Which Mac to upgrade to

Discussion in 'Digital Darkroom' started by jackson_holtz, Oct 12, 2016.

  1. Want to upgrade my 8 year old Mac book (13") to a newer machine, at least 15". Considering either Mac Book Pro 15" or iMac 21" - mostly because I use Apple products - iPhone, iPad. Not adverse to PC, but prefer Mac environment.
    Relatively novice photographer. Would be using Lightroom, I believe, to digitally develop photos.
    Thanks for inputs
     
  2. The screen size on laptops is a struggle between utility for editing and sheer transportability of the machine.
    I'd suggest you consider a 27" iMac, a wonderful desktop all-in-one. Keep your old laptop in the interim, and then get a MacBook Air later on for when you do need portability. Desktops will typically give you more for your buck than portables.
    As with all systems of any brand, pump as large memory and drives as you can into any machine. It will pay off in the long and intermediate term.
     
  3. Hi Jackson
    I upgraded my 2008 MacBook Pro last year and you will be delighted with the improved performance no mater what you pick.
    Key question is if you want portability or not. If you want portability then there are two options
    1) iMac and another either a MacBook Pro or Mac Air
    2) Get a MacBook Pro and for large screen usage you just tether a larger screen into the thunderbolt port.
    I went with option #2 and got a MacBook Pro with both the 16G memory and the 1TB SSD drive. There are many good large displays to choose from and they don't have to be from Apple. No regrets on my end.
     
  4. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    We should be seeing a new MacBook Pro any day now. I've got a 2013 Retina maxed out, love it but would love to upgrade to whatever is coming out presumably within the next 30 days or so.
     
  5. AJG

    AJG

    +1 for the 27" iMac. I bought one last year and have been very happy with it for Photoshop work.
     
  6. Thanks for the helpful info
     
  7. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    That 21" iMac has a slow laptop grade i5 cpu from 2013...I wouldn't. Or at least wait for the refresh that is just around the corner. The current 27" iMac has been updated and is a bit faster but it's still an "all in one" laptop at the end of the day. IMO, if you're going with laptop grade hardware, I'd get the MacBook Pro and then add a nice monitor like a Dell Ultrasharp. I have a 2013 i7 MBP with 16gb of ram and 500Gb Samsung ssd but it's too slow for serious photography so I'd try to avoid the laptop hardware if you can afford it.

    You can run Windows on your Mac and have the best of both worlds. I put bootcamp and Windows 10 on my MBP so I can run Quickbooks 2016 (not available on Mac). For some reason, Ps and Lr CC run faster on Windows 10 on the MacBook Pro than under El Capitan. Strange.
     
  8. I'd go with a MB Pro 15", and probably makes sense to wait a couple of weeks. Or if you want to save a little cache, you can get a current model refurbished. But would get the 15" Retina model, and max the ram. Using a mid-2014 model and it runs very well.
     
  9. If you get a mac ensure you have a mimimum of 16gb RAM For flexibilty (if you can afford it) a macbook Pro with external monitor. I used to have a 2011 15"MBP quad core i7, with 16 GB Ram which worked well. I bought a 2013, 13" Retina MBP which had 8GB Ram and 500GB SSD for travel. Its not so fast as I expected and cannot upgrade.
     
  10. I just did this when my 8 year old iMac died. I do have lots of Apple gear including an old Apple Xserve. I also have both a MacBook pro and an small screen Air. I'm with those suggesting an iMac. Look at the refurbished on the Apple site and you can save a couple of hundred dollars. Get one made after October 2015. It is the video card that is most important for photo processing. i5 or i7 processors are both fine.Get one with an AMD Radeon R9 M380 2048 MB video card or equivalent. Get the 4K Retina screen. 8GB of RAM is OK. I previously had 16GB and now find 8GB fine. With the new iMacs you can easily upgrade it yourself later if you find the need.
     
  11. You should consider waiting for the new MacBook Pro to come out and the rumored new 27" Thunderbolt display (either 4 or 5K). You get portability with an option for a large monitor. BUT, neither of these choices are available today.
     
  12. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    Well, what a disappointment the new MBP is. We waited four years and this latest one has a weaker gpu, slower cpu, and slower ram than the one it is replacing...along with no sd card reader, no usb3, no hdmi...How are the final cut pro people going to use that Touch Bar? I don't get it. A good read:
    Apple just told the world it has no idea who the Mac is for
    But kudos MS for listening to the creative markets. That Surface Studio sure looks like a winner.
     
  13. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Well, what a disappointment the new MBP is.​
    Can't wait for mine to arrive. Based on that opinion, I know I will not be disappointed!
     
  14. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Apple’s new MacBook Pro may be the world’s fastest stock laptop

    http://www.macworld.com/article/3137179/storage/apples-new-macbook-pro-may-be-the-worlds-fastest-stock-laptop.html
     
  15. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    Mac World...where fanboys write reviews? I'm sure you'll get the straight goods there. But report back and let us know how much you spend on dongles, cables and adaptors in order to swap out your older and more powerful MBP.
    Apple just told the world it has no idea who the Mac is for

    "For a company that prides itself on ecosystem, and thinking of the ‘end to end’ experience, Apple has utterly lost its way. Yesterday, the world got an iteration on something the company’s been doing all along, rather than something that’s a vision for the future. Apple spent the entire event comparing itself to its own past, rather than showing us the future, and even then painted a very clear picture: it has no idea who the Mac is for."
    https://medium.com/charged-tech/apple-just-told-the-world-it-has-no-idea-who-the-mac-is-for-722a2438389b#.qg9zzfbi2
    Review: The $1,499 2016 MacBook Pro is an expensive MacBook Air on the inside

