sandy_sorlien Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 Howdy guys,I have only been reading this forum for three months and have just acquired my first view camera after a 20-year photography career with smaller formats. Are there any other women on this forum? The names all seem male, except the occasional Pat who is indeterminate. Arca-Swiss customer service just answered one of my posts by calling me Mister Sorlien, an odds-on bet, but wrong.Do you think LF is a male-dominated realm, and if so, why? It can't be only the weight of the equipment. Sally Mann uses an 8x10 and she is a small woman, so we can do it if we want to. I must say I feel extra vulnerable using my view camera. It attracts a lot of attention and some weirdos want to talk to me, using the camera as an excuse. If I am uncomfortable in the situation, I can't just walk away, I have to take time to pack everything up. Being under the dark cloth is an intimate viewing experience for making pictures, but I can't wait till my binocular viewer comes so I don't have to use the dark cloth. I imagine men feel a bit vulnerable under there, too; anyone could walk off with your other equipment in two seconds and you wouldn't even see them. (I think Virginia Beahan and Laura McPhee have the right idea, working as a team!) I am usually a very intrepid person, but this does concern me. Maybe the combination of large format plus computer savvy produces the large percentage of men on this site. I know men are supposed to be "tech-heads" but I am very interested in tech talk if it pertains to a problem I need to solve for imagemaking. I would be interested to hear from men or women about these issues. Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stefan_geysen1 Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 I agree about the vulnerability-when-under-a-darkloth. A couple of years ago, when I was taking a picture of a building in the centre of Antwerp, someone stole my 5° Minolta meter attachment out of my case while I was under the darkcloth. On another occasion,some drunks stood several minutes in front of my camera,shouting and chanting, thinking it was a video camera!<p> Why so few women in the forum? Maybe because being a techhead is mostly a male thing :-) Back in photo school,where the majority of my class was female, there wasn't anyone even remotely interested in using the view camera. Even a medium format camera was looked upon as a "studio only" camera...<p> Anyway, welcome aboard and happy shooting! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob_tucher Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 Hi! I've noticed also that there aren't many women, both on this forum and out in the field. It might be a question of the size of the equipment, the techi-factor, or some other things. But I have also noticed that women don't enter into smaller format photography as much either. I belonged to a Nature photography club for a while and 80% were men. Some of the women came with significant others yet did not shoot anything themselves. Why? I can't say. <p> I just did a job in which I had to photograph portals and tunnel details inside two mile-long RR tunnels. I had to walk through each twice with 75 pounds of 5x7 gear, stopping to shoot as I went. It might be the weight that would keep women from doing this kind of work, but there are other ways, like hiring a caddy. It wiped me out and I am 195 pounds, in good shape, reasonably spry (44 years old), and have been doing this kind of shooting for 20 years. It sounds like you went the lighter large format route, using Arca-Swiss 6x9. Large format is a taxing, tiring way to go if you get off the beaten path or away from studio or car, but the rewards of large format for clients and oneself are worth it. <p> As for security, we all have that vulnerable period under the cloth. My ears make up for my sight as much as possible. I also hire someone to watch my back when I am in nasty areas, if budgets allow. And, like you say, you can't just hang the camera around your neck and walk away. But some of LF lack of maneuverability is a strength. Thieves can't grab and run, and for the most part they don't even recongnize what you are using and therefore wouldn't know where to sell it for quick money. I had a carry-on bag full of large format lenses with me once when I was flying to a job. It was worth $15,000 or more, in a large Lightware case. The flight attendant would not let me keep it with me even though I only had the one bag and it fit through the gauge outside the plane. So I told her she could stow it in a compartment up near her station but that I held her responsible. At the end of the flight she was harried and just told me it was my problem but that she had it sent down to the belly of the plane. <p> I had no claim ticket for it and it was being shuttled around with no route stickers. I waited at the conveyor where luggage was coming out for an hour and a half and had already filed a lost-bag claim when it finally, and completely alone, came up. When I checked it it had obviously been rifled and everything moved, but everything was there. Obviously the potential thief who held my bag back saw no value in it and left it alone. Little did the person understand the value! <p> I've had people ask if I am a surveyor. Some people know what the stuff is but I like to work solo and without too much chit-chat. I've been threatened and challenged, but nothing has