Schneider / other lens choices for Linhof Technika V

[simonpg]

With this forum's help, I recently bought a Linhof Super Technika V,

and I love it. The front and rear movements are a revelation. I would

like to get a nice wide angle lens for indoor architecture and

landscapes; plus a long-ish lens for landscapes with nice

compression. Going on my 35mm experience and preferences, I think

somewhere between 20mm and 28mm for the wide so long as it has low

curvature distortion. At the long end, some where between 100mm and

150mm would be nice. My camera came with nice 135mm Symmar and 250mm

Tele-Arton lenses - both f5.6. They seem nice for normal and

portrait / external buildings. So in planning my kit it seems that

someting like 80mm and 360mm would suit.

So my questions are (based on some lenses available to me): 1. how

wide can I go on the Tech V before I need recessed lensboard? Will a

72mm Super-Angulon XL be ok or too wide? Does 72mm distort much

(curvature) as it seems wider than a 35mm format 20mm lens? 2. Would

I be better off with a 75, 80, or 90 (maybe too close to my 135mm to

make a difference)? 3. How long can I go with a non-Tele lens before

I run out of focus rail on my Tech V. Is the Schneider 360mm

desireable?

 

My apologies for long winded question/s. Yes I am referring to

Schneider offerings as they are all I have researched - just so many

more issues and offerings in LF. If you have used others I'd be keen

to hear of your experiences.

 

Many thanks.

[michael_briggs2]

<p>I haven't used a Linhof Technika so I can't answer all of your specific questions.</p>

 

<p>I don't think you should be concerned about distortion in wide-angle LF lenses, as long are using the technical meaning of the word "distortion". Some people term the perspective effecs of short focal lengths lenses, e.g., the looming largeness of near objects, as "distortion&quot. This isn't really the best use of the term, and all lenses with focal lengths much shorter than the format diagonal will do this in some circumstances -- it is just how a short focal length lens renders perspective. The technical meaning of distortion is the rendering of straight lines in the subject as curved lines in the image. Wide-angle LF lenses have much lower distortion (in this sense) than SLR lenses. Lenses for SLRs must be designed as retro-focus lenses so that there is space for the mirror -- this isn't necessary nor done for LF lenses and the result is much less distortion. You might want to look at a recent thread with a specific comparison: <a href="http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=008dqf">http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=008dqf</a>.</p>

 

<p>One Technika user reports that the bellows extends to somewhat more than 15 inches, or about 380 mm (<a href="http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=008kph">http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=008kph</a>. With this much extension a regular 360 mm lens is probably borderline. A rule of thumb is that you want about 25% more extension than the focal length for a non-telephoto lens. You already have a 250 telephoto lens, so why not a 360 mm telephoto? Besides the Schneider, the Nikkor-T is well regarded.</p>

 

<p>My opinion is that the closest focal length spacing that makes sense is roughly a factor of 1.5. This suggests that a 90 mm probably is probably sufficiently different from a 135 mm lens to be useful.</P>

 

<p>You might want to use your camera for a while before deciding which additional lenses you want. Maybe you will learn that you want something much wider than 135 mm, or maybe only somewhat wider. While the obvious mathematical approach is to calculate conversions by the ratio of the format diagonals (i.e., a factor of 3.5), the conversion is more subtle. The format aspect ratios are different, the LF camera offers movements, and you might concentrate on different subjects with the two types of cameras.</p>

[brian_ellis3]

I've owned a Technika V and now own a Classic Master Technika. Your first consideration with a short focal length lens isn't the need for a recessed lens board, it's whether you can use the lens even with a recessed lens board. The shortest lens that supposedly is usable on the Tech V without the wide angle focusing device (which is much different and much more expensive than a recessed lens board) is 75mm. That will require a recessed lens board and your movements, especially front rise, will still be restricted a good bit. I used a 90mm F5.6 Super Angulon on my Tech V without a recessed lens board. I'm not sure about an 80mm lens. I own one but didn't have it when I owned the Tech V and only recently acquired my Master Technika. I played around with the 80 on the Master and it seemed like it would work without a recessed board. However a Linhof recessed board became available on e bay at a good price a couple weeks ago and I bought it just to be safe so I'll never know how well if at all the flat board would have worked in actual practice with the 80mm.

