Budget beginner's Film SLR

[max_fun]

Hi! I'm helping a friend find a beginner's SLR system for him to

explore photography and the essential P&S moments. His budget is

around $200, but he's alright with bargain hunting on Ebay.

 

Anyway for the Nikon camp, I'm thinking of recommending the N6006,

N8008 and N90 since they're going rather cheap right now. I'm avoiding

the N55/65/75 because they're not much cheaper don't have selectable

AF modes and slow x-sync speeds. Does anybody else have any good

suggestions?

 

Also, one of the attractions of getting the N6006 is that apparently

it can meter with manual focus lenses (important for the budget

minded). I'm just wondering if the N8008 has this feature too?

 

Cheers!

[johnw63]

Yes, the 8008 can do this, but I think you might lose the matrix metering and just have center weighted and spot ( or is that only on the S version ? ).

 

Does the guy NEED AF or will a manual focus camera work for them ? If you get an 8008 or the N90, make sure you try for the "S" version. That would be , the N90s and the 8008s. The 90 looks to be just above the $200 mark and th 8008s is nicely below that figure.

 

What about lenses ? Does he have a budget for that ? If a lens needs to be in that $200 figure, I would suggest a Nikon FG and something like the 50mm f1.8 E lens. You could get BOTH of these for just above $100. Then get a small zoom, like the 75-150mm E series. I think it would go for under the left over $100. It all depends on how much they have to spend and what type of pictures.

 

I'm sure others will have differing ideas, but that is truely an economical way to get into photography.

[acearle]

You also might consider the F80/N80, I think they might be available used in the U.S.. I have the F80 (the N80 in North America) and love it.

 

I'd definitely look into Canon also, but I don't shoot Canon and know very little about them. In some ways, I wish I had gone Canon instead of Nikon when I switched to a modern system (from a VERY old Honeywell-Pentax system that finally died). Hopefully some Canon shooters will pipe up and add their $0.02 worth here :-). One of the things that Canon shooters have that we Nikon folks don't is a plethora of image stabelizing lenses (we have them for Nikon, but they are more expensive, and I hear that the Canon IS lenses are a little better). Canon optics vs. Nikon optics seems like a moot point now, they are both excellent :-).

[arnabdas]

I would recommend the Canon Elan 7e, or Nikon F80 if you decide to choose Nikon.

[anupam]

I'm not sure what you mean by selectable AF modes. But while I would second the N80, I wouldn't rule out the N75 if you are on a budget. It's available under $100 new - great deal if you ask me.

 

If MF compatibility is important - N90(s) or one of the manual cameras for under $150.

 

-A

[david_h._hartman]

If you cant get the finest current or recent AF Nikons I

recommend these at KEH.com<br>

<br>

Nikon FE2, chrome, Excellent, $215.00<br>

Nikon EL2, chrome, Excellent Plus, $235.00<br>

Nikon FE, black, Excellent Plus, $205.00<br>

Nikon FE, chrome, Excellent Plus, $189.00<br>

<br>

You might pay less on eBay but these come with a 14 return

privilege and a 6 month warrantee. These are solid cameras worthy

of hard professional use. If you plan an AF system you can use

many AF-D Nikkors with these cameras. They have excellent

viewfinders something not seen on current economy Nikon bodies.<br>

<br>

Regards,<br>

<br>

Dave Hartman.

[tristanlaing]

Consider an F601, or even an N2020. An N2020 with 50mmAF lens can often be had on ebay for less than 100$, and an F601 is actually good, and is almost as cheap. I recently purchased a 50mm chinese AF 1.8 for 24$ on ebay, and a japanese one for 27. (They were poorly advertised and had cracked filter rings).

[tristanlaing]

Can someone tell me where these N75s for less than 100$ are? If I had known, I probably would have bought one instead of my F90x. I'd buy one as a second body, except that they won't meter with my growing collection of manuel lenses.

