Windows 10, Anyone?

Discussion in 'Casual Photo Conversations' started by lightontheland, Aug 15, 2015.

  1. Maybe it's old age, but I'm finding Windows 10 to be very user unfriendly, almost incomprehensible. Am I the only one having problems with it?
    I started years ago with Windows 6, and the iterations that followed made transitions to later versions painless. I'd hate to see Adobe do the same thing to Photoshop that Microsoft did with Windows 10...
     
  2. I'd like to try Win10 on my laptop since I mostly use it only for web browsing. But the auto-download/install seems permanently stalled, and I'm seeing a lot of bug reports and privacy concerns. I don't have the time or patience to jump through hoops to make it work. So I'll wait and see.
    I'm still pretty satisfied with Win7 and don't feel any real need to change. Windows 7 has been the most stable and trouble free version I've tried, pretty much handles everything with very little intervention or maintenance. And all my old software dating back to Windows 95 still works, no problems.
     
  3. No problems here, really. Bit of a learning curve, but not that difficult. And it's fast.
     
  4. Upgraded two laptops from Win7 with zero problems. Edge is not a bad browser actually. I'm still exploring what Win10 shares with Microsoft though. A lot of it will come from your use of Cortana, which is like Apple's Siri or Google Now. It's not bad though. Both machines are running more smoothly now than they did with Win7.
     
  5. The learning curve for me has been that they moved a few things around, so it sometimes takes a little googling to figure out how to modify things like menu fonts, for example, which I prefer to have bold. Took a lot of digging to find that.

    Takes a few days to get all that stuff down, learn what's customizable (like how to make the start menu work for you, get rid of a few useless tablet/phone apps.) Edge is okay, but needs a lot of plugins to make me stop using Firefox.

    Otherwise, it's pretty much the same thing in a slightly different package. Also seems to have cured a few small Windows 7 bugs that I used to deal with. Hasn't crashed once in about two weeks. Every program from the old installation works fine, including Office 2003.

    If you have 7 and like it, there's not much need to change. I upgraded from 7, and am enjoying tinkering around in there, but I still have a little of the 'computer hobbyist' in me.
    If you're on Windows 8/8.1, you might want to make the move. 10 is much better than 8/8.1, in my opinion.
     
  6. I'm using Windows 7 Professional. I managed to get it just as Windows 8 was appearing (and I didn't like the look of that). Windows 7 does everything I want - and a huge amount for which I have no use and even less interest - so I don't aim to change. What irritates me is how MS keep changing things - why can't they just leave it alone?
     
  7. so I don't aim to change. What irritates me is how MS keep changing things - why can't they just leave it alone?
    They want to keep making money so they make changes and push people to upgrade. Windows 7 is good but it won't be supported forever, I would expect that 2-3 years from support will have ended and it will be deemed unsafe to use and at some point ISPs will hold you liable for damage (because someone will use the vulnerability of your computer to attack others). I would prefer they would make a simpler system which is not full of holes to begin with. But I suppose things are moving towards greater complexity instead of the other way around.
    As a user I absolutely agree with you and would prefer the OS to change very little and very slowly, because that way existing applications can continue to be used and there is less hassle. But Microsoft probably sees things differently and think that things need to be in constant motion.
     
  8. I tried 10 and didn't like it at all; I'm always open to change - but I find windows 7 much better for me; things are more seamless and better organized. Fortunately, 7 wasn't deleted and you have a month to recover it, and was sooo happy to get it back!! {tech: took my computer 1 hour to download; 3 minutes to recover windows 7 - FWIW}.
     
  9. Personally, I do not find Windows 10 miles better than Windows 8.1; I'm not a big fan of Windows 7 (and never was), I found it a lukewarm makeover of Windows Vista that added little value. Windows 10 follows that trend a bit. But, it is fast, and it does remove some really jarring things from 8.1.
    There are a lot of settings for personalisation and making it work the way you want, but quite some of those somewhat hidden. It takes a bit of time, but you can make Win10 work the way you like. So rather than running back to old versions that will be out of support sooner or later, invest some time to configure it to your wishes, and try it for a week or two. Most people I hear and read about going back to Windows 7 gave the new version less than 3 days, which is a bit too little, in my view. As you have a month to revert, that should give you a fair and honest idea. Dont rush to conclusions based on first appearances.
    As for the rate of change: it's a chicken/egg problem. The market moved more to mobile/apps, and everybody cried how Microsoft was too late to respond and should get serious about tablets etc.. Then they launched a new version that was mobile-first, and everybody cried how they alienated their core customers and how now everything was wrong (and make no mistake: Windows 8 on a tablet is a very good experience). So, now they've tried to hit middle ground, and people still complain. So..... damned if they do, damned if they don't. They're not in a market where you can sit still, and frankly I prefer them trying to find new things. Else we'd all be still stuck on Windows XP, and thank god we're not.
     
