How do you deal with photophobic guests?

[anner]

I ran into a few people for this wedding who- for whatever reason- insisted that I not take

pictures of them. They were very important people in the bride & groom's life- her

mother, her brother, and his son. I could have been less obvious had the lighting

conditions been better- but unfortunately I had to use flash more than I wanted to. On

one hand- I want to honor their guests requests so that I don't make them uncomfortable,

but on the other hand- I'm there to document the day, the people, and their feelings. I

assured them that I would only take flattering shots, like when the mother was putting on

her makeup in her nightgown- I told her the nightgown wouldn't even be recognizable.

And when the brother was drinking before the ceremony even though he was "told" not

to- I assured him that the beer wouldn't show in the picture. I think eventually they

warmed up to me- but I still found this to be a conflict of interest. Have you had this

happen? How do you handle it? What about a kid that refuses to smile?

 

In a rare moment, when he wasn't watching me or running to be out of my camera angle, I

caught him preparing his "suicide drink" as he drugged himself with caffine...<div></div>

[melisa]

It's all part of the job. Half my family is "photophobic", so they've been good practice for me. Sounds like you did a fine job, communication is the key. Not everyone is going to smile, but they likely will at some point, so keep your eyes open.

[robert_c_harvey]

Anne, That is a difficult situation! I usually run into one or two camera shy guests, but half the darn wedding party? You sound like you did ok!

Sometimes people are self conscious, and are afraid of how the pictures will portray them. Other times they are just shy.

Robert C. Harvey

[beauh44]

>What about a kid that refuses to smile?

 

Kids? No problem! How about the bride? I got a call Thursday night that most photographers dread: A close friend called. Her niece's wedding is Saturday and the photographer, for whatever reason, couldn't make it. Could I please? Well, I don't usually don't do many weddings (I have a lot of respect for those who do), but she talked me into it since it was a very informal affair. Anyway, the bride is an hour late. When she arrived, how can I put this delicately? She wasn't the most lovely creature to behold. I always liked to think I could take at least one good picture of most anybody, but this girl had a permanent scowl on her face and looked a lot like some bulldogs I've seen in junkyards. Her new hubby looks like he stepped out of a JC Penney catalog, so when they stood beside each other there was quite a juxtaposition. Anyway, after the official part of the ceremony, the bride asks for pics of her and various friends and relatives, all of whom smiled quite eagerly for the camera. Not the bride. She glared. She frowned. She looked like she wanted to cause cancer and not cure it, start world hunger, not stop it, etc, etc. So I stopped for a second and begged her to please, please smile. (She even has a fairly nice smile) Well, I might as well have been talking to a stump; she just glared back at me, even harder. Out of 250 or so shots, there are maybe 3 in which she's smiling. She's not exactly Twiggy, and has a face like James Cagney eating persimmons and it shows in the shots. I always remained polite and I don't think she was mad at me because she had the same facial expression for everyone else too. You guys have a tough gig! Good luck . . .

[anner]

Beau- that is too funny!!! My bride started her day off that way and I tried to only capture

moments when she wasn't "pissed"! Or- if I couldn't help her look- I shot an angle that

showed what was going on without showing her face (sad but true)! You would think

children would be easy! A boy entering puberty can be very uncooperative when he wants

to be! I had to resort to something that boys like- gross and unflattering- so I asked him

if I had a booger hanging out of my nose and I caught a split second smile. It was one of

my only chances... although, I'd rather not make a habit of asking people if I have bodily

fluids hanigng outside of my body!

[steve_levine]

This is something you should have been advised of at the pre wedding contacts with the happy couple.Once this fact was established,you should have gone about your day without them.

[anner]

Steve- I'm pretty sure that the couple had no idea that their mom, brother, and son would

respond that way- especially since they made sure I knew who these people were so that I

could get "key shots" of them on the wedding day. They were very shocked when they

experienced their family member's reactions and they tried to get them more involved. I

did the best I could and I talked to the couple openly about it after the wedding so that

they knew what went on and how I dealt with it. I do think that talking about this kind of

thing in advance is something I could do with future couples when discussing challenges-

but I would be careful about not dwelling on it so that it doesn't look like I'm not even

going to try. It's a delicate balance and I always hope to do the best with what I have.

[steve_levine]

Everytime we shoot,we learn.If it were me,I would have asked these people nicely to do this for the bride.This is such outrageously immature behavior,I wouldnt have been able to hold my tongue!

 

Next time,simply tell them this day isnt about "them",but its the bride's day,and that their behavior is spoiling a part of it.If the guilt doesnt work,try embarassing them.What jerks!