 

FWIW, I think there's a big enough difference between your 135mm and a 90mm to make the 90mm worthwhile. You could get a nice F8 used Super Angulon for about $500. The 80mm Super Symmar XL costs about $1,400 new and you seldom see them used. I don't offhand know of another 80mm lens.

 

On the long end, I have a 300mm normal lens and used it a lot on the Tech V so I know that works. Linhof says the maximum bellows extension on the Master is 430mm and I believe it's the same on the Tech V, i.e. a tad more than 17 inches. Presumably that's with the extra couple inches gained by extending the back. So based on the Linhof specs and my assumption a 360mm normal lens should be usable with the back extension. As you probably know, extending the back isn't hard to do but it's something more to fiddle around with. If you do end up with a 360 be sure to get a quick release plate for the front bed, you'll need it with a lens that long.

 

There's no need to restrict yourself to Schneider lenses. Modern lenses of the same design from Rodenstock, Schneider, Nikon, and Fuji all perform about the same. The differences lie in things like price, size, weight, image circle, maximum aperture, single vs. multi-coating, stuff like that. At least that's what everyone says and what my limited experience will all four brands indicates.

[mike_rosenberg1]

You should not need a recessed board with any wide angle lens on a Tech V or IV, if you use the rear to focus. This allows you to drop the bed out of the way, and get maximum use out of the camera. Regarding long lenses, Wista and Toyo make a ring extension for a special flat board that permits further extension. Using this ring system I can use my Fuji 450 (a very light weight long lens) on my Master 2000.

 

Regards,

 

Mike

[simonpg]

Many thanks to each of you for your help.

[paul_hoyt]

With my 90mm super angulon lens, I found I needed the recessed lens board. Without it movements were very resticted. The question is how wide a lens do you need and how often will you use it. The feeling from most photographers who have minimal lenses, 90 is a good lens to own. In the short focus/wide angle class you will probalby use it the most. If you have a special need for the 75, you can rent one for that occassion. I suggest you rent any lens you are thinking of buying that is less than 90mm to see how "the world" looks in 4x5 and then try to imagine how often you will have a need for that lens. That can be big bucks for a lens that is used twice a year. If it turns out that your style of photography is up close and wide angle, then the super short focus/wide angle lenses are for you, but I seriously doubt it. In 20 years of view camera photography, I have not been sorry that my 90mm lens is my "smallest" lens I own. In fact it is starting to take a back seat to a 121 super angulon I bought a few months ago. The slightly larger image with more coverage (movements) has been rewarding. A couple of years ago I bought the Nikon 360 telephoto lens. I was intrigued with the possibility of buying rear elements to make 500mm and 720mm lenses; same front element, 3 different rear elements. I found I use my 210 as the major longer than normal lens. I have not bought any of the other rear elements. Go on a mini vacation and rent some lenses that you think you must have and after your photo expidention you will know what lenses you will want as part of your permanent collection and which lenses you can live without.

 

Paul

[simonpg]

Many thanks Paul. That is very good advice. While considering the angle of view I use in 35mm format is a guide, how a similar angle of view looks in 4x5 is somewhat different again. So while I might find circa 24mm (35mm format) very useful, in 4x5 maybe something more like 30mm (35mm format) may be more useful in 4x5.

 

I will rent and try.

 

Interestingly with my Hasselblad kit I bought a 50mm FLE rather than a 40mm version for landscapes because I found in square format 40mm may be too limiting. Consequently I use the 50mm a lot. In fact it probably produces an angle of view more like the LF 90mm.