Which Pocket Camera for the Leica M Photographers?

Discussion in 'Leica and Rangefinders' started by kl_prager|1, Jul 22, 2001.

  1. I'm wondering what pocket cameras other Leica M photographers are using. I recently took a family vacation and brought along my wife's Olympus Stylus together with my Leica M gear. I ended up using the Olympus more than I expected and found that it came in really handy. My favorite photos (of my family at the beach) were actually taken with the Olypmus, although the quality doesn't even come close to that of my Leica M w/ 35 'cron.

    <p>

    Now I'm thinking of getting another pocket camera, but with a better quality lens than we have on our Olympus Stylus. The Contax T3 is a viable choice, based on lens quality alone. The Yashica T4 is another option. I've also heard that the lens on the Olympus Stylus Epic has 2 aspherical elements, but don't know if its lens is any better than with the previous model Stylus we already have. I'm not anxious to have a zoom model, as I prefer the smaller size of non-zoom cameras.

    <p>

    So, I'm looking forward to hearing comments from other Leica M photographers about which pocket cameras you are using and can recommend, as well cameras you don't recommend due to problems.
    Thanks in advance.
     
  2. Here's an excerpt from Erwins Put's Newsletter. I hope he doesn't
    mind....

    <p>

    "I bought myself a new Minilux 2.4/40mm. First results show incredible
    performance even at full aperture."

    <p>

    We also have a Minilux and like not only it's lens but it's
    relatively powerful flash, pre-focus, control, accurate focusing and
    exposure. The only thing wrong with this camera is that it's heavy
    for a P&S.
     
  3. Wow Ken, I can't help you here, because my M with the tri-elmar IS my
    pocket camera ;-)
     
  4. Wow Ken, I can't help you here because my M with the tri-elmar IS my
    pocket camera ;-)
     
  5. For me, same as Jack - I have the M4-2/35mm over my shoulder, a 90 TE
    in one POCKET, and 2 rolls of film in the other POCKET. Pocket
    camera!!
     
  6. Or - the advertising slogan they never used in the '60's (and can't,
    now)

    <p>

    Leitz, camera, action!
     
  7. My pocket camera (until the shutter jammed--CLA time) was a Kodak
    Retina IIIc. With the 50/f2 Schneider Xenon, it folds into a small,
    slim enough package to easily fit in a jacket pocket. Built-in meter,
    great little lens, nicely constructed, good looking, fairly cheap to
    replace--the only disadvantage is the weight.
     
  8. KL Prager,

    <p>

    My M6 fits in my winter pockets, but not my summer ones. I suppose a
    CL with 40mm would be a good answer if a non-Leica is unthinkable.
    But since you mentioned the Olympus Stylus, I'll tell you this much.
    My fiancee has one. She brought it on a canoe ride we took last
    summer. Neither one of us knew a wole lot about canoeing. Well, she
    said she did. Needless to say, we capsized on a submerged tree. The
    Olympus went into the drink, floating in a non-waterproof cloth bag.
    When we got ashore, she took the film out (soaked) and pitched it. I
    drained the camera, holding it at various angles. We dried it in the
    sun a few minutes. When we got home, the next day, I did some more
    draining. I noted the lens and viewfinder were filled with droplets
    and mist. It didn't look pretty. The next day I took it to a camera
    repair place. They said it would cost more to fix it than to buy a
    new one. The flash arm was hanging out like the tongue of a dead
    dog. So I took it home and sealed it in a ziplock bag along with
    four of those little dessicant silica gel packs that say "do not eat
    this" on them. Then I forgot about it. For a year.

    <p>

    Tomorrow she is going on a business trip and wanted to take a
    camera. I opened the ziplock bag and popped in a new battery. The
    Stylus made a series of promising clicks and whirs. The flash arm
    snapped back into closed position. I blew out the interior with
    compressed air and loaded a film. It wound it. I shot a couple
    pictures. It worked, flash, zoom lens drive, and all.

    <p>

    So she's taking it along. I'll let you know how the pictures turn
    out. So far, I'm impressed.

    <p>

    Regards,
     
  9. The T3 is an exceptionally compact high quality camera cabable of
    images as good as the best 35mm cameras made. The only thing I can
    fault mine about is that because of its fairly high cost ($699), you
    want to be careful how you treat it. I would often toss the Yashica
    T4 in the side pocket of the car, or inside a jacket pocket without
    its case. With the T3, because it is such a precision made camera, I
    am more careful how I handle it, and in one way that takes away from
    part of the fun of shooting with a P&S. That said, I wouldn't trade
    mine for any compact camera ever made. You can not believe how good
    that lens is,even wide open, and the high shutter speeds, super close
    focusing (13 inches) and easy user over-rides make the camera very
    capable under many situaions that other P&S are useless. Only P&S I
    have ever used that does not have a vignetting problem at any speed
    or F stop. Great low light camera. Fast response on the AF, great
    finder, very quiet, and about 2/3 the size and weight of the Minilux.
     
  10. Buy a Minox TLX - the quality is increadible and it is more handy than
    any of the so-called pocket cameras. Minox is even owned (still?) by
    Leica.
     
  11. CONTAX T2 Great little camera , better than every thing pre T3.
    I have not used on of these yet. What i liked about the T2 was
    that it had a fast lens[the reason the zoom cameras don't work
    for me] and the flash doesn't overpower the ambient light.
     