[william_au]

A 300mm lens? :) That's a tough spot to be in - it's a talent to get people to open up to you for a picture in the best of times. I just try to be friendly and persuasive as best I can, but I never try and force a shot. I've had quite a few young flower/ring-bearers that couldn't handle all the attention - sometimes some coercing from the parents/bride/groom convinces them to try a few shots, and other times we've just gone ahead without them in the shot. When the latter happens, I make an effort to try and catch a nice candid shot of the kids, or one with the couple later in a less pressure-filled spot.

 

Beau - that had to have been one long day :) Maybe scowling back at her would have worked.

[picturesque]

If one of the guests (not part of the immediate family) asks not to be photographed, I comply. If they are part of the immediate family, and I can't persuade them to be photographed through humor or saying that the couple would be disappointed if I didn't photography their relatives and friends, I talk to the contact person or to the couple themselves. If they can't persuade their own family members to comply, I don't photograph them since this would make things even worse on an already stressful day.

 

Once, the uncle of a bat mitzvah kid asked not to photograph him dancing with her. In the past, I've had similar requests from folks who were just shy. So I snuck one and he got really, really mad. Had a few words with me later. I apologized, and when I delivered the proofs to the kid's parents, they laughed, and said he was an uptight guy. So they weren't unhappy or concerned but the next time someone asks me not to photography them, I'll be more careful.

 

If at a wedding, a kid refuses to cooperate, I try different tactics if I have the time. I have a plastic toy frog that "ribets" and lights up. It is small enough that I have it attached to a zipper on my photo bag. Strangely enough, it works about 80 percent of the time--not on pre-adolescent and teenagers, of course. At a wedding, you don't have enough time to get perfect smiles from kids. I try, but if I fail, I give up and move on.

 

Teenagers and young adults are much more difficult. When I photograph bar and bat mitzvahs, these teens sometimes don't want to cooperate at all. About the only thing that works, if at all, is to tell them that the sooner they cooperate, the sooner the photo session is over. If you are an authoritative type, which I am not, the "take charge" attitude could work for you. I've seen it work for some photographers. You don't know what stress is if you've never photographed a bar or bat mitzvah kid who doesn't want you to get any photographs of him/her. You have to use a combination of psychology, manipulation, stealthy PJ technique and sometimes sic mom or dad on him/her.

[melisa]

Here's a funny story from the uncooperative archive; terribly boring down time waiting for things to kick off at the reception, I asked the bride and groom if they wanted some table shots (keep myself busy), they said "Oh yes". Well my very first table held a cranky young woman who refused the shot with a very snotty "no" and then a "I'm going to the bathroom", while everyone, including her date, just looked on in wonder. In my best Jim Carey inpersonation, I gave an "Alrighty then", said some unmentionables to myself and decided to start on the other side of the room--a fresh start. Got all my shots and ended up with their table as my last one, I approached them again and asked politely if they would do this memory shot requested by the bride and groom and she was soooo embarrassed. Everyone was ribbing her, they even tried to cover her face with a dinner napkin to keep her face out of the picture. I was a good girl, I had a choice of presenting the couple with a fun, laughing shot of the entire group or the one with the young lady half blinking and mouth distorted; I chose the good shot, but boy did I ever want to give them the other.

 

BTW, table shots are horrible, but the couples seem to really enjoy them and it gets everyone once. I would love to do one big pano of the whole gang, anyone do this? Another thread, I guess, just thinking "outloud".

[todd frederick]

I like all the stories but this is a possible solution:

 

If you are having problems with the cooperation of the guests and/or wedding party/or anyone to participate in the photography, immediately go to whomever is in charge...the bride, the bride's mother, the wedding coordinator, the security guards, etc...and tell them that you can not do your job under the circumstances and that you will not be responsible if those who are photographed do not like their photos or if they prevent you from doing the job, you will leave for security reasons. Bring paper with you and put it in writing, and have the bride or groom or whomever is in charge sign it, and then do the best you can, or leave.

 

This is not an uncommon problem. I have had many receptions where the persons involved were drunk out of their minds, one even dumping his drink on the engagement portrait, or where neighborhood teens (and adults) crashed the reception and created total destruction!

 

I now include a clause in my contract that I will leave the reception immediately if it becomes drunken or is a dangerous venue.

 

What a great world we live in!

[cjogo]

When they are uncooperative..we have someone in family or B&G>> document their refusal>> to have a photograph taken ..and we are no longer responsible..off the hook completely.

[stephen hazelton]

"like when the mother was putting on her makeup in her nightgown- I told her the nightgown wouldn't even be recognizable. And when the brother was drinking before the ceremony even though he was "told" not to- I assured him that the beer wouldn't show in the picture."- It looks to me like part of the problem is poor timing in when those shots are taken- would you want to be photographed in your nightgown while putting on makeup, or while drinking when you're not supposed to be? I don't think you can blame them for being a tad uncomfortable in those cases.

[derek_c.]

