Hasselblad SWC with interchangeable lens, possible?

[diegobuono]

If the lens of the SWC would be interchangeable should be possible to

use the other lenses of the system in conjunction with the proper

extension tube to reproduce the dimension of the standard body? You

should compose and focus on the focal plain with the proper adapter.

At the cost of the basic body this propbably don't worth the

disadvantage but my question is only intended to discover if is

possible and why Hasselblad did not realized the SWC with

interchangeable lens.

[kerkko_kehravuo]

Is Biogon of MF Alpa of interchangable type? Maybe I remember wrong.

 

Kerkko K.

[q.g._de_bakker]

Diego,<br><br>The SWC is not so much a body as a mount. There is no mechanism that could engage in exhangeable lenses' shutter, to trip the thing. Nothing making interchangeable lenses possible. Just a simple "direct drive" of the Biogon's shutter and film wind.<br>And there's the shutter in the changeable, "reflex" lenses too, which always opens when recocked. You would have to use the thing in view-camera style.<br><br>But other than that, yes. It could be done.<br>A long time ago, there was a distance piece available (or at least shown) that would mount between SW and film magazine. A "rear" extension tube. Good idea, but alas not available.<br><br>The reason why Hasselblad never did what you describe is, i stronlgy suspect, that you then do not have a reflex camera (high on Victor Hasselblad's wish list. And though "zone focussing" might work with a wide angle lens, it will not, or very badly, with longer lenses), and have to work in the view-camera fashion (slow; something <i>not</i> on Victor's wish-list).<br>The single-lens reflex Hasselblad really is the better option. And the Biogon's attach-the-lens-to-a-film-magazine-directly housing is a good compromise solution for that particular lens.

[dan_fromm2]

Um, I shoot a 38/4.5 Biogon in Copal #0 on a Century Graphic. FWIW, it covers 84 mm with good illumination. And I use other lenses on the camera too.

 

If you don't need reflex viewing, a Century is a nominal 6x9 (or 6x6, if you want to crop or use a 6x6 roll holder) camera that's a little less expensive and a lot more flexible than the Alpa. There's no reason to limit oneself to 6x6 or to lenses made for 'blads. There are many other fine lenses in shutter that cover 6x6 or more.

[andre_oldani]

Diego, the precision needed for symmetrical wide angle lenses is very demanding. A

bayonet is always a compromise adding some uncertainties. In addition you need to

understand how Hasselblads work: 'Wen the camera release is depressed, the lens shutter

closes and the diaphragm stops down to the preset aperture, the mirror moves up, and

the auxiliary shutter or focal plane shutter opens. The lens shutter opens and closes for

the duration se on the shutter-speed ring, or in the B setting, the shutter closes when the

finger is removed from the release. Depending on the camera model or the operating

mode on some models, the mirror returns either instantly or when the film is advanced' -

Wildi, The Hasselblad Manual, page 39. - The SWC does not have an auxiliary shutter so

all the C/CB/CF/CFi/CFE (plus F/FE anyway) lenses would we worthless on such a body

(with extensions). Your idea would need a reconstruction of the whole shutter mechanism

for the Biogon with two modes for SWC and 500 (plus some 2000/200 plus Flexbody)

series models. In addition you couldn't use this Biogon on those bodies as the optical

construction doesn't allow this (these bodies are made for SLR and retrofocal lenses).

 

Kerkko is right about the exchangeable Biogon for the ALPA 12. After two completely sold

batches of this lens a third one might come next year. But this depends on the real

demand. The lens is very expensive by nature and you cannot order them as single pieces.

BTW, Zeiss offered an exchangeable Biogon to ALPA because it is 'the most precise camera

in that area' (Zeiss' words). With the ALPA you can use the lens on whatever format you

want and crop later as needed. The camera is open for 6x4.5, 44x66, 36x72, 6x6, 6x7,

6x8 and 6x9 (56x84) with backs from ALPA (modified Linhof Super Rolex), Mamiya RB,

Horseman/Arcaswiss plus Polaroid.

 

I wouldn't comment other cameras and systems that I own or handled profoundly myself

(just touch doesn't count!). Therefore and for my part I can't discuss the flexibility of some

other cameras. But I would call a complex system with a whole and ready to buy range of

high precision lenses from Schneider, Rodenstock (and Zeiss) from 24/35mm (digital) and

38mm (film up to 6x9) up to 250mm plus macro system plus adapters for digital backs

(Hasselblad V, Hasselblad H1, Mamiya 645 AFD) quite flexible :-)

[q.g._de_bakker]

Andre,<br><br>The SWC not having a rear auxillary shutter would not make all V-system lenses totally "worthless". Remember the FlexBody? That too did not have a rear auxillary shutter, and those lenses worked quite well. ;-)<br>You just have to work in view-camera style.<br><br>An Alpa would indeed be the better camera by far if you desire such a system Diego described. Hasselblads, despite the exceptional SWC, fundamentally are single-lens reflex cameras. Different kettle of fish.

[andre_oldani]

Q.C., of course, I meant a reconstruction of the shutter for both Biogon and all other Cxx

lenses (disappeared during editing I think). All these lenses would need a mode for use on

a SWC body (shutter starts closed and ends closed) and 5xx bodies (shutter stars open and

ends closed) or kind of. The focal flange distance of the Biogon doesn't allow it's usage on

a 5xx body, of course. The Cxx lenses on the other hand would need a 'enlarging tube' for

reaching the focal flange distance of the Cxx lenses. Nice experiment of thougts but rather

academical :-) Let us use the Hasselblads as they are :-)

[jsbc]

What you are proposing is kinda like saying we should be able to use SLR lenses on a non-mirror body like a Leica M3.