  12. I'd go for the Yashica T4 with its Carl Zeiss T* 35mm f/3.5 lens.
    The Yashica's $169 price is much better value than the Contax T3 at
    $699. I would be less nervous about handing over the Yashica to a
    stranger to take family snap shots for me when on vacation, compared
    to a Contax or Minilux. I also don't have to worry too much about
    the Yashica's 35mm focal length making me look fatter than I already
    am in my family photos--especially when I am asking a stranger to
    compose for me. I would avoid any compact with a wider lens than
    35mm. Strangers, and myself, almost never bother with the zoom
    function so I'd avoid that. I also wouldn't get much use out of the
    T3's aperature priority, manual focusing, or even the f/2.8 etc.
    Sometimes I just want a high quality point and shoot camera to
    supplement my M when traveling. I'd only go for the T3 if it was
    half price though. The Yashica T4 is really good value. My 2
    pennies.
     
  13. At different times, I've used the following "pocket[able]" cameras:
    Minox GT; Minox ML; Rollei 35SE (although a little heavy, still one
    of my all-time favorites); Olympus XA; Contax T* (the original; 3
    weeks after I bought it I dropped it into the Aegean while on
    vacation); Olympus Stylus; Olympus Epic (my current Leica M6
    companion). As soon as I can find it, the new, all-black Contax T3
    (anyone got any leads??).

    <p>

    For the money, the Epic is one helluva pocket point-n-shoot. The only
    thing I'm not crazy about is its dependence on batteries and the
    shutter lag time. When I take the Rollei SE along with me, I use it
    pretty much set on hyperfocal distance and fire away. The compromise
    40mm lens is amazingly sharp and the in-the-viewfinder LED light
    meter is a bonus, too. I use the Minox the same way. I equip both the
    Rollei and the Minox with lens hoods and either yellow, orange, or
    red (Heliopan) filters on sunny days--just the lenshades without
    filters on others. Except for the Epic which I load 50% of the time
    with color negative film, I always shoot Tri-X (@ EI 200) in the
    others (I don't think I've ever shot any color in any of the other
    cameras). When I shoot Tri-X in the Epic I override the DX Coding so
    that the EI is also 200. I have all my film processed commercially at
    a lab that's been doing custom processing for me for over 15 years.
    The results I get are exceptionally consistent since the lab follows
    my preferences for developers and development times when I request
    something other than D-76 1:1 with a dash of Benzotriazole. The
    negatives sizzle.
     
  14. I have to second Jack and others above. My M6 (TTL+2/35ASPH or 2/50) is also my pocket camera, and that's why I bought it. It even fits in a light jacket pocket e.g. when I'm at the Philharmonie here, where photography is absolutely forbidden.
     
  15. If you want the ultimate pocket camera, then the best choice is MINOX CLX
    It has a super sharp lens, shutter from 8 sec to 1/2000, focus range from 8 inch to infinity, with parallax corrected viewfinder, built in UV filter, ND filter and lens hood, weight only 5 oz.
    A good choice for pocket 35mm is Minox GT-E, very sharp Leitz designed Minoxar multicoated 35mm/2.8 lens, shutter from 1/500 to 20 minutes or longer, great for night shots. Much quieter than Leica M. 7 oz only
     
  16. My pocket camera is my IIIg with collapsible 50 Elmar. But, my
    glovebox camera is a Konica Big Mini. Not the zoom, but the older
    one with a 35 F2.8. Though I tend to carry the Leica whenever I 'go'
    anywhere, I often fail to do so when popping over to the local store
    or some such thing. A few days ago I went to get some bread first
    thing in the morning at our local bakery. They have a couple of
    small tables set up where you can order fresh buns and an espresso.
    A man and woman, both older than dirt, he in an ancient black suit.
    Perfect Leica...ur Konica moment. At 8X10 (B&W) it looks 'Leica' to
    me.
     
  17. I was using an Olympus XA, which was a clam shell type camera with
    plenty of controls, aperture priority, manual focus via a
    rangefinder, and manual ISO (ASA back then) which allows you to fool
    the meter for good slides in tricky light. This camera died and was
    no longer available, so I bought a Minox ML (in 1986), which is still
    going strong.

    <p>

    It is the size of a pack of cigarettes, allows manual aperture and
    ISO settings, uses scale focusing via traditional depth of field
    markings. The lens is at least as good as a Summaron, aperture for
    aperture, very sharp and plenty of contrast. It is in my pocket even
    when my Leica isn't, and at the end of a trip, the Minox is
    responsible for many of my successful shots.
     
  18. The Leica CL is worthy of consideration - although you need a largish
    pocket. The trouble with most pocket cameras is they
    involve a compromise: usually you have to give up some capability such
    as cable release, parallax compensation, long shutter speeds - nice
    viewfinder. The good thing about the CL is that you give up nothing
    with it. In terms of pleasure though the best pocket camera I found
    was a Minox GT-E - very light and fun to use and suitably controllable
    to produce good results. But I found mine tended to scratch the film
    so I give it up - maybe this trait has been fixed. Also of course
    guess focus is not so good if you are used to Leica sharpness. The
    Rollei 35 is nice, but a 40mm lens is even harder to guess focus than
    a 35mm.

    <p>

    I gave up on the Contax T2 when the lens jammed in one time and it
    made a horrible whirring noise. There were also metering quirks. Maybe
    the T3 is better?

    <p>

    I am a slide shooter so the exposure system needs to be good and at
    least controllable, so most point and shoots (T4, Epic, Stylus etc.)
    are out.
     
  19. My pocket camera is Canon G1 digital camera. The shutter lag
    is 'forever' if I don't do it in two steps. It is good companion to
    my Leica M6+50 'cron. Often just carry these two for a day shots. I
    also like Olympus Stylus Epic. It has very good design, lens. I
    think it is best value for the money.
     