    "But when you dig down to find the root cause of most people's angst, it’s less about the new MacBook Pros individually and more about the way Apple has been treating the Mac lineup in general for the last two or three years. Even if you consider the MacBook and MacBook Pros to be solid computers—and they are, in most respects for most users—these refreshes by themselves don’t really right the Good Ship Macintosh. The Mac Mini is two years old, the Mac Pro is three years old, and the iMac just missed out on a yearly refresh for the first time since the 2012 models came out. The company is serving its entry-level Mac customers by selling them 2015’s laptops virtually unchanged for the same price as it sold them for last year. And Apple being Apple, we never hear about future products before they’re ready, which does nothing to ease the minds of longtime Mac customers who are uncertain about the platform’s future in a time where iOS is clearly (and rightfully, based on Apple's earnings) the top priority." arstechnica.com/apple/2016/11/review-cheapest-2016-macbook-pro-is-good-but-its-missing-all-the-cool-stuff/4/
     
  16. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Mac World...where fanboys write reviews?​
    Well over on MacWorld (different site you googled Eric?) same site that called the new MBP the worlds fastest stock laptop above:
    Hands-on: The MacBook Pro's innovative Touch Bar will grab you
    Apple's newest Mac packs a strip of iOS-style contextual controls into the Touch Bar. There's also a new keyboard and four Thunderbolt 3 ports.
    It’s thinner, lighter, and smaller all around, but the new MacBook Pro makes a big impression. The trackpad on the 15-inch version is downright ridiculous—twice as large as the trackpad on the previous generation—but I didn’t look down and say, “Holy cow, that is a seriously huge trackpad,” until I’d been using it for a couple of minutes.
    Because it’s really all about that gorgeous Touch Bar.

    More rave reviews. Spin this FUD anyway you wish Eric. I've got one on order, so do others. Don't like it? Don't order one. Stick with your virus inflected windows box.
    I only need one so called dongle and it cost me a whooping $19.
     
  17. Monoprice has USB C to USB A adapters for $8.99.
    How about two adapters for $7.99? Tiny and inline. You'll be seeing more peripherals with with USB C, with included cables, now that Apple's moving the market.
    And how about that DCI-P3 display. Nice!
     
  18. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Stick with your virus inflected windows box.​
    I just want to go on record and state this wasn't a slam of the Windows OS (I own such a system along with four other Mac's) but an indictment of Eric's specific infected Windows machine by his own admission to members here:
    http://www.photo.net/digital-darkroom-forum/00cPFM
    Eric ~ , Feb 27, 2014; 10:16 a.m.
    Allan, the marketing claim is that they are. But my cheap 700mb cd's purchased from Costco in 2003 still worked when I had to restore from a nasty virus that went through all my internal and external hard drives...flash drives and memory cards all went into the bin. Eventually we deterined the virus was on/in the ram or bios of the computer and infected everything I plugged into the computer.
    So when you examine his text on computers, Mac or otherwise, take that above admission as a data point. And of course, Mac or Windows, do practice safe and sound computing, unlike you know who.... ;-)
     
  19. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    I've got one on order, so do others.​
    Seems others have!
    The Touch Bar-equipped MacBook Pro may be about the most popular MacBook Pro to date.
    In a recent interview, Apple Vice President of Worldwide Marketing Phil Schiller noted that the new model is the most popular notebook that Apple has ever shipped.
    “Our online store has had more orders for the new MacBook Pro than any other pro notebook before,” said Schiller.

    Of course, McDonalds sells the most Hamburgers....
     
  20. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    http://www.macworld.com/article/3138930/macbook-accessories/apple-reduces-prices-on-usb-c-adapters.html
    Apple reduces prices on USB-C adapters
     
  21. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

  22. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    The dongle doesn't even work.​
    For some no, for some it does. What's your point with more FUD?
    5.0out of 5stars
    Very good

    5.0out of 5stars
    Works well

    5.0out of 5stars
    Is exactly what is claims to be

    5.0out of 5stars
    Works well with my LG 2560 x 1080 display

    5.0out of 5stars
    Perfect

    4.0out of 5stars
    Expensive, but highly practical

    4.0out of 5stars
    Necessity for Apple MacBook 12"

    Over on Amazon, 102 reviews. 57% 5 stars! 13% 4 stars. Do you understand statistics any better than you understand about DNG Camera profiles or how to protect against getting a computer virus Eric?
     
  23. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    I'd love to update my mid 2013 MBP to a newer cpu, gpu and more than my 16gb of ram. But it isn't possible. Who's going to spend $3500 for a slower machine with less functionality? The armchair Strarbucks photographer? Even the wifi is half as fast as the MBP it is replacing. Unbelievable.
    The new Touch Bar just killed the new MBP for two of its distinct markets, video and DJ. I don't know anyone that uses Lr and is looking forward to trying to the touch bar.
    "an open letter to apple from the actual working-pros"
    https://www.slrlounge.com/an-open-letter-to-apple-from-the-actual-working-pros/
    "We have to deliver results based on client expectations and to do that all our equipment has to work seamlessly. While I appreciate that technologies like USB-C are the way forward, this is a case where a gradual approach isn’t just recommended, it’s necessary. As professionals we could care one bit if dropping the port has made the laptop 2mm thinner or slightly lighter. Not to mention that I’ve not once heard a single professional complain that their MBP is just too big and bulky. What we covet is flexibility, performance, and stability. Sure, we can buy a bunch of adapters and go on with our lives, but things just aren’t that simple. Adapters create an extra point of failure and when you look at something like camera tethering–which is often problematic enough–it’s just a recipe for errors at times when we need our gear to work. Furthermore, adapters are yet another item that we need to remember to bring with us in an already mile long list of tools."
    "Typical everyday scenario: You have a new 2017 Apple laptop, and a person hands you a USB stick to copy files, or an SD card, or ask you to plug in an HDMI cable in for a large screen presentation. You take the USB stick, SD card, and HDMI cable and throw it out the f%^*ing window, as they are now deemed useless without having to carry around an adapter. So the simplicity of having an Apple computer with a few different ports built in the side of it for different applications is now gone. You now have to purchase yet another gizmo to make it work. You’ve just lost yet another loyal customer."