  10. I've upgraded seven computers, four of my own. The upgrade can take one to two hours depending on how fast your computer is and how fast your internet connection is. I am quite pleased with Windows 10. It gives the best of both worlds mouse and or touch screen for computers or tablets. You can use it like Windows 7 if you please, make use of the live tiles or both. I understand the desire to quit changing Windows but they have to evolve if they want to remain relevant.

    I find Cortana to be a life saver helping me to remember things. I look forward to Windows 10 mobile when Cortana will work seamlessly across computer to phone. Once a skeptic I look forward to the day I can converse with my computer. Love the new browser, Edge, too.

    Lex it is possible to do a straight download of Windows 10 instead of waiting on it. It's possible your computer lacks a certain update to move forward.

    It's unlikely Microsoft will make any major changes to the interface for a number of years now. For the common user Windows 8 really tipped the boat. Microsoft had to find some common ground in Windows 10 and do it quickly thus the relatively short time between 8 and 10. It think it is a good thing. No need to upgrade right away but you'll want to do it within the year while it is still free.
     
  11. I reserved my copy but haven't heard anything yet. If I got the upgrade I would try to clean install on a new hard drive.
     
  12. On Windows 7 Pro 64-bit at the moment - on a computer that is some 6 years old. Made the mistake to spend time and resources on updating two XP laptops to Windows 7 earlier this year (when XP support ran out) - both functioned after the "upgrade". The newer of the two became quite sluggish over time and eventually crashed fatally. The other is "working" - but its obvious that its overburdened with running the OS alone already. So I won't be making the mistake of upgrading my current computer to Windows 10 - I rather wait until Windows 7 support is dropped and build a new computer then (if not earlier). Quite similar to not updating my iphone 4S to an OS that it could barely handle - and buying a new iphone 6+ instead. What good does an "upgrade" do if it has the potential to brick (or at least slow down) your computer?

    Still debating whether or not to update a newly acquired laptop to Windows 10 - reading about all those privacy issues gives me pause.
     
  13. I haven't found a compelling reason to upgrade beyond Windows 7 but, equally, I'm happy with 8.1 and with what I've seen of 10 (tested in a VM) provided that Classic Shell is installed to reverse some of MS's sillier decisions:
    http://www.classicshell.net/
    Windows 7 has 'extended support' (security fixes) until early 2020, and Windows 10 until 2025, so it might be worth taking advantage of the 'free' upgrade period if you're likely to keep your system for another 5 years.
     
  14. A couple of points:
    The primary purpose of Windows 10 is to get Windows users onto Microsoft's newest OS and, once there, there will be seamless updating, so users will stay on the latest. It is strategically important for any platform company to have this. Windows 8 didn't do it, as most users stayed on Windows 7. It's likely that Windows 10 will do it. In other words, Windows 10's purpose wasn't tactical, it was strategic.
    Someone above said that Microsoft released Windows 10 just to make some money. This certainly isn't true for the non-enterprise accounts (including personal users), since the upgrade is free.
     
  15. If I got the upgrade I would try to clean install on a new hard drive.​
    BeBu, I'm not sure that would work. Windows made several updates to Windows 7 to prepare it for the transition to Windows 10. As an upgrade, Windows 10 will need to have Windows 7 installed for it to work. If you're talking about moving a post-preparation Windows 7 copy to a new hard drive before installing Windows 10, that should work.....probably. ;-)
     
  16. A clean install is only possible after upgrading directly from 7/8/8.1.
    Once that upgrade is done, you can start over from scratch on the same computer.
    I believe the licence is then tied to the motherboard, not the hard drive, but check with the upgrade information online before trying that.

    I went the route of downloading the full upgrade iso for 32 and 64 bit systems, creating a bootable disk on a usb drive, and double clicking an exe file on the upgrade disk. The same upgrade usb worked for both our 32 bit and 64 bit machines. The 32/64 bit iso won't fit on a dvd, so if you have to use a dvd you will need to download either the 32 or 64 bit iso.

    Prepping took hours to download and then copy to the usb, but the actual upgrade was less than 2 hours.
     
  17. Well, I wimped out. Back to Windows 7, and life is good... ;-)
     
  18. "Someone above said that Microsoft released Windows 10 just to make some money. This certainly isn't true for the non-enterprise accounts (including personal users), since the upgrade is free."

    Ah, but nothing is free. Microsoft is switching to Facebook and similar companies' business model: harvest and monetize personal data. There are numerous default settings that let MS know things like where you surf to, what your passwords and usernames are, what you buy, what you are doing when, whom you talk to, where you are, what you write.
    That, not a technical upgrade, is the reason for windows 10, and why it is free. There is more value in that than in selling OS installs.