[anupam]

<i>Can someone tell me where these N75s for less than 100$ are?</i><p>

Buydig.com was having a sale - $96 after rebate. A couple of my friends got it at that price. <a href="http://buydig.com/shop/product.aspx?sku=NKN75">Now it seems to have gone up to $119.</a> Oh well!

<p>

<i>I'd buy one as a second body, except that they won't meter with my growing collection of manuel lenses</i>

<p>Me too.<p>-A

[carl photography]

Within his budget, he could buy:

 

-- one of the autofocus Nikon models that has low used prices, such as an N70; and

 

-- a Nikon 50mm f1.8 autofocus lens (superb glass!); and

 

-- a lens hood.

 

There's no reason to spend more than $200, since he might migrate to digital-land whenever he buys a second camera.

 

"Brandon's Dad"

[max_fun]

Thanks for the recommendations guys!

 

Anupam, when I mean selectable AF modes, I mean the function where you can select whether you want Single AF shot or a Continuous one. I don't trust the camera to select these when you need it. That's why I'm not considering the N55/65/75 cameras. Only the N80 seems to be ok, but it's still above the $200 mark.

 

Currently, I think I'm rather torn between the N6006, N8008s and the N90s. The N6006 has the benefit of a built-in flash, but like the N8008s, you can't AF with AF-I/S lenses. The N90s has no problem with this, but it won't meter with manual lenses. Bummer.

 

I think if I'm going to recommend manual focus lenses with the N6006/8008 cameras, do you think it's easy enough to focus with these cameras? Is the viewfinder big enough? Can you use a ground glass focusing screen for it?

 

As for the Canon camp, I'm also looking at the Elan 7, which seems pretty affordable on Ebay as well.

 

Thanks again for your help!

[ShunCheung]

The N8008 and N90 plus their subsequent improved "S" models can all meter with manual-focus lenses that have no built-in CPU, but the metering is limited to center weighted and spot only (no spot metering on the non-S N8008); there is no matrix metering. IMO, not having matrix metering is not an important issue.

 

The main difference between the N8008 and N90 families is that the N90 can auto focus with AF-S lenses. IMO that can be a significant difference.

[lachaine]

The N75 has selectable AF modes. It's very much like an N80, but with less flexible mixing and matching of various AF and AE modes, and no manually selectable ISO setting. But other than that, it's eminently suitable for the beginner's use you want. It's basically the same AF system as the N80, and the AE system is actually a little better. It can't meter with manual lenses, but then, it can use all the current Nikkors, even the ones with the most advanced features.

[richard_meyers]

Max -

 

And now for something completely different...

 

Look for a clean, working Nikkormat FTn or FT2 and a 50mm f/1.4 Nikkor. If your lucky, you'll have a few dollars left for film and processing.

 

As has been mentioned, check out the used depts. of major camera stores such as B&H and KEH.com or local camera stores who will stand behind the camera for atleast a short while.

[cgarrett]

^This man knows what's up. I learned photography from the ground up, with my

dad's FTn that had already seen four continents and a few years in africa (peace

corps). After only god knows how many shutter cycles, it still works perfectly. The

only trouble I've had is getting batteries for the meter, as it is designed to work with

discontinued mercury cells, but since I learned with the zone system, I rarely use the

meter anyway. The Nikkor 50mm f1.4 is fast and a great lens that I find myself using

more than any other. Anyway, when you need to do everything manually when

shooting, you have the ultimate creative tool as well as the best way to learn the

science of photography.

[max_fun]

Shun, thanks for the heads up. Looks like the N90s is now at the top of the pile. I think short of the N80, this is the best body overall for future lenses and overall control options. Can someone comment about the viewfinder? Is it big enough for manual lenses?

 

Pierre, are you sure that the N75 has a selectable AF mode? According to Nikon's website, you only get a choice of Auto Servo AF or Manual, unlike the N80. Anyway, a 89% viewfinder seems pretty wrong.

 

Richard, I was thinking of a manual set-up as well, namely the FM and FE bodies. Personally, I find using something totally stripped down like the Leica M has really helped me with my photography, but it's really not quite as handy for P&S moments, which is one of his requirements as well. Still, I'll put some manual cameras down, including the Olympus OM series, as possible alternatives.