    "It seams that in the search to innovate, you’ve inconvenienced and alienated the actual working pros that use your devices and depend on your computers to make a living and streamline efficiency. In the quest to make things thinner, lighter, and faster we’ve made it harder to shoot tethered, too expensive to fit into an existing ecosystem, and full of features that pro’s don’t really want. I think it’s time to address that these computers aren’t built for pros but for the audience aspiring to be a pro, with the dreams that they can one day have a MacBook Pro hooked up to two matte screen monitors and a RED Dragon on their workstation. My suggestion to you is to actually solicit advice from the pros and provide computers with solutions that make our jobs easier.'
     
  24. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Who's going to spend $3500 for a slower machine with less functionality?​
    According to Apple lots and lots and lots of customers!
    Again, don't want one, don't buy one. Stick with your infected Windows box.
     
  25. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    The new Touch Bar just killed the new MBP for two of its distinct markets, video and DJ.​
    And yet, during the Apple release of the product, the MBP WAS demo'd by a DJ (and someone running FinalCut Pro) with beta builds that actually support the Touch bar. Photoshop too. On Planet Eric, the main life form there speaks FUD for entire industries about a product neither he, nor anyone else in said industries have tried.

    On this planet, the new MPB and the one it replaces is vastly faster than the mid 2013 MPB on Planet Eric in virtually every respect. On Planet Eric, the life form there acts as if his only choice is to buy the new 2016 MBP. On this planet, the previous unit Eric feels is so much superior can still be purchased for less than the $3500 of the new MBP which isn't the price for the MPB on Planet Eric (unless you go out of your way to get a custom build with a much larger drive, faster processor etc). On this planet, people who run Lightroom who've never had a chance to try the Touch Bar with a version built for it probably shouldn’t be listened to. On Planet Eric, they unanimously dislike it. On this planet, one isn't offended by a lighter MacBook with a longer battery life who might need to buy a couple of adaptors. On Planet Eric, it's a deal breaker. Which is fine; on Planet Eric, the 2013 MBP or an infected windows box are the only options. On this planet, sales of the new MBP are through the roof:
    https://9to5mac.com/2016/11/09/2016-macbook-pro-sales/
    New MacBook Pro outsold every competing laptop in just five days

    On Planet Eric, it's an unbelievable failure in every respect.
    I thankfully live on planet Earth, not Planet Eric and I can't wait for my MBP to arrive, hopefully next week! Unlike on Planet Eric, I've got no agenda to praise a product I have never used, nor slam it. That might come when, unlike how opinions are formed on Planet Eric, I have actual hands on experience with this new product.
     
  26. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Interesting article Brad, thanks. But this will not fly on Planet Eric:
    A ‘Professional’ should be defined by the work they deliver and the value they bring, not their gear. Use the new MacBook Pro, don’t use the new MacBook Pro. Your audience don’t care. You just have to keep making great work however you can. For me, I love it and I think most people will do too... once they actually touch it.
     
  27. It depends on what you really intend to use it for. If you are doing any heavy lifting processing of large images you need the best graphics card you can get. I'd spend a bit of time learning about graphics cards and seeing which is installed in the system you intend to purchase and if it can be upgraded if needed. I have a fairly new MacBook Air and take it with me into the field, though it doesn't get much use. I do all my processing on a 27" iMac - I just bought a new one when my 7 year old one died. I got one with a retina screen though I wasn't sure that I needed it. I really don't need it, but I really like it now that I have been using it for a month. It sits next to a 24 inch monitor that is not 4K and there is a discernible difference -- though I use both when processing images (I keep Lightroom up on the 24 and process on the 27.
     
  28. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    More data points about this from Planet Earth where most of us reside :
    http://theweek.com/articles/659358/triumphant-return-pc
    In part:
    Pundits have been writing obituaries for the personal computer for years now, but Apple and Microsoft just showed that the consumer tech workhorse is still alive and kicking.
    Ah, pundits who are wrong, sound familiar?
    Apple and Microsoft are nevertheless smart to boot up their PC efforts, said Dan Gallagher at The Wall Street Journal. With nearly 200 million desktops sold globally this year, "a market still exists that tech companies can ill afford to ignore." The Mac alone pulls in nearly $23 billion in annual revenue for Apple — a tally that would make it 123rd on the Fortune 500 if it were a stand-alone business.

    Now most people have moved on to smartphones and tablets for those activities. That partly explains why these new machines are so expensive (the new MacBook Pro starts at $1,799). "Those price tags are tough for an everyday user to justify, but professionals might see the machines as an investment if they're making money by using them."
    A"Armchair Strarbucks photographer" (a copy and paste from above) on Planet Eric or actual Pro's getting all kinds of actual work done at what we know as Starbucks and elsewhere on Planet Earth?
     