    Apart from that, Windows 10 is a decent OS.
    With limitations. Small ones, such as not being able to see what window is active because there is no colour coding of the title bar. And big ones, such as not being able to support a lot of hardware, yet (!).

    A clean install will get rid of a lot of the stuff that made its way onto your computer but isn't really used. But it will also get rid of a lot of stuff that is on your computer that you do use and need to install again. I found the Windows 10 upgrade smooth, and it did not take too long. Some small problems with software and hardware. Annoying but they could be resolved.
    Yet i will not be upgrading other computers soon. Windows 10 does not offer any obvious advantage. And if i would upgrade anyway, it's better to wait a while for the initial incompatibility problems to be solved.
     
  19. Well said, Q.G. Now, does anyone know how to get rid of that annoying Windows 10 icon in my Windows 7 taskbar?
     
  20. William you can right-click on the Start button, left click on the Task Bar tab, then click on Customize. Locate the icon then click the drop-down and select Hide icon and notifications. Click Okay a couple times to get out of that.

    That's probably the easiest solution. It's possible to completely remove it but it will attempt to reinstalled itself as you are doing normal updates for Windows 7. Good luck!
     
  21. In a perfect world, the operating system should be invisible. I only really care about the programs that I use that operate on top of the operating system like Photoshop, Photo Mechanic, Office Suit, and numerous other programs that unfortunately rely on their shared code with the Windows operating system. I'm in my mid 60's and I really get a little miffed at having to learn another operating system. What a waste of time, remaining mental resources, and extremely inefficient.
     
  22. Absolutely right, Michael. It's really annoying how much of our time is used up dealing with computers and their needs instead of using computers for what we got them, for our needs.
     
  23. Constantly changing and "improving" is a matter of survival. Once an operating system has saturated the market the alternative to "upgrading" would be a mass layoff. Wasn't it Mark Twain that said: "One musn't confuse movement with progress"?
     
  24. Sometimes, though, things do not need improving any further. A fork is a fork. A Sinar P (to keep this casually photo related) is a Sinar P. There's always room for change, but when a thing does what it is supposed to do... "One mustn't confuse movement with progress" indeed. Well quoted.<br>I don't see any improvement (yet?) in what Windows 10 has to offer. I do see a change to another business model. Not necessarily a move that could keep that mass layoff at bay.
     
  25. Windows 7 was a perfectly good platform. Windows 10 was a response to the large dissatisfaction with windows 8. Like
    issues about the start window. Windows 10 is basically free so the are not making that much money on it and it did not
    use that much personal that it would have any impact on layoffs. MS does intend at this point to keep windows 10 around
    for a long time and just keep updating it. One good thing I can say is that I got some mal ware downloading a photo editor
    and windows 10 has completely suppressed it. It also made it possible to track it down and remove it completely remove.
     
  26. In my curmudgeonly way, every new edition of Windows seems like a more bloated version of the previous one, bringing more features that I don't need but working at the same speed if not more slowly. If Microsoft would continue support, I'd use Windows XP forever and enjoy the fast boot (better than the 3 to 4 minutes I seem to get with my present computers (2 with Windows 8, 2 with Windows 7, 1 with Vista, 1 with Windows XP, just because it is so well built it will not die!). I'd also be spared the joys of the game of "Find the driver!" for my elderly Epson 1680 flatbed scanner and I'd be able to use Photoshop 5.0 forever instead of buying all those extra imaging packages, ranging from Creative Suite 5.5 to Elements (3x) - or instead I could use the Photoshop LE that came free with a printer about 15 years ago and does everything I need!
     
  27. As an IT engineer, all the above comments make me smile...meaning me and my fellow tradesmen still have our work cut out for about another 200 years or so, helping the-blind-leading-the-blind.
    Most of this thread is based on misconceptions and poor operating practices by people too lazy or ignorant to use any product properly and what it's meant for. Sorry for being harsh, but the proof is in the pudding/writing.
    Having problems with any version of Windows? Ask me anything. Including outright disinformation such as "can't make drivers work/missing hardware support" and other user operational mismanagement issues.
    Oh and BTW, Windows 10 is OK. 3 times faster than Win 7, double faster than Win 8 or 8.1, 100 times more capable than XP and 1000 times better than Vista. It is not, however, without its quirks. Privacy is a real concern, as noted, but Microsoft has issued "patches" for Win7, 8 and 8.1 this week which add the same data gathering to those versions. And there is no opt-out, as there is (for some of it) in Win 10. Microsoft is just catching up with what Google has been doing for years and Apple since the iPhone - in the dark, so to speak. And personally, I liked Win 8.1 Start screen the best. Fast, search built in (just start typing directly, no need to click on anything, search programs by date installed - all gone in Win 10), but alas, we can only move forward not back.
    XP users might as well keep driving their Chevy Corvairs as well.
     