  20. To answer your question, yes the Olympus Infinity Stylus Epic f:2.8
    lens is much, much better than the previous model. Try it, you'll
    like it.
     
  21. I figure if you're not going to bring the relatively compact M with a lens or two, you'd better be getting a lot in convenience and portability in a P&S, which is why I have been long intrigued by the Ricoh GR-1s. It's super small, almost slimmer than a roll of film, Mg body, sports a 28/2.8 (?), that, recently, I read is a Leica lens. It captures focus first, has manual override, etc.
    Does anyone know about this camera and its connection with Leica optics?
    I have the Yash T4, which is a fine camera for the money. It's the camera I'd take rock climbing or sea kayaking, but for back country camping I was willing to schlept around my SLR and 2 lenses.
    BTW, here's one eb*y ad for the GR-1s
    while
    this ad seems to claim a Leica lens.
    Finally, some info from Ricoh UK.
     
  22. The GR1 has a "Leica quality lens" according to those users and
    sellers who like it. Personally, I am sceptical, but it is probably
    pretty good. Still, no connection with Leica Camera GMBH.
     
  23. My "car" camera is an original Leica Mini. Purchased it about 5
    years ago from a store that was closing it out. I probably only put
    a roll through it a year, but my wife loves using it. The photos
    turn out surprisingly good with the right film. I've discovered that
    camera prefers Kodak Gold 200 (which also happens to be one of my
    favorite films for my M4P.
     
  24. My wife has a Pentax UC-1 in her purse. It's a really nice little
    clamshell p&s, but I think it's discontinued. My pocket camera is a
    llf with an elmar 50/3.5, fairly light and really flat. Of course, my
    tight jeans days are over.
     
  25. I am totally frustrated with P&S cameras that have no manual
    controls. My pocket camera is a Rollei 35S. It is also the camera I
    stash in my luggage (when I'm carrying 35mm gear) in case some
    disaster befalls my main system. The 40mm lens is a good compromise
    between wide and standard, and it's built like a tank. Aperture
    settable in 1/2 stops from 2.8-22, shutter 1-1/500 with X sync at all
    speeds. There is no rangefinder but I have a Leitz rangefinder that
    fits in the flash shoe, if I think I'll need to shoot wider than 5.6.
     
  26. I use the Ricoh GR1. Sharp, fastish lens, contrasty, small. Only
    drawbacks are price ($400), a badly designed on/off button, and a
    weak flash (which doesn't bother me much since I regularly keep 400
    film in it). No matter what that E-bay listing is trying to claim,
    the GR1 doesn't have a Leica lens. Although Ricoh did make the Gr1
    lens in a LTM mount for some ammount of time.

    <p>

    If I was going to buy another one, I'd probably go for the T4 though.
    At $150 you can worry a lot less about what happens to it. Although
    the Canon G1 digital option is very tempting, though it's on the big
    side of pocketable. I would stay away from the psuedo-manual pocket
    cameras. Because in my mind, a pocket camera is for the times you
    don't have the time/need/want to have to think too much about
    shooting. That's why they are called "point and shoot".
     
  27. I'm continually amazed at the quality of the Olympus Stylus Epic. My film & processing bill is a much higher price than the $89.00 that this camera costs. Go here to see a grab shot I made with it in Paris, using Agfa Scala film. It loses some in the scanning...the slide is amazingly sharp.
     
  28. Sorry...poor html on my part...try this.
     
  29. The latest issue of Shutterbug has a good review of the Contax T3.
    Only negative is the flash, a range of only 3-4 feet. I would have
    bought one except for this as I am looking for a good shirt pocket
    camera.
     
  30. What ever happened to brand loyalty in this group? Support your habit
    and buy Leica. The minilux zoom is the way to go IMHO. Decent
    controllable flash with good range, nice lens, excellent ergos etc...
    a very nice pocket camera especially for grab shots. Expensive lens
    caps though ;)
     
  31. Now, I know that you talking about very small cameras. I really
    haven't had one since the untimely death of my IIIf. A number of
    years back, I did get a point and shoot. My idea was to get the
    absolute opposite of my M series cameras. I wanted something
    that could be used to make 4 x 6's for people at regular
    functions, when they just wanted stuff to pass around or put up
    each year to remind them what last year was like. Some of it
    goes on web sites.

    <p>

    I got an Olympus ISO-10. It has a 28 to 110 mm ASPH zoom. It
    has always reminded me of a ZX300 that I looked at once before
    getting a BMW. The car had a sticker on the window that said the
    dash has 187 separate controls. This camera is this way.

    <p>

    I have figured out what I need and what I don't. I like the spot
    meter option and the auto fill flash. I haven't tested the lens
    quality and only use print film to 4 x 6. I know that, even on the
    web, the quality is much better than what I get from the $5000 or
    so Nikon digital that I use at work. I like the camera, but it isn't
    pocket size.

    <p>

    Still, I tend to haul around the Leica M or Nikon F2. When you
    have backpacked an 8 x 10 a few times, they seem small. Of
    course, I don't do the kind of street photography that many of you
    do.

    <p>

    Art
     
  32. Nice going, Jim. My favorite is the strolling muscian at
    Montmartre. HCB can eat his heart out.
     
  33. Jim, Many of your pictures are wonderful examples of using wide angle
    lenses. Were the buildings taken with a PC lens, corrected in
    printing, or just carefully held level?
     
  34. No, I don't have a PC lens. I always try to hold the camera level,
    and I'm greatly aided by the use of a grid screen in my slr.

    <p>

    Thanks for taking a look.
     