  29. Andrew... Have any opinion on the recently announced 27" LG 5K display designed in collaboration with Apple? Interfaces to the new MacBook Pro via a single cable that provides display data, display control from the laptop, audio, and laptop charging, along with providing three additional USB C ports on the back of the display? It's not a NEC Spectraview, but at $974 and supporting a DCI-P3 gamut, it seems like a decent value.
     
  30. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Have any opinion on the recently announced 27" LG 5K display designed in collaboration with Apple?​
    No, sorry. I'm far more interested in a wide gamut color reference display ala Eizo/NEC SpectraView than resolution. Something that allows internal and differing calibrations from the panel itself, with full control over black (Contrast Ratio) etc.
     
  31. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    Glass houses, throwing stones...
    According to Apple lots and lots and lots of customers!​
    Lots? Sounds like something Eric would say. Do you have data to verify this "lots" or is it, how do you say Andrew, "mumbo jumbo"? Right, it's all hunky dory. Kidding aside though and on a serious note, how about you share with us which MBP you ordered, and the reasoning why are inclined to spend so much cash on a slower and less versatile machine than your current 2013 MBP? I'm also curious if you're aware that they've dropped Nvidia graphics cards and gone with on-board AMD? Seems like a strange move to many as even Nvidia’s entry level el-cheapo notebook gpu, the GTX 1060m, is almost twice as fast as the best AMD option offered for the 2016 MBP. I know it's just on stats on paper but I'm having a hard time imagining what kind of experience we're going to have with this AMD trying to run Lr let alone running it with an external monitor.
    I can see Christmas now. People are going to open presents and find that a $1000 iPhone 7 and a $1700 MBP can't be connected with the cables provided. Similarly, you can’t connect your Lightning earbuds to your new laptop. Incredible. I can see the memes now.
     
  32. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Lots? Sounds like something Eric would say.​
    Some damn fools can't read the facts already posted here!
    Andrew Rodney [​IMG][​IMG], Nov 03, 2016; 02:57 p.m.: In a recent interview, Apple Vice President of Worldwide Marketing Phil Schiller noted that the new model is the most popular notebook that Apple has ever shipped.

    Unfortunately and so sad is only Eric on Planet Eric consistency sounds like something Eric would say!
     
  33. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Next, someone from Planet Earth will have to inform Planet Eric who Phil Schiller is, what company he works for and what a VP of Worldwide Marketing does. Plus how Schiller might know about the number of sales after an announcement of the MPG and opening of the Apple store.
    I'm sorry the facts continue to ruin your file life on Planet Eric...
     
  34. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    The VP of Apple releases a marketing fluff piece and that's were you get your facts from? Okey dokey.
    Can you answer the question? Please share with us which MBP you ordered, and the reasoning why are inclined to spend so much cash on a slower and less versatile machine than your current 2013 MBP?
     
  35. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    The VP of Apple releases a marketing fluff piece and that's were you get your facts from? Okey dokey.​
    On Planet Eric it's fluff which is ironic as all the fluff has come from that location we now know is in a unreality bubble: Planet Eric! On this planet, it's difficult to believe what you do not understand from this fact, again posted above:
    Our online store has had more orders for the new MacBook Pro than any other pro notebook before,” said Schiller.

    What facts on either Planet Earth on Planet Eric can dismiss what Schiller wrote? Or this:
    Apple already told us that the 2016 MacBook Pro had set a new online sales record, backed by supply-chain reports of increased component orders, but Slice Intelligence has provided our first look at the scale of those orders. The company reports that the new models took just five days to outsell every high-profile laptop on the U.S. market.
    It has already outsold combined sales of the Dell XPS 13 and 15 – probably the closest equivalents in the Windows world – which have been on sale for more than ten months. It has also sold almost four times as many units as Microsoft’s flagship laptop, the new Surface Book.
    The company additionally compared sales to Apple’s own 12-inch MacBook, to see how its pro laptops were faring against its ultraportable model …
    Just five days in, the MacBook Pro models had already hit almost 80% of combined 2015 and 2016 MacBook sales – and look set to exceed 18 months of sales in the first week.

    “There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn't true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true.” -Søren Kierkegaard
    A third way is to live in an unreality bubble on Planet Eric....

    So yeah, more foolish text from Planet Eric. Don't you get tired of posting such nonsense here? I'm tired of reading it and wonder who else might be too.
    As Benjamin Franklin said: "Experience is a hard teacher, but fools will have no other."
    No need to attempt to further teach you about the new MBP, nor safe virus free computing or the facts behind DNG camera profiles or the DNG file format. The experience from facts are lost to those living on Planet Eric I'm afraid. Let's move on unless you insist on more proving more foolish posts from the unreality bubble.
    Please share with us which MBP you ordered, and the reasoning why are inclined to spend so much cash on a slower and less versatile machine than your current 2013 MBP?​
    • 2.9GHz quad-core Intel Core i7 processor, Turbo Boost up to 3.8GHz
    • 16GB 2133MHz memory
    • Radeon Pro 460 with 4GB memory
    • 512GB PCIe-based SSD
    • Four Thunderbolt 3 ports
    • Touch Bar and Touch ID
    • Force Touch trackpad

    My current machine as reported by System Info:
    MacBook Pro (Retina, 15-inch, Early 2013)
    Processor Name:Intel Core i7
    Processor Speed:2.7 GHz
    Number of Processors:1
    Total Number of Cores:4
    L2 Cache (per Core):256 KB
    L3 Cache:6 MB
    Memory:16 GB
    So, once again, Eric is wrong, confused and not worth the time listening to (or I'll now add, replying to); he's been shown how foolish his text is for all to see on Planet Earth....
     