 

Thanks again!

[work-page]

The F75 has both shutter priority AF and focus priority AF. These are linked to the exposure modes. Sports exposure mode for instance has shutter priority while most others have focus priority. For single and continuous shooting there's a separate slider.

 

But why you'd want to have shutter priority AF on a 6006/8008 is beyond me. Their AF is not anywhere in the same league as the current AF bodies (F75/F80). The 6006 I had a long time ago had a lethargic AF that it was virtually useless. It isn't even a nice manual focus body, lacking DOF preview. Moverover, the film advance is loud enough to wake up the dead.

 

Oh, and with regards to x-sync, the F75 has normal, slow and rear curtain. It also has DOF preview, and supports Silent Wave and VR lenses (same goes for the F80 at a different price point).

 

The only older body that I would consider (AF performance, lens compatibility from manual to silent wave, and DOF preview) is the F90x.

[sara_van_de_carr]

From what I've heard, the N90 won't take the G lenses. If he's on a budget, the G lenses are perfect since they are around $100 or lower. The N80 takes them though.

[carl photography]

The N70 is cheap, and its features are similar to the N90: spot/wide autofocus or manual, can be used with old AI lenses (with an in-focus symbol in the viewfinder, and manual or aperture-priority metering), front or rear shutter-curtain flash synch, spot or 3D matrix or center-weighted metering (with a +/- one-stop range precisely indicated in the viewfinder), single or continuous AF, single or continuous motordrive, ambient or flash +/- exposure compensation, DX or manual ISO setting, self timer, etc. -- and it has a built-in flash, avoiding another purchase until your friend has the money for a larger strobe. The N70 flash synch speed is 1/125 (rather than 1/250).

 

At keh.com, an Excellent N70 body costs $119. With a used lens, this outfit would meet your friend's $200 budget. A new 50 f1.8D lens would cost $97, slightly over budget.

 

I've used one for 10 years, and it works well.

 

"Brandon's Dad"

[david_h._hartman]

The N80/F80 focus screen is unsuitable for manual focus with

wide angle lenses. Its really unpleasant with short

telephotos but acceptable I guess. Many dont understand the

need for manual focus with some subjects and the importance of

the ability to verify visually the performance of AF. I dont

recommend the camera for photos of people under moderate to low

ambient light.

[david_chananie]

Wouldn't you agree that if you zone focus you can have as many point and shoot moments as you wish? If so, a solid nikkormat, or if you want a 100% viewfinder, an f2, would do nicely.

[._._z]

FE2 in 'bargain' condition from KEH ($150) and 50/1.4 or 1.8 also in bargain condition

($50). Comes with a 2-week, no-questions-asked return policy.

 

AF modes on cheap bodies will be a source of frustration for a beginner, and the

manual-focus capabilities on them tend to range from annoying to impossible.

[chris_carroll]

An 8008 would be a good way to get yr friend to quit photography.

It's loud, heavy, annoying, with so-so AF and an iffy user interface

(ditto the N90 xcept AF is better). I remember thinking these

things 10-15 years ago when I was forced to use it in order to

have access to a long fast tele (I normally used at that time an

EOS 10s). An N75, or better yet, an N80 would destroy it in most

things a beginner or anyone needs: reliability, low weight, good

AF, good metering, ease of use. Even the most pretentious of

beginners don't typically need interchangeble focus screens,

fancy flash options, mf lens compatibility. He can buy another

body in a few years if he ever does need this stuff.

[max_fun]

Thanks again for the help. I'm having to rethink the N75 now, since it seems to be pretty close the N80. I was just a little confused because the Nikon website claims that you're forced to use the Auto Servo AF or else you'll have manual focus. Having used the Digital Rebel, I'm not too keen on not being able to choose when to use Single Shot or Continuous AF modes. If the N75 really does allow the user to make such a choice, then I can probably overlook its 89% viewfinder, slow 1/90s flash sync and the inability to overide DX settings.