  35. Mine is a Canon ixus adventurer (or thereabouts).
    It is an APS,
    The main good points are:-

    <p>

    -light weight
    -waterproof, can go underwater
    -smallness, round, size of flat tennisball.
    -relatively good pics.
    -tough
    -cheap
     
  36. Thanks to everyone for all the comments! There's been a really great
    number of responses, which and serves as yet another example of what
    a wonderful forum this is!!!

    <p>

    It's obvious that there's lots of personal favorites as far as pocket
    cameras goes, including many who view their Leica M's as their
    'pocket' cameras. I'm still undecided between the Olympus Stylus Epic
    and the Contax T3. I like the price and weather proofing of the
    Olympus, but the quality and option for overrides of the T3. In any
    event, the numerous responses will serve as good 'food for thought'.
    And, if Leica comes out with a new (smaller & lighter) model
    Minilux...

    <p>

    Cosmo: A local dealer advises that his Contax rep claims the black T
    3's are on their way and should be here in another month. Let's not
    hold our breath though...By the way, how do you override the DX
    coding in your Olympus Epic to shoot Tri-X at 200?
     
  37. Just before you do rush out and get a Oly or a Contax, just another
    plug for the Leica minilux which has a fine lens and really is not
    that big. Another choice, if you can find one, is the Leica mini 3. A
    truly tiny camera and simplicity itself to use. I got one for $100. My
    wife loves it and it produces fine results.
     
  38. Another good "pocket" camera is the Minolta AF-C : Great 2.8/35 mm
    Rokkor lens, rear lens AF (!), minimum focus app. 2 feet, small and
    lightweight (Minox 35 like), clam shell body, i.e. no case needed,
    cheap at ebay ... and it uses two SR 44 batteries instead of expensive
    Li-cells due to thumb wheel film advance. You can mount the tiny EF-C
    flash (GN 14) on the camera´s left side ... or not if you use fast
    film.

    <p>

    Carsten
     
  39. I've owned the original Yashica T4 and was extremely pleased. Sharp,
    sharp lens. One of the few P+S's without exposure compensation that
    could correctly expose chromes. Sad day when it got stolen.

    <p>

    Replaced it with 1stGen. Olympus Stylus Epic. This too was great and
    even more compact and weather resistent. It's programmed to shoot
    everything wide open at F2.8. Not so good for scenics, but great
    indoors. Had a bunch as I destroyed a few in my snowboarding
    adventures. Please note the later versions made in Singapore, as
    opposed to Japan, never seemed quite as sharp.

    <p>

    Currently proud owner of a Ricoh GR1-s. A tiny, beautifully made,
    magnesium bodied, full control compensation controlled aperature
    priority auto, excellent viewfinder with shutterspeed information,
    auto parallax correction, 3 point autofocus, spot focus/meter, a
    special hyperfocal mode. Best of all is all features have a "lock".
    Once selected the camera stays in this mode even when turned off.

    <p>

    The best are the analogue dials for exposure comp., aperature and the
    flash mode.

    <p>

    Excellent, excellent 28F2.8 aspheric lens. Has a seperate hood and
    provison for filters too.

    <p>

    My main gripe? A lot more distortion than I like. Always a hint of
    the "egg" head syndrome on the periphery. Also the passive infarred
    autofocus hunts a bit on the 3 point settings.

    <p>

    Cheers.
     
  40. The trouble with a 28mm as a standard lens is that it is not easy to
    take good portraits with it and this seems to me what most people use
    these cameras for. A 28mm is great for interiors, but it is most
    defintely not a "standard" lens, so I see a Ricoh GR1-s would not be
    much use to me as P&S. Still, many people disagree I know.
     
  41. If you are really a Leica Fans, Minilux 40mm F2.4 is the only choice
    to continue your Leica fantasy. I own one. I use it more often than
    my Leica M and R. Its optical quality is perfect!
     
  42. Four cameras come to mind:

    <p>

    Rollei 35S - All manual, supeb Zeiss Sonnar lens.
    Minox 35GT-E - All manual but with aperture-priority AE exposure
    system, another excellent lens.
    Leica Minilux - Modern, high-end PnS with user controllability.
    Contax T3 - Even nicer modern, high-end PnS with user
    controllability. Of these latter two, I'd take the Contax T3 over the
    Minilux due to its improved features, better ergonomics, smaller
    size, and what I feel is a marginally better lens. (I have a fifth, the
    Contax Tix, which is APS format but of the same order as the T3
    in quality and features ... it takes superb pix.)

    <p>

    I stick to cameras that have a 35-40mm lens and adequate user
    controllability. I don't like the simpler, all automated PnS models
    with no override capability.

    <p>

    godfrey
     
  43. I agree with the comments made about 28mm being too wide for a fixed
    lens camera, at least for my purposes, which are mostly family photos.

    <p>

    I tried the Minilux when it first came out and wasn't that satisfied
    with its ergonomics, although that was just running a roll through it
    outside of a local dealer's shop. I also prefer the smaller size and
    some of the features of the Contax T3 anyway. Take a look at the
    black body T3's that are supposedly on their way here at this site.
    http://www.kyocera.co.jp/news/2001/0104/0402-e.asp

    <p>

    I'd really love it if Leica (or even Cosina) come out with an updated
    CL (w/ a modernized and reliable meter), so that it could double
    as 'pocket' camera and second M body at the same time. If they could
    bring this out with a 40mm for $1000 they'd probably sell very well.
    Of course, the key word here is "if"...The idea of paying a bundle
    for a used CL with an unreliable meter is just not very appealing.
    Leica might actually be smarter bringing out an updated CL, than an
    M7, but that's another story...
     