  36. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/brookecrothers/2016/11/08/new-2016-macbook-pro-sales-defy-criticism-initial-revenue-strong-says-market-researcher/#28d352786194
    2016 MacBook Pro Sales Defy Critics: Tops All New Laptops With Shoppers
    The MacBook Pro made more money in 5 days than most laptops in the whole year, Slice added. “In only 5 days the new MacBook Pro’s sales already equal 78 percent of all the revenue generated by the MacBook 12-inch since it became available in April 2015.”​
    http://fortune.com/2016/11/09/apple-macbook-pro-sales/
    In its first five days of availability, sales of the MacBook Pro nearly quadrupled that of the Microsoft Surface Book over the last year, according to new data from research firm Slice Intelligence. The gap is even wider on other popular computers, including the Asus Chromebook and Dell Inspiron computers.​
    http://bgr.com/2016/11/08/macbook-pro-late-2016/
    The new MacBook Pro is selling much better than you (Eric~**) thought
    Further reinforcing Schiller’s remarks is a report from Asia that says Apple is increasing component orders for the entire Christmas quarter. According to Digitimes, Apple is optimistic about sales in the fourth quarter, and strong shipments are expected to last through the end of the year.​
    **Eric ~ , Nov 12, 2016; 01:27 a.m:
    I can see Christmas now.​
    One has to wonder if you see Christmas more clearly now when such facts are provided. Or the lump of coal coming your way. Probably not.
     
  37. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Please share with us which MBP you ordered, and the reasoning why are inclined to spend so much cash on a slower and less versatile machine than your current 2013 MBP?​
    My MBP is due to arrive today, stay tuned. In the meantime, facts from Planet Earth about the nonsense above about slower speeds, not only based on my 2013 MBP but the last generation! This is a stock configuration.
    http://www.macworld.com/article/3140928/macs/macbook-pro-with-touch-bar-review-the-best-bits-of-ios-in-a-really-great-mac.html
    The 15-inch MacBook Pro with Touch Bar scored 42827 in Geekbench’s OpenCL test when using the AMD Radeon Pro 450 graphics, which is 38.7 percent better than the last gen. This model has 2GB of dedicated graphics memory, but you can upgrade to a Radeon Pro 460 with 4GB of memory for $200. The 15-inch MacBook Pro also contains an Intel HD Graphics 530 chip that can be used to extend battery life during less-intensive tasks.
    Using Cinebench’s OpenGL benchmark to further test the graphics, the 13-inch MacBook Pro achieved 36.8 frames per second, which is 27.5 percent faster than 2015’s entry-level 13-inch MacBook Pro, and 9.4 percent faster than this year’s 13-inch MacBook Pro with function keys. The 15-inch MacBook Pro scored a whopping 70.4 frames per second, which is 13.7 percent faster than the last generation.
    So does this mean the 15-inch Mac is powerful enough for pro video editors, even with a maximum of 16GB of RAM? Probably. There’s a chance Apple will increase the RAM to 32GB next year if it updates the MacBook Pro line to Intel’s next-gen Kaby Lake processors, but even now, one professional video editorwho uses Final Cut Pro finds the MacBook Pro “buttery smooth.” It’s worth noting that the 15-inch MacBook Pro can drive two 5K external displays, plus the 2880x1800 built-in display, and still have ports for two external Thunderbolt RAID arrays.
     
  38. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    So, once again, Eric is wrong, confused and not worth the time listening to​

    Hmm. Odd thing to say when you repeatedly respond with 400 words to my 40.
     
  39. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Hmm. Odd thing to say when you repeatedly respond with 400 words to my 40.​
    About those 40 words from Planet Eric:
    It is better to say nothing and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt. - Abraham Lincoln
    It didn't take 40 words to remove any doubt.
     
  40. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    http://www.powerpage.org/touch-bar-equipped-macbook-pros-sport-new-amd-gpus-can-drive-dual-5k-displays/#more-71052
    Apple apparently dropped a killer GPU into the 2016 Touch Bar-equipped 15-inch MacBook Pro and it shows.
    The company, which switched from Intel’s integrated Iris Pro graphics in favor of dedicated AMD graphics, has opted for AMD’s Polaris-based Radeon Pro 450, Radeon Pro 455, and build-to-order Radeon Pro 460 GPUs in the new 15-inch notebooks. The GPUs support up to six displays, whereas Intel’s integrated GPUs affixed to the logic board can drive a total of three displays.
    The expanded support enables the new MacBook Pro to drive two of Apple and LG’s new UltraFine 5K displays at 60Hz simultaneously. Intel’s GPUs can’t because, due to bandwidth limitations of the DisplayPort 1.2 spec, the two 5K displays technically function as four displays. This method is known as Multi-Stream Transport (MST).
     
  41. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    Dogmatic. The Digital Dog-Matic. Want a logo to go with that?

    I don't know man. They have six computers and only "refreshed" one of them. And did it with Skylake.
    A point of view of another video editor. New Macbook Pro 2016 Review: The Sad Demise of Apple
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDesN2F3Zp4
    That's sound advice. I should have sold off my appl in Oct.
    At least I can plug my Nexus 6P (usb-c) into the new MBP without buying any dongles and adaptors. Cook needs to go.
     
  42. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

  43. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    I don't know man.​
    That much is abundantly clear and true!
     