 

It works, but the fact that the H system has a removable film back erases much of the advantages.

 

A 80mm + extension tube + your SWC + filmback is not much smaller or lighter than a 500 + old SWC + A12. It is less rigid, and you loses through the lens viewing if you do shoot with 80mm lens.

 

Furthermore, it is safe to assume that most people who own SWC would have the basic body, after all, the # of basic bodies >>> SWCs.

[russ_britt1]

They made the CM....you can lock the mirror if you want ,or even use ground glass if you want.What could you not do with a CM? The Super wide was made for this one lens......?

[david_goldfarb]

You could get a camera like the Cambo Wide DS. The lenses are outstanding, and depending on the particular lens and back you choose you can shoot any format from 645 to 4x5", and you get rise, fall and shift.

[q.g._de_bakker]

Andre,<br><br>The thing is, the lens' shutters do <i>not</i> need to be reconstructed. You just have to use the things in view-camera style. Like you do with 'regular" Hasselblad lenses on the FlexBody, which has no rear shutter.<br>Lots of inserting and removing of dark slides, but it would work without any alterations to lenses.<br><br>It would be nice, should 'regular' lenses be used often on a FlexBody or 'modified SWC' body, to have a "never-open-for-viewing-unless-i-want-to" mode. Yes.<br><br>To make the SWC accept other lenses... that's another thing.<br>

[diegobuono]

Thank you to all for your responses, My question was only academical. Now I know that could be possible even if not simple and not practical at all (I knew this when I posted the question).

[aricmayer]

Academically this should be possible, if you want to cut your beautiful Zeiss 38mm Biogon

off the mount. Why you would do such a horrible thing is another question.

 

However, the other lenses in the system would be mostly useless on the SWC mount

simply because their depth of field would make them impossible to accurately focus and

control DF without using a measuring tape. Can you imagine using a 150mm or longer

lens without looking through the glass to focus? Even the wider angle lenses have a

shallower depth of field and would exagerate the problem.

[q.g._de_bakker]

Aric,<br><br>Don't forget that you can put a ground glass back on the rear of an (extended) SWC.

[Aoresteen]

Also, the Lunar models took a special 60mm lens that were scale focused and the bodies did not have a reflex mirror.

[dan_fromm2]

Aric Meyer wrote "Academically this should be possible, if you want to cut your beautiful Zeiss 38mm Biogon off the mount. Why you would do such a horrible thing is another question."

 

You had no way of knowing it, but the 38/4.5 Biogon I use on my Century Graphic came from an aerial camera, not from a Hasselblad SWC. AGI F135. I did no horrible thing to it, I rescued it from the scrap heap.

 

Not all 38/4.5 Biogons went to Sweden. In fact, not all were made by Zeiss. Mine was but one of my neighbors has one engraved, if I recall correctly, Pacific Optical, still in a Maurer aerial camera.

 

QG has the right of it, if a lens' shutter can be opened for focusing it can be focused on a ground glass. That said, Schneider makes some nice and not too expensive focusing helicals for people who wish to focus by guess, by tape measure, as you suggested, or with the help of a rangefinder.

 

How, I ask you, does one focus an Alpa12? Guess, tape, or auxiliary rangefinder. And where does Alpa get their focusing helicals? One guess, Aric, you have the hint in front of you.

 

Cheers,

 

Dan

[aricmayer]

Dan, I wish I was so lucky to get such a find. The lens is remarkable. Let me know the next

time you go looking through the trash. I'd like to come along.

 

As far as the focusing screen goes, of course you can put one on the back of the SWC. But

after all the expense and trouble of all this modification would likely make it senseless not

just to buy a 501cm body. The beauty of the SWC is that it is lightweight and easy to use

for excellent results. The chassis is built to the strengths of the lens. If you use the spirit

level to control perspective and compose with the gunsight to determine frame

edges, you get great results, without the ground glass back.

 

If one went through all the trouble of building an extension for the lenses, and adding a

bayonnet mount to the chassis, and then using a ground glass back for focusing and

composition, you would have a camera that does basically what a 501CM does, except that

it does it a lot slower.

 

Now that I think it through, though, I do kind of like the idea. Just a simple tube with a

bayonnet mount that goes back to a Hasselblad film holder. That should be pretty easy to

make from the trash heap. There's a certain elegance to getting rid of the prism and

mirror.

 

Or, you could put the lens mount on an old set of rails from a 4x5 camera and make a

system that would take Hasselblad lenses, plus arcflex and large format lenses that could

swing and tilt. Now that would be fun. I don't know how well the rails would support the

weight of the Hasselblad lenses, though.

[dan_fromm2]

Aric, read my comments above re the Century Graphic. If an SLR is not required and focusing and composing on the ground glass are feasible, they're very useful and not too expensive cameras. Slightly less expensive than an Alpa. I shoot a number of lenses on my Century. The shortest is the Biogon, the longest a 10.16" Taylor Hobson.

 

About hunting in the trash, the surplus AGI F135 I bought was hidden in plain view on the Internet. No more left, as far as I know the last one was sold a couple of years ago.

 

Cheers,

 

Dan