  44. I just don't think Leica will do a "new CL". This was what almost
    destroyed the company in the 70s (coupled with discontinuing the M4)
    it sucks away sales from their premium cameras which offer the best
    margin for the company. The consumer range which includes the MInilux
    does not compete with the M line and this works well for them. Not
    that I disagree with you that a new CL would not be a good idea. I
    just don't think Leica will produce one.
    \
    By the way the CL meter is just fine - they just need to be properly
    fixed - cameras that are now almost 30 years old usually need some
    repairs - this is not unreasonable. People buy a never touched CL and
    expect to work the same as it did in 1973. An M4 might, but not the CL
    which will probably need a new CDS cell. At least one can be obtained
    still from Leica. I think this is quite impressive in these days of
    planned obsolescence.
     
  45. At the risk of being pegged as a Konica spokesperson, here's a vote for the Hexar (original). It's not tiny, but in black it is unobtrusive- and, in silent mode, quieter than the M, I think. The lens is just superb, AE/AF, but there is manual everything (manual focus is set by selecting distances), spot meter, as well as A and P (aperture biased). It has an excellent focusing aid so you know where it's focusing. I've never had a single mis-focused shot, in 100s of frames. It's lighter than an M6, but feels a bit clunkier. But with cameras everywhere these days, maybe small isn't as important.
    photo.net reviews
    One thought- the Yash. T4 has a WL finder, I believe.
     
  46. Olympic stylus epic! Quality to price ratio quite high. High
    precision 1:2.8 lens. About $89.00 at B & H. You cannot go wrong with
    it.
     
  47. KL Prager,

    <p>

    I attempted to send you an answer to your subsequent question about
    how to override the DX coding on the Epic to shoot Tri-X @ EI 200,
    but I received a "Failure Notice" (fatal error) for your
    address, "www.pragerproperties@att.net".
     
  48. Robin,

    <p>

    You're probably right that Leica is unlikely to bring out an updated
    CL. I suppose it's just 'wishful thinking' on my part...I'm glad to
    hear that the meter's on the original ones are repairable anyway.

    <p>

    Cosmo,

    <p>

    I did receive your e-mail. Thank you!

    <p>

    Ken
     
  49. All these answers are good answers. But there is no perfect answer. I
    have been baffled by the same question for years. I have an M6 TTL
    with collapsible 50mm and an ASPH 35mm, both quite small but still
    weighs like a brick in any pocket. And I don't want to be bothered
    with a flash. So, I have tried a Rollie 35, an old Minox 35 (no
    flash), a Pentax UC-1, and a cheap Fuji with dual focus lens as
    a "second" camera. Image quality of the Minox is best but has no
    rangefinder and only a detachable flash almost 2/3 the size of the
    little camera. The Rollei tears the end of the film strip as it keeps
    winding after you have reached the last frame and is hard to load.
    The Pentax is great but the auto rewind sometimes kicks in at mid
    roll, giving me a half exposed roll.

    <p>

    My opinion is, a pocketable second camera to you Leica M should
    offer, in addition to small size and ease of use, a built-in FLASH!

    <p>

    My current solution? A Kodak digital! Why? All the features of a
    film point-and-shoot and macro focusing, and gives me digital
    pictures to supplement my Leica. Also it does not give me another set
    of films that would confuse me after a trip.

    <p>

    What does everyone think--am I crazy?

    <p>

    Kenneth
     
  50. my pocket camera is Tri Elmar and HexarRF, the 3 focal of the 3E and
    AE of the Hexar make the best PS camera $$$ can buy.
     
  51. My pocket cameras are: Leica IIF, IIIF, and favourite III in black,
    with an Elmar 50mm/F3.5, a Summicron 35mm/F2.0 LTM, a tiny Summaron
    28mm/F5.6, and a Russar 20mm/F5.6. The IIIF is equipped with a
    titanium curtains that allows me to shoot when it's very frostily.
     
  52. My shirt pocket camera: Minox EC
    <p> Weight 2 oz
     
  53. Hi Kenneth,

    <p>

    I don't think your solution of using a digicam as your 'pocket'
    camera is crazy. Although the idea has crossed my mind several times
    also,I'm still happy with film. However, sometimes I do get Kodak's
    Picture CD's (color only)and I plan to get a film scanner later.
    Anyway, if a Kodak digicam serves your purposes then that's great too.
     
  54. My jacket pocket camera is a Leica IIIf with 50mm f3.5 Elmar. My shirt
    pocket camera is a Minox IIIs. All manual, excellent optics, great
    results.

    <p>

    Joe
     
  55. I recommend the Minox GT-E as a P&S camera for Leica users. Al’s answer covers me 100%.
    «It is the size of a pack of cigarettes, allows manual aperture and ISO settings, uses scale focusing via traditional depth of field markings. The lens is at least as good as a Summaron, aperture for aperture, very sharp and plenty of contrast. It is in my pocket even when my Leica isn't, and at the end of a trip, the Minox is responsible for many of my successful shots.» Al Smith
    Street Photography by Dimitris Kioseoglou
     
  56. I'm beginning to think that it'll be the coolpix 995 or the Camedia
    C4040.
    R.
     
  57. Hey you Minox GT-E guys, how difficult is it focusing by estimate?
    What about when shooting wide open at f2.8? It must be tuff, no?

    <p>

    One more thing. Is there anyway to take off that silly "skylight"
    filter on the lens? What is it's purpose anyway? It no doubt adds
    flare and if "protects" the lens, then why can't you change it? And
    if you can't, then surely you need to protect that too! So what is
    the logic???

    <p>

    I am thinking of getting this camera...
     
