MAMIYA SPORTSFINDER

[ike k]

Hi Everyone! i have a mamiya c330s and would like to know is that

really necessary for me to have sportsfinder for 180,135,105 lens?

since i have all these lenses and i'm going to use those lenses for

portraits work, i don't really need a paramender cause i can put mark

on my tripod for 5cm up from the original spot after i compose the

pic and i don't have to worry about upper and lower level of the pic,

so the questions is about the background of my subject will it make

any difference when i'm using the sportfinder or not? or just go

ahead to do crop when i get the print?. thanks for any infos and

answers.

[miles_feigenbaum___dallas_]

Howdy Izy,

I use the RZ so can't answer you directly but you may find this info of some use. Doesn't seem like you'll need the sports finder though, lets see what users of the TLR have to say...

 

6.4 Finders

Coverage Measurements of the screen apertures on a C330 and C220 give a value of 51mm (to the nearest millimetre), while the image area is 56mm. 51/56 gives a finder coverage of 91%. This is partly to allow for the fractional variations in the positioning of the lenses when they are changed.

 

 

Since the finders are interchangeable amongst the bodies, it is not unknown for older bodies to have the (better) later fitments. There are indications that there are more than two models of finder - possibly two each for the '2' and '3' series cameras. The '2' series finders do not appear to have had the second push down frame for the 65mm lens, just the 80mm aperture, and the C220F model does not have any aperture at all. More information is required about this topic.

 

 

The finders are fitted by sliding the slots at the front of the finder over the lugs on the camera body, and lowering into place. The finder is secured by tightening the screw at the rear of the focusing screen.

 

 

All the finders examined by the compiler of this document (C33, C330, and C330s WLF, CdS Magnifier, and a prism finder) have a recess in the base with a set of spring clips. These are intended to take an auxiliary scale with exposure and parallax correction settings for use with the 80mm setting on the C33 and later models. It consists of an exposure compensation scale on the left, and a new set of parallax marks on the right. This facility may also offer an opportunity for adding a grid overlay to models without interchangeable screens, or for adding format framing guides with all models.

 

 

Here is a scan of a 55/65mm finder insert. The proportions should be correct (printer permitting), and dimensions may be obtained by reference to the recess in the finder. An example examined by the compiler is made of clear plastic with red engraving. It is 55mm square, by slightly over 1mm thick. The bottom edge is chamfered. This short PostScript program, plate2.ps, (also available as an Adobe PDF plate2.pdf can be used to draw an actual size example if a suitable printer is available. It produces two copies each of the correction plate, a simple grid, a combined correction plate and grid, and the standard correction scale for C330+ screens without this feature. The grid leaves the central 10mm focusing spot unobscured, and is approximately correct for horizontal and vertical 10x8" format framing. Good results can be obtained by printing straight to laser grade transparency film.

 

 

A sportsfinder mask fitted with a slight wide-angle lens was available to convert the 80mm aperture of early WLFs to use the 65mm lens. It fits to the sportsfinder mask attachment pins and projects outward by 9mm. It can be left attached, but is vulnerable to scratching, and the raising of focus magnifier and the dropping of the sportsfinder flap is impaired. It is doubtful that a similar fixture was provided for the 55mm, and no reference to such an item has been found. These sportsfinder masks show the relative sizes of the apertures.

 

 

The file mask.ps contains a PostScript program that draws sportsfinder mask templates for the 105mm, 135mm, 180mm, and 250mm lenses, and a combined version. The 'wings' on each side of the template curve forward away from the WLF as an aid to fitting. The keyhole-shaped mounting holes are indicated by the groups of three circles that should be opened to form a circle and slot. The originals use a brass 'U' shaped spring to hold the mask in place. A rubber wedge might make an alternative. Masks can be fabricated from aluminium or brass sheet, or plastic sheet of about 0.030". Transparent acetate is an option, especially for the combined mask. This mask.pdf file is a Portable Document Format version which may be easier to print.

 

 

If you choose to try and fabricate masks using the dimensions given below, the centres of all the masks are the same. The locating lugs on the finder are offset.

 

 

Sportsfinder mask apertures, to the nearest half-millimetre by measurement 105mm lens

 

135mm lens

180mm lens

250mm lens

 

37mm

29.5mm

21.5 mm

15.5mm

 

The paint finish on the original masks varies from a coarse crinkle finish to a fine matt flock texture. All are black with the focal length engraved on the front.

 

6.4.1 WLF, Type 1

A four independent flap type, with simple fixed 3.4x flip up magnifier. The Mamiyaflex pattern was without a sportfinder and the flip-up magnifier was hinged at the rear. Sports finder included openings for the 80mm and 65mm on '3' series cameras, 80mm only for the C220 and none for the C220f. Later versions appear to have had chrome support struts for the front and back flaps. An example of a C330 WLF shows these side struts and the gap between the sides and the magnifier.

 

6.4.2 WLF, Type 2

Single action linked flap type, with magnifier in full-size light shield. Sports finder; 65mm and 80mm masking as standard, longer lengths by additional masks on the C330f and C330s models only. Prior to the C330s version, the 65mm finder flap could be released by pressing in the left flap of the waist level finder. The C220F version does not have a sportsfinder aperture of any size. 5 alternative strengths for the magnifier are available, and are user fitted. It will not accept the WLF magnifier. An example of a C330S WLF shows the better light shielding of this design.

 

6.4.3 WLF Magnifier

6.5x magnifier that clips over the sides of the Type 1 WLF. Has adjustment for eyesight. Cited as late as the C330 manual, but withdrawn with the introduction of the C330f/s (Type 2) WLF, which it will not fit.