  28. Ingemar, why should I have to learn anything about windows? It should just work in the background. However, I should have to learn how to use Photoshop, Photo Mechanic, and about 20 other application programs that I use on a regular basis. (The more intuitive they are, the better.) I don't have to learn how the engine in my car works in order to drive it, but I do have to learn how to follow directions to get to where I want to go. My objective for using a computer is not to learn how to use a computer but to post-process images and post them to my web site. Everything else is just a waste of my mental resources, which are getting older and less tolerant. (humor but true)
     
  29. Oh and BTW, Windows 10 is OK. 3 times faster than Win 7, double faster than Win 8 or 8.1, 100 times more capable than XP and 1000 times better than Vista.​
    And 17 times more fictional statistics!
     
  30. Ingemar, sadly your posting shows how little IT "experts" understand the concerns of users. From my point of view, my pet hates are:
    1) Computers in general take a long time to boot up - this is great fun when a client phones me during a break and I have to switch on my computer to answer his questions. My first PC, an Amstrad/Schneider 1640, is long dead, but I swear it booted up faster! In terms of bit crunching per second, I am sure that new versions of Windows are much faster, but NOT from the point of view of practical users!
    2) Microsoft assumes users are morons and, if given any option to delay the installation of updates, will not do so. This on occasion leaves me on the phone for even longer than in case 1) above waiting to give clients info while Windows installs and configures updates with no option of interruption or postponement.
    3) MS WORD, the market leader, is brought to its knees by documents with above around 60 to 70 pages and lots of graphics. I installed 16 GB of RAM on my main computer (HP Probook) to combat this, it still teeters on the edge from time to with quite a few seconds of "Not responding" when saving an edit.
    4) I run my main computer for about 50 hours a week. I really cannot understand why hard disks do not last longer than 18 months. Fortunately I back everything up and have got quite good at predicting HDD failure in advance.
    Ingemar, I presume you have a salaried position. For independent creatives like myself, serving customers who have a choice as to whom they deal with, calling customers lazy, ignorant and blind is the fastest way I know to bankruptcy and starvation. I have for many years succeeded in solving 99.9% of my IT problems myself - if I needed outside help, pardon me, but you'd be the very last person I'd call!
     
  31. Accusing Microsoft of assuming users are idiots is the same mistake that you accuse MS of. All the complaints you have existed from the first day of PC's
    Those just are not fictional statistics.
    Most of the complaints I see are a result of not learning what you need to know for the tasking you want to do and there is plenty of help. Most of us are fairly tech savvy but a lot seem to feel insecure unless they can find something to criticize or are like the army sergeant in Korea who declared he will be damned before he looks anything up in the GD manual.
    The again, the obvious answer is if you really do not like it, it was not meant you and stay with Windows 7 or 8. Nothing wrong with that if it works for you.
     
  32. a lot seem to feel insecure unless they can find something to criticize
    Not me Donald - I have been quite specific in saying that, for professional use, my main desiderata are fast boot-up, reliability (i.e. freedom from crashes) and ideally an end to ever-more-bloated software that eats up RAM without delivering performance. The successive versions of Windows seem to be first and foremost aimed at earning money for Microsoft, sometimes in a very juvenile way. For example, WORD for DOS had a simple calculator function which could add up columns of figures - this was dropped, presumably to make people buy Excel. With WORD for DOS, you could type in word/l at the C prompt and go straight back to the document you had been working on. Small details, but they saved time.
     
  33. At the same time, if you plan going back to the same does cement during the day,you just minimalize it and click on the
    tool bar. You do not have to type in anything at the prompt. If you want to acces it over a longer period of time just save it
    to desk top and click the icon. If you have a few documents (or photos whatever ) that you want quick acces to, not just
    the last one type the first few letters of the document name and click on it. I am not saying you are wrong but to me I do
    not see any real inconvenience and provides more capabilities. For myself I do see progress generally from one version
    to the other. I like how it totally suppressed some malware on my system.

    As for making money, don't we all. No money no Microsoft no new cameras or equipment, no cars no anything. A little
    greed leads to progress and I would rather it be here then some other place. Well England, Germany, Australia etc would
    be okay too.
     
  34. rowlett

    rowlett Moderator

    One Microsoft technician giving a talk at an IT conference I attended said about Windows Vista (this when Microsoft was first rolling out Windows 7): "Vista has been our most productive operating system yet; once you turn it on, you can go do something else and get a lot of work done!"
     

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