come of it. Pairing with someone is ok if you work similarly and at the same rate. I'm sure the weirdo factor is the most troubling for a woman because you would seem more at risk, but the most victimized group is males in their 20s because, for the most part, they tend to think about security the least and put themselves in worse situations out of confidence. I should know. I got tumbled pretty badly at age 23 (not shooting but out for a fun evening with friends), and I was in even better shape, looked it, and thought I could hold my own. <p> Think security, go with someone when you can (even a non-photographer who understands the slow nature of it), carry as little as you can while making sure you can do what you need to, and use friendly psychology to avoid interaction with weirdos. No real solutions here but your post intrigued me. Welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pemongillo Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 Welcome Sandy! I think the subject of women in large format has been lightly touched on in forum in the recent past, but I can't find it. I have no idea why women seem to be scarce in large format. I don't run accross many large format photographers of either sex in my wanderings. I did run across a couple (male and female) in Durbar Square in Kathmandu in October that were working together with a 4X5. I tried to strike up a conversation, but they were German and spoke no English and me no German. <p> I think we all get a little spooked if there are a lot of people around when under the dark cloth. There is so much equipment to keep track of. I have learned to keep everything in my pack when not in use or in the apron on the tripod where I can see it when under the darkcloth. I also use a large capacity waist belt to keep things in. I almost always attract a crowd in my foreign travels and if I am in a town or city here in the US someone always stops to see what I'm, doing. Most folks just don't see large format cameras very often. I have never had a problem though. <p> My gilfriend is also a B&W photographer (medium format). We work as kind of a tag team on our travels. She prefers to photograph people up close and I prefer landscapes, buildings and people set in their environment. I almost always attract a crowd so she usually has her pick of interesting individuals. <p> By the way, she is just not interested in checking out the medium format page similar to this one. She has never shown any interest in using my large format gear either. Again, welcome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilhelm Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 Not many women into Large Format because they've got better sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
linas_kudzma Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 Sandy, Late last year I saw the first woman in the field with a view camera. It was in a place called Ken Lockwood Gorge in New Jersey. I was going to stop over and saw hello, but she was busily setting up a shot so I didn't want to bother her (like everyone does me). Later she was gone. Not many females lugging around all this gear. They may indeed have more sense :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trevor_crone1 Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 Sandy, It is a great pity that there are not more women practicing the art of LF photography or indeed "photography!" I too used to feel a little vunerable under the dark cloth which is one reason I obtained a bellows focusing hood so that I'm now more aware of anyone around me. By the very nature of using LF, "funny looking" cameras, the slow deliberate act of picture making, attracts people who are curious as to what we are doing.May the light be with you,regards, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandy_sorlien Posted April 25, 2001 Author Share Posted April 25, 2001 You may notice from my other posts that I did use my superior common sense to buy a small view camera, the Arca 6x9 FC (you 8x10 snobs no doubt think this is really an MF camera, but in all functional respects it is LF --- full movements and all that). This was mainly to use rollfilm and a wider format (6x9), but the lighter weight is very appealing. I fit everything into a small Jansport backpack, the kind my students use for books! I can hike pretty far with it. It's my wooden tripod that's a pain to carry. Thanks for the belt suggestion, I'll get one for my meter etc. Maybe I should add a can of pepper spray. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_yates Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 Well on this forum Jacque Stackson occasionally contributes. She's a lady prof. and so kinda busy but she's out there with her 8 X 10. <p> As you say, there's Sally Mann, and Lois Conner and Linda Connor, Paula Chamlee...andwho else ? <p> A previous post about grumpy l.f. users encountered in the field pointed out that running into other l.f.'ers of ANY gender is kinda infrequent occurence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpshiker Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 Sandy, there are at least two women who contribute in this forum. One is Jaque Staskon (jaque@cybertrails.com) and the other is here in Switzerland: Christiane Roh (rohcris@vtx.ch). It's always nice to have other gender voices in the forum. Thanks for joining in! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpshiker Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 Sorry Jacque, I misspelled your name again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpshiker Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 By the way, Christiane use a 6x9 Arca as well. To put it right between Sean's and my post, it should spell Jacque STASKON jacque@cybertrails.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonathan brewer Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 This forum is for photographers and I don't think anything else matters. Most of the contributers of this forum are way ahead of me since I just made the move to LF and I'm a man, so the male, female thing is of no consequence. Dividing people into men and women and then applying generalizations to each group means nothing as this is a world of individuals. <p> You cannot generalize about anybody and I would ask you how you know that men are supposed to be "tech-heads"?. I don't really need an answer of course, so I saying to you throw out the why so many men, why so little women, size, ethnic backround or any other consideration except the one thing that binds us all together, our love of Photography. <p> I have insured my equipment and I mentally prepare myself for the loss of that equipment the moment I walk out the door. When I go somewhere to take pictures, I take a while gauge to the situation and believe me there have been times when there were photo-ops at a particular venue but also some danger which forced me to give up the shots rather than risk getting robbed or hurt. There might come a time when you might just have to walk away from your equipment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_bailey1 Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 Welcome Sandy-As to your question about LF and women-maybe the question should be are there more women shooting in studio and controlled situations versus how many women shooting landscapes and outdoor shots? Might be interesting to take a poll to learn the number, ages, sex and experience of those using this forum. <p> Weight has been a factor for all of us, as is the bulk of the equipment and time required to set up a photograph, not to mention the expense. Yet, the results are what keep drawing us back. Each photo teaches me so much that I want to then apply to the next image I take-a nice compulsion if you ask me!!! <p> As for safety-please always be aware of your surroundings. I am certain you are savvy, bright and aware, but sometimes a reminder of what to remember is helpful (and I need to remember these things myself just as much as anyone else does). Being safe is just as necessary even if you are walking alone in the wilderness to get to a wonderful location-pay attention to the trail and your footing so you don't fall and injure yourself, make certain others know where you are headed and when you are supposed to return, be cautious in bad weather (especially lightening storms) and take the rudiments of first aid and water just in case. In urban situations many of the same precautions hold true. As for crowds and/or wierdos, I often fake shooting with another camera which allows them their moment of performance and soon they tire. The binocular viewers are a sound alternative to a dark cloth. Just keep your bags zipped and intertwine the straps or wrap them around a tripod leg or maybe use a bunge cord to slow anyone down who covets your equipment more than you. If you can take a companion along, all the better. For me, sometimes taking a moment to let someone look through the camera creates new friends and allies who look out for you afterwards. But most of all whether you are in a city or in a wilderness, if that little voice goes off and says something isn't right then pack up and come back the next day or the next time or sometimes never-tomorrow for me is always a better solution. <p> Regards, <p> John Bailey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve_baggett Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 Sandy, all the LF men are on this forum discussing equipment and all the LF women are in the field taking pictures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob_salomon1 Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 And Mary Ellen Mark uses a Master Technika. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_henderson1 Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 And I thought all those women who asked about my camera were interested in PHOTOGRAPHY! You mean they were HITTING on me?!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian_ellis3 Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 I teach a Beginning Photo class in the Fine Arts department of a local university. I'm one of three instructors. The class sizes are usually 10 - 15. Almost always, there will be one, maybe two at the most, males in each of the three classes, the rest are females. Yet everywhere else, the ratio seems to be almost the reverse. I have no idea why that is. In the case of large format, I suspect the reason for relatively smaller female participation is the tech-oriented nature of it. Men sometimes seem more interested in the equipment, women in the photographs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ellis_vener_photography Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 Sandy, I'm 6'5" and 270 (not real soft) pounds and I carry myself in such a way as to let people I'm not an easy mark. And still I worry