  44. Dongles? We don't need no stink'n dongles!
     
  45. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    Lol, Barry. Dave's not home!
    Andrew, ouch. Could be the beginning of another round of #GPUGate. Not a good start...
    Graphic card freaks out with brand new MBP 2016 forums.macrumors.com/threads/graphic-card-freaks-out-with-brand-new-mbp-2016.2015545/
    Graphic Card Issue? New 2016 15" BTO forums.macrumors.com/threads/graphic-card-issue-new-2016-15-bto.2015343/
    Senior Apple Advisor admits that MBPs have battery issues forums.macrumors.com/threads/senior-apple-advisor-admits-that-mbps-have-battery-issues.2016044/
     
  46. Eric, that letter the guy wrote about pros not liking it, seemed like the author hadn't actually used what he was writing about. Is that the case? The issue of not having a matt screen is pretty much ancient history. He didn't seem to discuss the retina screen on the MBP at all which is not as reflective as the pre-retina glossy screens. I don't know about the "dongles". I get the complaint about that. But from people who have actually used it, it seems that it is an excellent performer, not slower than a 2012 model, but designed to have increased video performance for video editing. Isn't that because the trend is to move graphic processing more off the cpu and onto the gpu and that is where the machine shines. Its ability to run 2 5k monitors is pretty impressive. I have a 2014 model, and am not near to needing a new one, but if I did right now, I wouldn't hesitate to get one. I'm not a total pro, but I process a fair amount of images and do weddings here and there where I have a good 800-1000 photos to go through and the thing is great.
     
  47. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Barry, it's pointless asking Eric to pose an opinion on something he's got zero experience using. Now if you want advise on infecting all your files, he's got experience there. I've actually got the new MBP; what do you specifically want to know based on actual experience (admittedly only 4 days) not FUD?
     
  48. FWIW, I'm very happy with the 15" Mac Book Pro mid 2015 model. Should be available at discount since there are newer models.
    Even better, if you're wiling to have a desktop, is the 5K iMac. Best display of high res photos and 4K video I've ever seen.
     
  49. I know a few people, not in for photography that have been seriously hacked with some very nasty data encryption hostage programs on windows machines. I don't know if mac is susceptible to that at this time. But a couple of instances were quite serious on more than just an individual dealing with personal pc issues. But yes, when I used windows for my personal pc, I did spend a lot of energy over possible malware, and drivers, etc. Haven't really had that problem with my macs, though still need to be very careful about what you allow to open from the web.
     
  50. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Haven't really had that problem with my macs, though still need to be very careful about what you allow to open from the web.​
    And to the web. Exactly! Practice safe computing. Be careful about clicking on links both in a web browser and from emails with such links. Been running Mac's since 1988, never had a virus, malware or issue but I don't take that for granted.
     
  51. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    I don't know about the "dongles". I get the complaint about that. But from people who have actually used it, it seems that it is an excellent performer, not slower than a 2012 model

    I'm not sure what "excellent" and other subject terms indicate but the 2016 base model is aimed as a MacBook Air replacement. At first the cynics judged it as slower but benchmarks are coming in now that it is on the market. It is indeed slightly faster than the one it's replacing...like 7%. Info and data in the link. And some of the comments are spot on, as well.
    New 13-Inch MacBook Pro Sans Touch Bar is Marginally Faster But More Efficient Than Last Year's Base Model www.macrumors.com/2016/10/31/2016-vs-2015-base-13-inch-mbp-benchmarks/
    I'm not sure why anyone that has an internet connection would buy the 2016 when the 2017 with Rubylake was rumoured long before the 2016 release. Blind faith, a fool and his money is soon parted...

    Have you had to try this, Barry? I have. Closing the lid and powering off your Mac is pointless in terms of security access. Speechless, I can't believe it takes 45 seconds to get into ANY Mac without a password and then have access to all the files. And even issue a new pw.
    Reset Any Mac OS X Password without Administrative Access or Losing Data https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJ6AZMk2cy0

    I know a few people, not in for photography that have been seriously hacked with some very nasty data encryption hostage programs on windows machines. I don't know if mac is susceptible to that at this time. But a couple of instances were quite serious on more than just an individual dealing with personal pc issues. But yes, when I used windows for my personal pc, I did spend a lot of energy over possible malware, and drivers, etc. Haven't really had that problem with my macs, though still need to be very careful about what you allow to open from the web.​

    I don't know any but yes, ransomware is on the rise. From the business and security journals I read that at least half the businesses in England have been held ransom for their files.
    FWIW, I'm very happy with the 15" Mac Book Pro mid 2015 model.​

    I'm very happy with my 13" MBP 2013, Sebastian. It's i7, I bought 16gb of ram and a sumsung pro ssd. It's pretty decent for when out in the field and must resort to using a laptop. But there's no compelling reason to get a 2016 MBP let alone one for "pro" use. The 2017 with Ruby and 64gb of ram that's due out in the summer however...
     
  52. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    At first the cynics judged it as slower but benchmarks are coming in now that it is on the market. It is indeed slightly faster than the one it's replacing...like 7%.​
    Lots of uninformed cynics who should be ignored. Like:
    Eric ~ , Nov 01, 2016; 03:04 a.m.
    Well, what a disappointment the new MBP is. We waited four years and this latest one has a weaker gpu, slower cpu, and slower ram than the one it is replacing...
    Eric ~ , Nov 10, 2016; 05:11 p.m.
    I'd love to update my mid 2013 MBP to a newer cpu, gpu and more than my 16gb of ram. But it isn't possible. Who's going to spend $3500 for a slower machine with less functionality? The armchair Strarbucks photographer?
    Kidding aside though and on a serious note, how about you share with us which MBP you ordered, and the reasoning why are inclined to spend so much cash on a slower and less versatile machine than your current 2013 MBP?
    So yeah, cynics who have no experience producing benchmarks should be ignored. Or cynics who have no experience whatsoever with (fill in the blank).
    Again, if anyone wants some feedback on the new MPB from someone with actual experience (5 days now), do ask.
     