 

6.4.4 Magnifying Hood

'Chimney' type 3.5x magnification finder, with switchable 6x central area magnification. The eyepiece is large and is visible using spectacles. The main benefit is from the excellent light shielding compared with the WLF, but it cannot be used at a distance. It is physically large, and does not collapse. However it is no heavier that the WLF. Not listed in the C3 manual, and has apparently been superseded by the CdS Magnifying Hood with the introduction of the C330s. The C330 and C330f manuals list both the metered and non-metered versions.

 

6.4.5 CdS Magnifying Hood

A version of the magnifying hood that incorporates a CdS meter. There seems to have been two variants. The first version had the second-stage magnifier and the meter, while the later version has a meter but does not have the two-stage magnification. The meter must be programmed with the film speed and the viewing lens maximum aperture. The on/off control swings the meter cell into the centre of the field of view. There is a secondary power switch which is depressed when the finder is mounted. Presumably this is to avoid battery drain when the finder is un-mounted. Operation is by the match needle principle, and the exposure must be manually transferred to the lens.

 

 

The meter can be confused by the second diaphragm in the 105mm D lenses, which must be set to match the meter lens aperture setting (normally f3.5). The split-image rangefinder screens can also inflate the reading. The meter cell may be moved slightly with the on/off control to avoid this effect. The meter area is semi-spot, the actual angle of view depending on the lens in use.

 

 

A mercury cell battery is believed to have been used in some models. (Mercury batteries have been discontinued in the USA for some time, and production in Europe will cease shortly. I have no information about the availability of replacements.) Late versions use two silver oxide cells (SG13 or equivalent). This item is not listed in a C330 manual, although the CdS Porrofinder is mentioned. The overall height, with the rubber eye-cup collapsed, is 85mm. This is the same height as the top of the lid of the C330f or C330s WLF when opened. This metered chimney finder is mounted on a C220. The composite dial controls the film speed setting, the lens maximum aperture, and the match needle operation. The meter on/off arm control can be seen at the base of the finder. This example has the rubber eyecup extended and a cap in place.

 

6.4.6 Porrofinder (also known as Porroflex)

Mirror equivalent of pentaprism. The eyepiece is offset to the left, and the finder overhangs the left side of the camera considerably. Due to the overhang the camera does not hang well from the standard strap lugs.. Apparent magnification with 80mm lens is 0.5x. This item is first listed in the C3 manual, and is joined by the metered version in the C330manual. It appears to have been superseded by the metered version by the time of the C330s release. This rear view of a porrofinder , courtesy of HAN, shows the bulk and offset eyepiece of this item.

 

 

The Porroflex version is illustrated in some C33 promotional material as having the name `Porroflex' on the lower front. Early versions were manufactured by Nippon Kogaku (Nikon), though whether this was a sub-contract or third-party product is unclear. Porrofinders in the C330 manual have the usual S-M symbol on the upper front.

 

6.4.7 CdS Porrofinder

Version of the standard Porrofinder incorporating a CdS meter. The meter operates in a similar manner as that in the CdS finder (6.4.5). Versions are known to take Type 76 (1.5v) silver oxide cells, but do verify that batteries are available if contemplating purchase.

 

6.4.8 Prism finder

A true pentaprism, with rubber eyecup and dioptric correction provision. Apparent image size with 80mm lens is 0.7x. Heavy, but brighter than the Porrofinders, if not as bright as the WLF. The full screen area is difficult to see for anyone wearing glasses, and a dioptric correction lens is recommended. This fits under a retaining ring inside the eyepiece. This prism finder is fitted to a C220.

 

6.4.9 Mirror Finder

There is a reference in a C2 manual to 'mirror finder', though it disappears from the accessory list for later models. It resembles the pentaprism in size, with a central eyepiece, unlike the porrofinders. It has a single mirror that provides eye-level, laterally reversed and inverted viewing. The mirror is exposed at the base, and needs careful cleaning. It may have been the prototype for the Porrofinder.

 

 

The rationale for a finder that completely inverts the image eludes me. Unless the user is intended to yse the camera upside down?

 

6.5 Focus knob adapter

An enlarged focus knob to provide finer control. The Type 2, at least, appears to be a scale focusing device for 65, 80, and 105mm lenses, and came in both feet (code DSF-2) and metre (code DSM-2) forms.

 

6.6 Clip-on Distance Scale

This is mentioned but not illustrated in the C3 and C33 manuals, but is illustrated in a C22 / C33 publicity brochure. It is an accessory that slips into the flash shoe with a bracket that attaches to the side of the lens panel. Racking the bellows moves a rod connecting the two portions of the device. The movement of the rod is converted into the motion of a top-reading dial for the 80mm and 65mm lenses. See also the Focus Knob Adapter.

 

 

 

 

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[colmmccarthy]

Iznoor,

 

I use all of the same lenses you list with a Mamiya C330 and C33 for portraits and occasional landscapes. You don't need a sportsfinder at all. The paramender is a far more important piece of equipment IMO but if you feel you can get by without it then you don't need that either.

[bob_finley]

Iznoor, I didn't read all of Miles post so it may have been covered. The sports finders are really just a mask that you look thru (installed on the waist level finder) which allow you to follow moving subjects without the left right viewing problem. Also the sports finders are not real accurate for framing. I have a few of these that I got from bargain bins and never use them. Quite frankly I use an SLR for moving subjects.

 

Paramender is only needed for close ups and you don't need one for portraits unless all you want is only the nose and eyes. I also have a Porrofinder that I use occasionally but it is rather dim and still has the parralax problem.