Agree with Stephen.<br>

When I take pictures of people in awkward situation (in the bathroom, half-dressed bride, group of smokers...). I always make sure if they are up to these kind of shots.<br>

Some say yes, some say no..<br>

It's my job to make them smile either way.<br>

Also, you are more likely to have pissy guests when you make little money.<br>

Because, chances are, your customers will not be wealthy and highly educated.

[anner]

I love hearing all of these stories! This is great! ;-)

 

Stephen,

I completely agree with you- I could have had much better timing. Unfortunately those

were the few chances that I had to capture those people interracting with the bride &

groom because I knew that they were going to be busy "behind the scenes" after the

ceremony. No one wants an unflattering picture, and perhaps that is where my

photojournalistic nature took over my sensitive side. I didn't see those moments as

unflattering- I saw them as beautiful and genuine moments that would help tell the story

of the day. The bride & groom ended up liking those pictures- and to me, that's all that

matters. ;-)

[derek_c.]

Personally, I would not rub in my own personal taste to those who don't like my idea.<br>

B&G is already my customer, and they will come back to me... possibly never.<br>

But the rest of the guests are the potential customers.<br>

I make sure to let them know I am the most likeable photographer they will ever meet.<br>

I will gladly give up a few cool shots to please a handful of potential customers.<br>

But, that's just me.<br>

If I get booked solid every year, perhaps, I would not care much about the guests' feelings.

[kimberly c.]

During posed shots when the party is not playing nice, my

assistant has come up with a few comments that normally get

them to behave

#1 I see you are married...so you have done this before!

#2 Are all of you friends... ok act like it. (she can get away with it, I

wouldn't reccomend this comment to others)

#3 Do you think insert B&G's name want to see that

(beer,cigarette,scoul, whatever) 25 years from now when they

are looking at their wedding pictures.

# 4 The one that works ALL THE TIME, The quicker you

cooperate the quicker you can get to the bar!

Alot of family members and friends seem to be so selfish at

weddings, you need to remind them that the day is NOT about

them its about the B&G. Everything needs to be said with a

smile of course, but needs to be said none the less when these

problems arise. If I had a mom that didnt want her pic taken in

her bathrobe I would have put my camera down and gotten shots

of her after she was dressed and after a glass of champagne.

There are hundreds of oportunities during the day to get those

meaningful shots, just make sure to be a Ninja!!!

[steve_levine]

Bar & Bat Mitzvahs are an aquired taste,IMHO.The kids are snotty little SOB's for the most part now days,and you have to be prepared to be a "jr.high school gym teacher",with them.Lining up 12 year olds for a formal shot is almost impossible without yelling or threatening!By the time you are 2 steps away,they are all moving.Their attention spans are about 5 seconds from too much TV & video games!Id rather have a bunch of "drunk on cheap champagne", 20 year olds at a wedding.

[lloyd_dobbie]

Beau,

Please post a few shots from that wedding, please!

Lloyd

[rick_hensil]

In response to the frog to make people laugh---keep a stuffed Elmo on hand. If you encounter someone over 30 who won't smile, pull out Elmo and in a sickening baby voice say, "Do I haff to get out Elmo? Doeth Elmo need to cheer you up?" And the person will be so embarrassed and feel so ridiculous that they will start cracking up and SNAP! you have your smile.

[fotografz]

Anne, it seems the subjects are to aware of you. Usually you get an intuitive hint that a

subject is camera shy or whatever. Especially awkward pre-teens that are so aware of

themselves and their awkwardness. Chubby kids (like your subject pictured above ) are

often that way... not really all that happy in their own skin.

 

Now please don't take this the wrong way, we all are on a journey of learning at every

shoot, but that image you posted is the last one I'd shoot of that child. He's obviously

overweight and picturing him slugging down 5 sodas ... well ...

 

IMO, stealth and timing is the hardest part of PJ wedding photography to master. If a

subject, adult or child, expresses a reluctance to being photographed, then even more

stealth, patience and timing are required. Trying to win them over is usually time

consuming and at best produces weak, self conscience images. I simply ignore them

completely, until they forget I'm there ... then catch them totally unaware just being

themselves. Themselves, not some ideal imposed on them. But not derogatory either.

 

Finally, IMO, it isn't necessary to get everyone at a wedding grinning into the camera. The

little boy pictured below was less than happy about the whole prospect of being in a

wedding instead of being outside frying ants with a magnifying glass. But it is exactly how

he felt, so I shot it because that's part of recording the whole day and all of it's range of

emotions. His mom loved it... because it was so him.

 

It's all part of dissolving that wall between you and the subjects... using human sensitivity,

intuitive guile ... and a hungry eye.<div></div>

[fotografz]

I apologize for 2 picture posts, but another point...

 

When posing, it's sometimes more indicative of kids personalities to let them be.

 

In the image below, my assistant went to adjust the clothes on these tough Irish lads, and

their mom stopped her saying she wouldn't recognize them that way. I didn't force them

to smile either.<div></div>