  53. Eric, are we comparing apples to oranges? I'm talking about the 15" MBP not the 13, To me they are 2 different animals. Don't have a clue bout the other stuff you're talking about, but comments to the video seem to suggest this doesn't work in El Capitan or newer (Yosemite), so possibly not relevant to me.
     
  54. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    Barry, we're comparing the 13" to 13" as per my Nov 10, 2016; 05:11 p.m. post. I can't do much about the noise if others have wandered off-topic comparing different sizes while in their typical fanboy fashion attempt to attack the character and not the argument.
    I'd have to spend $3500 (before dongles) on the top of the line MBP and it wont give much a performance bump over my 2013 MBP with i7/16gb/ssd. Furthermore, with sd card readers now going through slower dongles and adaptors on the 2016, and not through the included sd slot like I have, it will be even slower importing 900 raws a day. Wifi on the 13" is half as fast as my 13". Wirless data transfer will be so much fun. So, again, no compelling reason for me and thousands of others to update. The keynote and this 2016 MBP resulted in a synchronised "WTF??" around the creative world. Some big names in here that aren't too tickled with the new direction of Apple.
    New MacBook Pros and the State of the Mac
    mjtsai.com/blog/2016/10/27/new-macbook-pros-and-the-state-of-the-mac/
    One computer out of six gets an update. A 2016 iPhone can't be plugged into a 2016 MBP for charging or data transfer. The wireless earphones for the iphone can't be used on the MBP. Jobs must be rolling in his grave.
     
  55. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    I can't do much about the noise if others have wandered off-topic comparing different sizes while in their typical fanboy fashion attempt to attack the character and not the argument.​
    As is par for the course here, you're confused once again. Both your character and arguments are as usual, ridiculous. Do read the original poster's first comment here about the NEW Mac (and MacBook Pro) he's considering that started all this long before you came here with FUD and misinformation from Planet Eric:
    Jackson Holtz , Oct 12, 2016; 02:07 p.m. Want to upgrade my 8 year old Mac book (13") to a newer machine, at least 15". Considering either Mac Book Pro 15" or iMac 21" -​
    Keep posting silly comments from Planet Eric, it's so amusing to those of us on a fact based, Planet Earth living outside your unreality bubble!
    A 2016 iPhone can't be plugged into a 2016 MBP for charging or data transfer.​
    Sure it can. I've been doing it for a week now.
     
  56. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    Sure it can.​

    How much did your dongle cost?
     
  57. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    Ouch. Can you explain how Planet Eric info jives with these 13 graphs from reliable and objective tech sites? #facetiousquestion
    [​IMG]
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  58. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    How much did your dongle cost?​
    $9 which attaches to a USB hub of which the iPhone and 7 other devices hook up to. Total (so called dongle costs) a massive $27. The more expensive one $16.99 to go DisplayPort to the new Mac. BFD.
    Can you explain how Planet Eric info jives with these 13 graphs from reliable and objective tech sites?​
    Nothing on Planet Eric jives with the MPB I and other's are speaking of compared to the products it replaces! Or to put it more accurately and completely: nothing on Planet Eric jives at all! The only person posting here to doesn't appear to understand that is the sole inhabitant of Planet Eric.
     
  59. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    Those graphs do paint a sad picture of the 2016 in relation to the 2015, eh.
    with the MPB I and other's are speaking of compared to the products it replaces!​
    I and others? Lol. Who are these "others"? The whole internet (except Andrew) is freaking out about the 2016 MBP being so lame and disappointing that you think there's "others"?
     
  60. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    The whole internet (except Andrew) is freaking out about the 2016 MBP being so lame and disappointing that you think there's "others"?​
    The whole internet? Really.
    Only on Planet Eric who's sole inhabitant is immune from facts outside his unreality bubble. On Planet Earth, the facts are available, even here in these threads, concerning the massive sales of the new MBP. Above and below for those outside the Planet Eric unreality existence.

    Demand for Apple’s new MacBook Pro shows no sign of slowing down
    By Yoni Heisler on Nov 22, 2016
    http://bgr.com/2016/11/22/macbook-pro-2016-sales-strong-demand/
    We await more foolish, hilarious, made up generalizations without a lick of fact, based on samplings of the whole internet from your planet Eric.
     
  61. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    Strong demand? Curious, is that a bit more or a bit bit less than "lots and lots"?
    An insightful and honest article on Vox.

    "Less officially, the sheer amount of time that has passed since the last release of a Mac Pro desktop computer has users of high-end workstations convinced that Apple has effectively exited that market as well. Professionals in the market for muscular computers, after all, are almost by definition only going to be interested in buying machines that come with the latest and most up-to-date chips and hardware. A line of “pro” computers that isn’t updated regularly simply doesn’t work as a pro computer at all. Even if Apple does make a new Mac Pro at this point, buyers wary of the possibility of years-long gaps between updates will still find themselves thinking that people in the market for desktop workstations may need to look beyond the Mac.

