peter_bongard Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 Hi!I plan to buy an M-Leica. Since I do mostly street and concert-photography, I wonder which model has the lowest shutter-noise? I'm leaning towards the M6, since it has a built-in, spot-like meter, but it's quite expensive. Do you guys think that an M3 or M2 with a handheld meter would also be ok? Which Spotmeter (used) can you suggest?Regards,Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lacey_smith4 Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 off-hand, adding in the cost of a spotmeter, the M6 beigns to look favorable. Some might argue an old IIIf, perhaps with a modern voigtlander lens, might be even a little quieter, but would require a separate meter. There are also (minor) differences between bodies -- some M6s quieter than others. You might also consider the lens you will need, and see if the normal 35 or 50 will work, if not, add the cost of a 90 in the equation before you plan heavily. Spotmeters come in tight spots (1 degree), which tend to be a bit more expensive, and broader spots, such as a 5-10 degree attachment for a meter such as a Sekonic 328 (which I like) or such (Gossen, Minolta, Polaris, etc.). Frankly, enough experience, and metering certain areas ahead of time (like going down to the stage during pre-arrangements), may obviate the need for in-concert metering. I think your choice will be driven by cost and what you find available -- nothing wrong with used, if it works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spearhead Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 If you want quiet and a 35mm lens, the Hexar AF is by far the best tool. I've used it at concerts. However, what kind of concerts are you going to that require quiet? All the concerts I shoot require ear plugs. Music and Portraits Blog: Life in Portugal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albert knapp md Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 I am interested in this area of photography and use an M7 with a 90mm f/2 APO with great results. the only problem is that you have to have great seats or the ability to move around and get close to the stage. OTOH, the official photographer for the BSO (Boston Symphony Orchestra) uses a M3 with a Visoflex and I think a 600mm lens or something like that. The results: just look at the BSO's brochure!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen_w. Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 Peter, You don't mention what type of concert you wish to photograph. I'm assuming a classical concert, since you need a quiet camera. The following is for photographing a rock concert: I photographed a Fleetwood Mac concert in 1977 (I was still in high school, which ages me) when people (are lawyers people?) didn't worry about commercialization so much. I still have the negatives and hand made color proof prints (pretty good, a lot of hits, especially of Lindsey Buckingham playing guitar), but am now afraid to scan and post them. Aw fcuk it, I'll get a couple/few done in the near future. Stay tuned I used a Nikon F2 and an 80-200, f4.0 zoom, walked up to the stage (no buffer zone) and security gave me 10-minutes. I shot two rolls, no motor. I guessed exposure because of the varying lighting. So, a Leica with a separate spot meter (I sort of used a variation of sweet 16) and a lens or two depending on how close you're going to get and what you want, neither specified. If, indeed, you want to photograph a classical concert, you don't need a spot meter, and go wide for the group, and tele for individuals. Jeff, One would indeed need ear plugs for rock concerts in order to use a 35mm lens on the Hexar AF. I didn't. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmarkpainter Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 Peter, I actually prefer an SLR for concert photos....BUT an M3 is preferable for longer focal length lenses. What lenses do you use for concerts now? jmp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob F. Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 Two Leicas that impress me as noticeably quieter than the others, are the M3 and M7. My M2 is almost as quiet as that. I think an M3 might be a good choice, if you don't think you will need wideangle lenses, because the finder will be completely flare-free under what may be difficult lighting conditions, and would give accurate focusing with the long and fast lenses you might wish to use for this, to get closeups of performers. An M6TTL with 0.85 finder would also provide the accurate focusing with longer/fast lenses, and would give you the metering capability you mentioned; but might be a tad louder, and will exhibit rangefinder whiteout under the adverse conditions you might encounter with stage lighting. You know, you could shoot with an old Rolleiflex, have the benefit of a 75mm or 80mm lens, or even longer with a tele-Rollei, and no one will hear the shutter, even during pianissimo passages. You can always crop the negative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spearhead Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 <Center><img src="http://www.spirer.com/ringchildren/images/rc2.jpg"><br><i>Ringchildren at The Pound, Copyright 2002 Jeff Spirer</i></center> Music and Portraits Blog: Life in Portugal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay_. Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 My vote is for the M7. The shutter is about the same sound level as the other M's from 1/50 and faster, but much quieter below 1/50 due to the absence of the slow-speed escapement geartrain. More importantly the stepless shutter in AUTO mode (has AE-lock with half-press and hold of shutter release) lets you keep the lens wide open for the fastest possible shutter speed. With the mechanical shutters, if the exposure at maximum aperture calls for an intermediate speed, you need to drag the shutter one whole step and stop the lens down a half stop. My favorite lens for concert photography is the 135/3.4 APO-Telyt (the only reason I haven't sold it and gone back to the Tele-Elmar and pocketed some cash). The Elmarit is of course a half stop faster, but the performance wide open is way below the APO's and the weight and bulk including the goggles concealed in the front inside pocket of my suit jacket makes me look like I've had a unilateral breast implant. As for film, if you soup it right, Delta 3200 gives amazing sharpness and reasonable grain considering the speed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter_n1664876959 Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 Albert you are very bad if you are taking your M7 to Symphony Hall. You're not supposed to be taking pictures in there... ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter_bongard Posted January 10, 2004 Author Share Posted January 10, 2004 Is there such a thing like a spotmeter that can be mounted on the hotshoe of a camera? The voigtländer meter isn't a true spotmeter...! PEter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikal_grass Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Peter I shot this with an M6.85, a 50 'lux and Ilford 3200 speed film. I shot this from the second row. The singer is Malena Burke, the daughter of Elana Burke, one of the grand dames of Cuban "son". It was shot at Hoy Como Ayer in Little Havan in Miami. Please excuse the hot spots on the photo. Shutter noise was not an issue, as it won't be at most concerts. I shot another two rolls on New Year's Eve of Malene Burke and Albita, another Cuban singer, with the same set up. The lighting was much brighter, I was much closer, and more than once I experienced the dreaded white-out in the viewfinder. It drove me crazy and I know I missed great shots. If any of the shots are decent I will post them for you.<div></div> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_kastner Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Make sure that your camera and lens are black and quiet. M6 or 7 will do the trick. 2.8/50 Elmar is great, allowing everything to be flat enough to fit into your jacket pocket. Do not be surprised if same is confiscated due to prohibition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgpinc Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Concert and club photography is pretty specialized. Fuji 800 Press film. Probably take my super quiet and cheap Elan 7 with 100 2.0 EOS lens, and/or my M3 or M6 with 90 summicron (M6 .85 if I had one) (Nikon body with 85 1.4??). Probably borrow, rent or buy the 70-200mm L IS 2.8 (heavy equip.) zoom for serious concert work. I looked at an R8 with the new 90 AA recently which may cause me to re-evaluate. http://www.photo.net/concerts/mirarchi/concer_2.htm On the street I use my M6 .72 with 28, 35 or 50 and 100 or 400 film. Different application. JMNHO, Gil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter_bongard Posted January 10, 2004 Author Share Posted January 10, 2004 What do you think on using screwmounts on an M6? I would have the opportunity to buy an Canon 135/3.5 in excellent shape, but I heard there might be some focussing-issues with the M6/0.72 RF. What do you think? -Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter_bongard Posted January 10, 2004 Author Share Posted January 10, 2004 Ah, and what about the M5? It has a spotmeter, afaik. What about its RF and its shutternoise? Perhaps a cheaper alternative to the M6? -Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albert knapp md Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 Peter: You may be right but the M7+90mm f/2 APO is silent and very effective. I have used this combo throughout Europe (where they don't care as long as there is no noise or flash) and have come away with some great photographs. When I get a scanner (I am still working on it!) I will show some of these. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liam_maloney Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 The M7 has the quietest shutter at speeds below 1/15th, because there are no whizzing gears. This may come in handy during a hushed recital or if you are in the orchestra pit. I find using a handheld meter at shows cumbersome, especially if the light is constantly changing (as it frequently does). It's also distracting to the performers. I often get weird looks when I pull my "statue of liberty" incident metering move. You'd be much better off with a built-in meter. When using my M4-P, I work around this by showing up at soundcheck and metering the stage while the lighting tech goes through the full range of lighting setups with me. During the show I adjust for each lighting change by consulting the notes written on my hand. Fast and reliable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
furcafe Posted January 12, 2004 Share Posted January 12, 2004 FWIW, I've found that an ever-ready case helps dampen shutter sounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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