  58. Not one mention of the Canon Elph in 55 replies. I guess it must not
    be too good.
     
  59. Mike,

    <p>

    I have been using the Minox ML since 1986, and as you have stated,
    zone focusing wide open is not fun. One of the reasons I might have
    high regard for the lens is that when possible I always try to use it
    at f/5.6, which is pretty close to the best aperture. I do use it
    wide open when necessary, but I have arrived at a technique that
    works for me. Instead of looking at the subject, guessing the
    distance, setting the distance manually on the lens, all of which
    take too much time... I do the following. I set the distance I want
    to use on the lens, then move up to that place. I remember this is a
    point and shoot, not a precise camera for the utmost control in
    composition. I will set the lens for say 4 feet, look for an
    appropriate subject (candids work great for this), walk up until I am
    4 feet from the subject and shoot... sometimes without even lifting
    the camera to my eye.

    <p>

    The 35mm lens has a very unique feature. The long side of the
    negative is equal to the distance from the subject. This knowledge
    allows you to "compose" with your eye. That lens set for 4 feet,
    held vertically will capture 4 feet of a person. Held horizontally,
    you can get two or three people standing together. I love my Leicas,
    but some of my best candid street shot were made with the tiny Minox
    used this way. When palmed, it is truly invisible.
     
  60. I'm sure the Stylus Epic is quite good for the money, but I've never
    tried one. And those premium P&S cameras, such as the new Contax T3,
    almost seem to defeat their own purpose, since they are too expensive
    (at least for me) to leave bouncing around in a coat pocket, bottom of
    a purse or briefcase, and for use at the beach and in the rain.

    <p>

    I recommend the Yashica T4 Super. My first one is about 5 years old,
    has been thoroughly abused (drenched, dropped, etc.), has exposed at
    least 100 rolls of film, and has always produced nicely exposed,
    sharply focussed shots that easily hold their own next to shots made
    with my "serious" cameras. I love it so much that I just bought a
    second one, in case #1 ever dies, since I heard that they are being
    discontinued.
     
  61. It is almost impossible to find a satisfactory a P&S camera after
    shooting with Leica optics. I have owned and used two Yashica T4s,
    two Olympus Stylus Epic, a Leica Minilux, a Rollei QZ35T and a Ricoh
    GR1 for the past four years. Out of these mentioned, my favorite is
    the GR1. It is very small and light with excellent lens. The only
    down side is the 28mm focal length is two wide for a general purpose
    P&S. Both T4 and Stylus Epic (the samples that I have had) had very
    average performance – I was very disappointed. The optics on the
    Minilux is very good. But the weight, size and ergonomics are much
    less desirable. The Rollei QZ doesn’t fit the pocket P&S category at
    all since the weight and size is about the same as an M6 with a Tri-
    Elmar, although Rollei has a fantastic lens.

    <p>

    I will definitely tried the new Contax T3 if you want a small pocket
    P&S.
     
  62. A footnote to my earlier post concerning the dunked Olympus Stylus.
    It survived the river dunking. My girlfriend came back from New
    Mexico with good pictures. This is one tough camera, which can be
    highly recommended for applications that risk exposure to water. It
    worked well (slight glitch with not wanting to takeup the film leader
    on one roll, but this was corrected) and the pictures looked as good
    as ever. Though I think we'll take a single use camera on future
    canoe trips. Or at least a ziplock bag.
     
  63. My favourite pocket camera are Minox 35ML and Minox C--- ie, they are more often in my pockets than T2, and Canon Elph 370z. Elph is fun, in particular the paranomic But the Minox lens is sharper.
    As for focusing MInox at f2.8, there is no problem, I used my two eyes as rangefinder, and can focus as accurately as M6
    For more on Minox and technique : Minox FAQ
     
  64. The old LUSENET Minox forum is at Minox Photography; Moved due to lack of SEARCH and too many fake emails
     
  65. I bought my wife a Rollei Prego 125 when Camera World in Portland had
    no Minilux Zoom units in stock. Frankly, I'm astounded at the great
    results she gets. Naturally, when approaching the higher telephoto
    range, the lens is getting into an f 11 area so shutter speed and
    sharpness decline. The trick is to use 400 or 800 speed film to keep
    shutter speed in a faster zone. Pictures between 38mm and 55mm are
    tack- sharp thanks to the great films (color negative) we have
    ava
     
  66. I've owned an M2 since 1970 and currently have the latest 35mm and
    50mm Summicrons.

    <p>

    While I carry the M2 with one of these lenses many places, I also
    often carry a Nikon TI with the 35mm f/2.8 lens. Wide open the lens
    is as good as my Zeiss SLR lenses but not up to Summicron quality
    (what is?). Exposure compensation is +/- two stops. One very nice
    is scale focusing that locks into place--unlike the Contax T2 or T3
    which have rotating wheels that easily dislog. I can set the
    focusing dial at 15 feet and the aperature at f/8 and shoot all day
    long in the street without having to do anything except compose and
    press the shutter release. Shutter lag is considerable more than the
    M2. One thing I hate is that (like most P/S) there is only one
    camera strap lug.

    <p>

    Bob Gordon
     
  67. Ken, you've had a lot of good suggestions, but there is one more
    camera to consider: the Contax T. It has a 38mm/f2.8 Zeiss Sonnar
    lens that is very sharp, pretty fast, and works in low light and
    bright light. It's very tough; I take mine hiking. boating,
    fishing. I even dropped it in the water once, pulled it apart and it
    dried out fine (this is not recommended, I just got lucky). This is
    NOT an autofocus, which, as a Leica user, I think you'll appreciate.
    It is aperture priority, and the fastest shutter speed is 1/500. You
    can find these on Ebay occasionally for $300-400. The other
    autofocus Contax P&Ss are good, but this one is really better. It's
    also the size of an APS camera and designed by F. Porsche. Try it
    out!
     
