good for the soul to know that one is not alone.

 

Henrik, of course those pictures aren't "evidence". No picture could be. But do you seriously imagine I've determined that my Sigma 30mm front-focuses on the strength of a single pair of pictures?

 

And to those Canon loyalists who seem to imply that anybody who buys off-brand lenses deserves whatever misfortune he gets, I suggest you must be in favour of anti-competitive corporatism at heart.

 

As for why I chose Sigma: well, in South Africa there isn't much choice. In the old FD days, Tamron and Tokina were widely available here, but they seem to have vanished a decade ago or more. Tamron lenses have recently appeared again in a couple of shops, but afaik until recently it was a straight choice between Canon and Sigma. We don't all live in New York, you know. And Canon, in fact, makes no lens comparable to the 30mm/1.4, unless you count the 35L, which is a little too rich for my blood.

 

And as for Sigma's response to my problem, yes, I'm very pleased with their attentiveness and I'm crossing my fingers that when the calibration equipment arrives, I'll be sorted out.

 

Don

[digitmstr]

>>And to those Canon loyalists who seem to imply that anybody who buys off-brand lenses deserves whatever misfortune he gets<<

 

Don, no one said or even remotely suggested as you sate above.

 

Again, the SIGMA problems are at least 10 years old, we are not talking recent, We are talking well known, around the world.

 

Supposedly, you did your research PRIOR to purchasing and supposedly YOU accepted the risks involved in buying SIGMA lenses, no?

 

Why blame Canon (or us) now? Don't take it out on us, we didn't make the lens.

 

You deserve happiness, not hassle...so, *give yourself this much deserved happiness* and buy lenses that are NOT known to malfuncion on your camera(s)!

[digitmstr]

>>'m starting to think there should be a forum dedicated specifically to this issue! (laughs).<<

 

No kidding! Or, PN should charge $5.00 USD for every " my SIGMA lense doesn't work with my new camera" post ;-P

[don_b__south_africa_]

Giampi, yes, you're right, I should calm down. Certainly I did accept the risks of buying Sigma: but supposedly, according to much of what I saw while doing my research, the dire problems of yesteryear were over. So I was wrong.

 

I wouldn't be at all surprised, though, if Canon were doing this deliberately with new bodies, as an earlier poster suggested. If that's true, then it's a monopolistic practice and it stinks. And since I harbour that suspicion, I'm afraid it's made me a little angry.

 

Now I will calm down. Promise.

[les]

Giampi:

 

In a strict sense you are absolutely right. Canon is under no obligation to make sure that their products are compatible with any other they do not make. They also are not under any obligation to go out of their way to screw things up for THEIR cutomers on purpose.

 

What Canon does (or does not do) is 100% legal, but it just does not make it smell any better.

 

OTOH - one makes his choices and one takes the risks...

[ken munn]

1. All Canon lenses work well on all Canon bodies (well, almost, some front or back

focussing problems have been reported)

 

2. Recent Sigmas work well on all Canon bodies, except it seems, the recently intro'd 30D

and 5D models

 

3. Older Canon lens work well on the new Canon bodies.

 

4. Conclusion, something in the 30D/5D lens-body interface has been changed in a way

that only affects Sigma lenses

 

One can't help suspecting that maybe Canon is playing a spoiling game against a

competitive lens maker

[mbb]

How different needs we all have. I bought Canon system because lenses quality is the most important factor to me. Cameras are almost disposable parts and can be exchange every few years. Mostly quality of photo is limited by glass not a camera. I have seen many people buying off market lenses first (for various reasons) and sooner or later taking a loss and exchange them for Canon brand. As many already pointed what is a purpose of buying Porsche and using the cheapest off brand set of tires to save money. But again, we are all different.

[andrew robertson]

There is no reason to buy ANY 3rd party lenses, flashes, etc and expect them to work

flawlessly with Canon cameras. This is something that Canon made clear from the start.

Every single Canon camera's manual warns you against using 3rd party lenses / flashes. If

you read your manual, you realize that you are taking an informed risk when you buy a

3rd party lens. If you don't read the manual, well, yes, you do deserve what you get.

 

Canon is not a monopoly. The do not have to abide by legally enforced standards of

interoperability or any such nonsense. You do not have a right to use a Sigma lens on any

given Canon body and expect it to work all the time. Apparently on Nikon and Pentax and

Olympus bodies there are no such compatibility problems, so as an informed buyer you

would maybe have taken that into consideration when you were researching the different

system prior to purchase.

[steve rowe]

I have never had a problem with any of my Tamron lenses on any of my Canon bodies, so it seems that is possible for a 3rd party manufacturer to get it right. Sigma seems to struggle for some reason.

[marknagel]

I had focus issues with my Sigma and Tamron lenses. I called Canon and they say they will fix any focus problems with Canon Lenses on Canon Bodies, they do NOT guarantee compatability with other manuafactures lenses.

 

My Ford Warrantee does not cover my aftermarket non-ford XM Radio.

 

As I discussed the problem with Canon, they explain how 3rd pary companies reverse engineer the lenses to make them work. BUT, the guts are NOT the same. When Canon builds their bodies, they make sure they are compatible with all their lenses. They do not test every 3rd party lens on the planet to see if they work. I assume this would case more time in design and drive the cost up. All that to help the competitor.

 

Yes, it sucks if your Sigma doesn't work well with your 30D. I had a total of 8 Sigma or Tamron lenses and only two were close to dead on with my 20D. The others were off as much as 22mm at 2 feet. Every one of my Canon USM lenses are dead on (under 2mm). USM is worth every penny to me! I personally would rather Canon have a lower body price so I can buy Canon lenses, then them jack the price up for R&D on Sigma compatibilty.

 

Mark

[neild]

<i>"And to those Canon loyalists who seem to imply that anybody who buys off-brand lenses deserves whatever misfortune he gets, I suggest you must be in favour of anti-competitive corporatism at heart."</i>

<p>

Don, I presume I'm in this group as far as you're concerned, but I have over 20 lenses and only one of them is Canon - so I'm not much of a loyalist. The difference is that mine are all manual focus lenses and so have no electronic interface with the camera (and so nothing can go wrong, except my eyesight!).

<p>

I wasn't saying that you are wrong to buy off-brand lenses; I was merely saying that you do so at your own risk. Sigma will try to fix the problem as it is in their interests to do so. Canon does not care because they want you to buy thier own lenses of course. Their angle is that their lenses have no compatitbility issues! I could not blame Canon if my lenses did not work out on their cameras, but they do work so I buy the occasional camera from Canon, but very little in the way of lenses. To Canon, I am a nobody. If you buy Sigma lenses then you are also a nobody in Canon's eyes - why should they care what you think?