about who is coming up behind me when I'm under the darkcloth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david_munson Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 In relation to Brian's comment, I see it too. I'm in a photography program at Ohio University and in both the fine art photography and photo illustration majors, women outnumber men by a good margin. In my current illustration class, there are about 30 people, and of those people, I am one of 3 males in the class. The ratio is a little closer to being even in the photojournalism sequence, but it still seems to be weighted on the female side. That being the way it is, it does make me question why it seems there are so many more male photographers out there working professionally than female photographers. Assuming this trend in photo education continues, it will be interesting to see what the field looks like in 20 years' time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qtluong Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 Participants of this forum, besides being LF photographers:(a) are often heavy computer users,(b) are mostly nature/landscape photographers (if the poll isaccurate),© like nut-and-bolts discussions (I wish there was morevariety, btw who is going to contribute the next trip report ?). This is the intersection of several traditionally male-dominatedcategories, so the result is no surprise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilhelm2 Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 Mustn't forget one of the little giants in contemporary LF photography. Marie Cosnidas with her ancient Linhof Technika and tripod, a Polaroid back, and all those little colored gel filters which she Scotch tapes in front of her one and only lens. Better pictures with this simple equipment than all but a handful of other great photographers. A class act, all the way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david_goldfarb Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 Welcome, Sandy. <p> I carry my ultralight 8x10" Gowland PocketView in a knapsack much like yours, designed for laptop computers with padded compartments, so it's not impossible to move up in format and stay fairly compact. <p> I've had one disturbing incident under the darkcloth in Finland (which otherwise seems as safe a country as there is on the planet) when I was photographing an old textile mill and was approached by an older gentleman in worker's coveralls, clearly drunk. He tapped me on the shoulder and started speaking anxiously in Finnish and waving his finger. I had no idea what he was talking about, but tried to express the fact that I hoped I wasn't doing anything that might be taken as disrespectful, but it seemed that we didn't have any language in common. This didn't stop him. As he went on he started pointing across the street, where there was another old mill, converted into a theater, and there was some sort of youth festival going on outside of it. He began miming the action of shooting a rifle--pchh! pchh! pchh!--perhaps indicating his displeasure with regard to the festival, or maybe recounting a hostile company response to some labor action long ago. I never did figure it out. Eventually I motioned to ask whether he wanted to look at the groundglass, which people often do, and he did, and made some motions with his finger, perhaps offering a compositional suggestion. And I said "Kiitos," my one word in Finnish, which means "Thank you," and shook his hand, and he went on his way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlabrosse Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 I find this male/female issue an interesting topic as recently I've wondered if there is a difference between the photographic "vision" of men vs. women. I gave my theory a little test by looking through the galleries on photo.net and I can't say that I see any differences. After some very light and unscientific research I agree with the above poster that in photography there are only individuals and that the gender issue is irrevelant. <p> For what it's worth, my photography school program is split more towards men - especailly in the more techincal courses (Zone System, Photog for post production, etc). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cesar_barreto Posted April 26, 2001 Share Posted April 26, 2001 Sandy, Being quite a feminist myself, I welcome you with red carpet and flowers. Maybe, if more women were playing around, these pages wouldn't be so full of techniques and "how-to". As about equipment and the weight issue, I found a good solution: humiliating myself. I've just started using a Kodak 2-D 5x7, similar and smaller than Berenice Abott's favorite 8x10. I just can't say the camera is heavy as hell! To make things easier I'm following Adams advice, who said that the more lenses you have the more are the chances you pick the wrong one. So, as the camera grows, the more objective one should be. By the way: I also have a 6x9 Arca, old model, and it works a lot for me. But I still feel more confortable taking a flat-bed 4x5 out for walking and trekking. The big negative deserves and provides some solemnity that translates better my feelings for nature. And I don't think that's a male question! Anyway, welcome again, and I hope you enjoy this "macho" way of shooting. <p> Cesar B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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