  68. I decided to jump in on this. Why not an M6 with the Elmar-M
    50mm/f2.8? Easily fits into a small waist pouch and provides
    outstanding quality. (I use a Lowepro $19 "Waist Pouch.") Which makes
    it really easy to carry, even in the middle of summer, with only
    running shorts and a tee shirt on. Of course this is the only
    camera/lens combination I use right now, and because of it's
    outstanding quality and compact size, it goes everywhere (loaded with
    T-Max 400!) I mean, if I'm going to take a photo, then it's something
    serious, I believe in. Plus in 35mm history, a Lecia RF and a 50mm
    collapsable lens combination have taken more great pictures than
    anything else (in my opinion, so I don't get flamed.)
     
  69. "Why not an M6 with the Elmar-M 50mm/f2.8?"
    That's a great recommendation!...............
     
  70. I'll offer my 2cents. I use the Minilux Zoom (MLZ) and like it a lot
    though it has its drawbacks. The basic Minilux (ML) probably has a
    sharper lens, but not by much. The ML lens is 1 stop faster
    (relative to the MLZ at 35mm which is close to 40mm). The ML allows
    aperture priority shutter control and has a top shutter speed of
    1/400 instead of the MLZ's 1/250.

    <p>

    So why the MLZ? It's zoom lens (35mm-70mm) more or less covers my
    basic M setup of 35mm, 50mm, 90mm thus generally handling indoors and
    landscapes through portraits. The MLZ also has an outboard flash
    which I use all the time for either flash or fill flash. The
    outboard flash's greater distance from the lens axis virtually
    eliminates redeye without the very annoying pre-flash. A GN of
    20@ASA100 vs. 13@ASA100 is also nice.

    <p>

    The ML seemed too close to an M with a 35mm. I keep the CF flash and
    MLZ in a little two pocket Tamrac P&S bag which is my mini people and
    place camera system when I don't want to pull out the big guns and
    look like a "serious photographer." Since most of what I want a P&S
    camera to do is shoot people this seemed like a good choice. Your
    requirements may be different.
     
  71. <img src="http://www.minoxlab.com/Images/minox2000_o.jpg">
     
  72. Tessina is a high quality spy camera made in Switzerland. Unlike Minox, which uses special film, Tessina uses 35mm film
    Tessina is a favourite pocket camera of many Leicaphiles font>
     
  73. In rolling stone magazube aug/ 2001 issue, there was a picture of
    Jim Morrison Taking a Picture with a Minox B camera in Frankfurt,
    Germany.
     
  74. Why not a Leica M6 and 50mm 2.8 Elmar? For the same reason as other
    Leica/lens combinations.You can't take close-ups!!
    I have the above Leica/lens combo and it is excellent.Before I bought
    the Leica I was sceptical that there is a difference between Leica and
    other brands but the contrast and detail(especially in landscapes with
    distant features) is easily better than with any other lenses I have
    ever used.BUT having used several pocket size cameras over the years
    including the venerable Contax T2 (I've still got it!)I learned that
    you can't beat a tiny compact camera when you need to work fast or in
    difficult situations.For me there are always times when I travel when
    I need a close up shot (not macro) say from about 12 - 14 inches with
    a 35mm lens.Leica lenses can't do it.Leica doesn't believe there is a
    market for a close focus lens for the m series.They are wrong.Bet you,
    that if they introduced one, they would sell loads!
    So,at this moment in time there are three options.
    CONTAX T3, ROLLEI AFM35/FUJI KLASSE or RICOH GR1v.
    All have excellent lenses.No point in arguing which is the best
    because they are all capable of quality results.
    T3 might be best all rounder but is actually a little too small for
    good handling and has poor flash range.Best construction though with
    Titanium shell.
    Ricoh has interesting finder.You can see outside the frame area just
    like a leica M!!and with illuminated frames and LCD very easy to use
    in the dark.I speak from experience.
    Rollei/Fuji has a nice big flash,is comfortable to hold and simple to
    use .In Popular photo.magazine lens tested slightly BETTER than T3's..
    and that is no mean feat!!Finder has the dreaded blackout problem when
    you don't center your eye..and in my opinion camera designers need a
    rap on the knuckles about this problem!!
    Whichever of these you choose though you'll have a camera that can
    deliver the goods!I wouldn't like to say which is the best.I want all
    of them!!Then after travelling around India for a few months with
    several dozen rolls of film..I'll let you know.
     
  75. I bought a Minox 35GT for use as a pocket camera. It's OK but th
    emeter is off so it under-exposes by at least 1 ev. It means I have
    to set the film speed to 1/2 of what it's supposed to be. I
    understand that's a common fault with Minox 35s. By the way, WTF has
    Martin done to the font size on this thread?
     
  76. I bought a Minox 35GT for use as a pocket camera. It's OK, but the
    meter is off so it under-exposes by at least 1 ev. It means I have to
    set the film speed to 1/2 of what it's supposed to be. I understand
    that's a common fault with Minox 35s. By the way, WTF has Martin
    done to the font size on this thread?
     
  77. <font size=+><p>
    My Minox GT-E and Minox 35ML exposure is right on the mark.<p>
    Minox 35 camera meter is as accurate as Gossen, because its meter
    is Gossen
     
  78. Sorry, nothing to add, just that the small font was bothering me -- had to squint to read the posts.
     
  79. Users comments on Minox 35
     
  80. <font size=+>
    <p> One extra ordinary feature of Minox 35 camera is its ultra long
    automatic exposure.
    <p> Most cameras, compact, SLR, RF, etc, have a long shutter time
    of 10 sec to 30 sec.
    <p> The automatic shutter of Minox 35 can last 10 minutes, 20 minutes
    even 30 minutes.
    <p>
     
  81. Ricoh Gr1(s) if use is "wideangle", if vignetting is not
    disagreeable, and if a flash is not needed to be other than weak.
    Contax T3 - am I the only person in the world with a T3 which renders
    slide films with blue/magenta cast, provides no real detail in shadow
    areas (even when slightly overexposing, and, because of small size &
    weight, is difficult to hand hold while avoiding camera shake
    softness? (probably, so please don't inundate me with scoffing e-
    mail - I'm embarrased enough by the fuzzy snapshots I get with the T3
    (even when the camera's mounted on my trusty manfrotto!(Also the T3
    flash is a total waste of space)
    Minilux 40mm. Yes - wonderful, but a bit big.
    Conclusion: If you want 'leica' pics get minilux, if you want
    convenience with reasonably good pic quality get Ricoh. If you want
    Emperors New Clothes and frustrating quality - get T3
    Before other T3 owners start blowing their tops, perhaps they could
    provide me with a link to a web site showing t3 pics which are
    supposedly superior enough to justify the hype?
     
  82. why not a Contax G1? They can be picked up for a very good price
    nowadays and comes w/ a 45/2 zeiss lens. Outstanding quality, auto-
    focus. cheers,
     
  83. The Olympus RC!!! AE with full manual overide, Killer viewfinder info
    on F/stop and Shutter speed. Incredibly sharp 42mm f2.8 lens.
    Ergonomics that fall to hand as they should like the shutterspeed
    dial. "Auto" fool proof GN flash capability. Very inexpensive
    considering features and quality. Drawbacks? It is all metal not
    plastic chic, and you may end up really liking it more than your
    other stuff. Or...if control is not an issue any of the EC line such
    as EC-2 EC, (Zone focus) or EC-R (Split image RF) Same lens as RC! I
    have several from eBay for under 20.00 each, the best was 5.00!!!
    Truly incredible results and totally stealthily silent.

    <p>

    Felix
     
  84. My new pocket camera, a Minox Platinum camera in shirt pocket<p>
    <img src="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Minox-
    FAQ/files/Boxes/lxplatin1.jpg">
     
  85. Whats a point and shoot anyway?

    <p>

    Face it, to point and shoot you want the ease and simplicity of
    taking pictures!

    <p>

    You need a good flash and lens, coupled with good metering and focus
    and there you have it!

    <p>

    Most of all you don't want to baby your camera and keep worrying
    about scratches and dings! Point and shooters should have fun!

    <p>

    Rollie AFM35 - bracketing, stronger flash, better lens.

    <p>

    Live your dreams.
     
  86. Martin, I think that platinum Minox is a most handsome camera.
    However, the ER case looks rather large. ;-)
     
  87. Preferred pocket camera - my dad's Olympus Stylus Epic 35/2.8. I get to use it when we're vacationing together. Otherwise it's a Lomo Smena 40/4 although I don't use it much. I usually carry the M2 in a sling bag wherever I go.
     
  88. Olympus Stylus!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I have bought about one dozen of these off of ebay as "as is for repair only parts cameras"........................My entire outlay has been about 30 dollars.............All of the auctions had alot of disclaimers as non repairable etc etc......... One haul was from a Camera repair outfit....

    report card: about 5 of the cameras actually work; 7 had usable batteries; 3 still had film in them!....One 105mm zoom model I could not find out what was ever wrong with it... After 3 rolls of film under every type of conditions; 2 photos had light leaks...the foam in only one place must be aged/too compressed... Kelly
     
  89. Ray, the Minox Platin has a TLX style case<p>
    <img
    src="http://www.submin.com/8x11/collection/minox/cameras/cameras/lx_pl
    atin_pt544_2.jpg"><P>
    Minox CLX has a Minox B style side flip case, which is better
     
  90. I'm sure you've chosen a camera by now, however... My Olympus Stylus Epic takes nice sharp 4x6 color snaps and it was just made to be put in a pocket. Even says 'ALL-WEATHER' on the front. Problem is I picked up an Olympus Camedia D-100 digital 1.3 last year and I haven't quite figured out if I've got a use for the Sylus Epic now. The Camedia is perfect for email photos, and is only slightly larger and just as easy to carry as the Epic. Both cameras are beautifully and simply designed for the purpose they serve. I've been thinking if I need a more photographically capable companion to my M6- for what? color film? to put in the glove box? Not sure yet, but I'm interested in the Leica CL and Minolta CLE, or maybe just a slightly beat up M6 again with that Elmar 50 mentioned above?
     
  91. CL with 3.5cm/3.5 Elmar (late, coated, 694xxx)and SM to M adapter.
    Someone proposed this combo a few months ago. Ihad the parts but hadnt tried it. The lens vignettes a bit at the corners at f3.5, ok by f4.5. At f9 hyperfocal setting is 6.5 ft to infinity.
    Been using it with T400CN,
    If the meter dies, so what, the film has so much exposure latitude anyway...
     
  92. If you want a fully manual camera, the Rollei-35S that rocks a superb 40/2.8 Sonnar. If your choice is an autofocus camera, I do recommend the fantastic Minolta TC-1 (aperture priority,spot meter). Both are razor sharp and I have no complains. The TC-1 is the smallest 35mm camera and its lens is a G-Rokkor 28mm/3.5 Aspherical.
     
  93. Last trip to Hong Kong, I bought a Minox Leica M replica (DIGITAL). The image downloaded to my computer is just superb. It's better than any film P&S on the market. And it doesn't come any smaller than that.
     

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