    The state of Apple’s semi-withdrawal from the professional grade computer market even has some die-hard Mac fans daydreaming about the idea of bringing back operating system licensing so that some other company can put in the time and effort needed to build Mac compatible workstations without Cupertino needing to worry about it.

    Even Apple’s more popular laptop products show some signs of the same kind of neglect. The latest iteration of the MacBook Pro offers a number of impressive features, but it maxes out at a relatively low level of RAM, doesn’t offer many ports, and isn’t equipped with truly top-of-the-line internal chips. The computer is impressive in many ways — certainly the innovative new TouchBar looks cool — but, like most of Apple’s other products, it appears to be optimized for lightness and thinness rather than for true professional use.

    But this all raises a more fundamental question. If GE can build jet engines, tidal energy farms, freight rail data systems, mining equipment, and medical devices, how is it that the world’s most valuable company can’t find the time to make a full line of personal computers and PC peripherals alongside its market-leading smartphones and tablets? The answer goes back to Apple’s corporate structure, which, though fairly common for a startup, is extremely unusual for an enormous company."
    Apple may have finally gotten too big for its unusual corporate structure www.vox.com/new-money/2016/11/27/13706776/apple-functional-divisional
     
  62. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Strong demand? Curious, is that a bit more or a bit bit less than "lots and lots"?​
    What part about the facts:
    Apple already told us that the 2016 MacBook Pro had set a new online sales record
    Or:
    In its first five days of availability, sales of the MacBook Pro nearly quadrupled that of the Microsoft Surface Book over the last year, according to new data from research firm Slice Intelligence. The gap is even wider on other popular computers, including the Asus Chromebook and Dell Inspiron computers.
    ...is so massively confusing for the sole inhabitant of Planet Eric?
    Again, I'm so sorry that facts continue to ruin your life on Planet Eric.
     
  63. ahh 13", sorry bout that. But the I7 duo core of the 13" isn't all that comparable with the I7 quad core of the 15" for performance. That's why I said its apples to oranges. Eric your graphs aren't making sense to me. They constantly are comparing 2015 I7 duo core to 2016 I5 duo core. Again, apples to oranges. Its like that through most of those graphs. I don't think they are saying what you think they are bud.
     
  64. Instead of point counter-point, is there any one out there actually using the 2016 MBP with the dongles and shooting events, or fashion or model shoots or a wedding where you are going to upload and process 500-1000 or more images, have you noticed it slowing your work flow? Im talking about actual users. I've just loaded a good 980 images from a wedding on a 2014 MBP 15" with the SD card slot and it was fine. just a couple-few minutes to bring them into lightroom, and they are 24MP files.
     
  65. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Bring (Import) them into LR how Barry? Just the setting for generation of each previews (Minimal vs. 1:1) would make a difference in the time this takes (although you can begin working just after import).
    I've just loaded a good 980 images from a wedding on a 2014 MBP 15" with the SD card slot and it was fine. just a couple-few minutes to bring them into lightroom, and they are 24MP files.​
    You probably answered your own question then.
     
  66. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    http://www.macworld.com/article/3140928/macs/macbook-pro-with-touch-bar-review-the-best-bits-of-ios-in-a-really-great-mac.html
    MacBook Pro with Touch Bar review: The best bits of iOS in a really great Mac-Nov 14, 2016 5:01 AM PT
    In Geekbench 4.0.1, the 13-inch MacBook Pro with Touch Bar scored 3927 in the single-core 64-bit CPU test, which is 5.3 percent faster than the previous generation’s score, and 4.2 percent faster than the just-released 13-inch 2GHz MacBook Pro with function keys. The 15-inch MacBook Pro scored 4216, which is just 1.5 percent better than 2015’s 15-inch MacBook Pro with 2.5GHz quad-core Core i7 with 16GB of RAM and a discrete AMD Radeon R9 M370X.
    [​IMG]
    Geekbench 4.0.1, single-core CPU test. Longer bars are better. The top three are this year’s Macs, and the bottom three are last year’s. Click to enlarge.
    In the multicore CPU test, the 13-inch MacBook Pro with Touch Bar bested last year’s 13-inch Pro by 7.9 percent, and this year’s function key model by 3.8 percent. The 15-inch MacBook Pro with Touch Bar was was actually edged out by last year’s version in this test.
    [​IMG]
    Geekbench 4.0.1, multicore CPU test. Longer bars are better. The top three are this year’s Macs, and the bottom three are last year’s. Click to enlarge.
    In Geekbench’s OpenCL test, the 13-inch MacBook Pro with Touch Bar scored 30826, using the Intel Iris Graphics 550—that’s 59 percent better than the last generation. The 13-inch MacBook Pro with function keys has Intel Graphics 540, and so this Touch Bar model scored 8.6 percent better.
    The 15-inch MacBook Pro with Touch Bar scored 42827 in Geekbench’s OpenCL test when using the AMD Radeon Pro 450 graphics, which is 38.7 percent better than the last gen. This model has 2GB of dedicated graphics memory, but you can upgrade to a Radeon Pro 460 with 4GB of memory for $200. The 15-inch MacBook Pro also contains an Intel HD Graphics 530 chip that can be used to extend battery life during less-intensive tasks.
    [​IMG]
    Geekbench 4.0.1, OpenCL benchmark. Longer bars are better. The top three are this year’s Macs, and the bottom three are last year’s. Click to enlarge.
    Using Cinebench’s OpenGL benchmark to further test the graphics, the 13-inch MacBook Pro achieved 36.8 frames per second, which is 27.5 percent faster than 2015’s entry-level 13-inch MacBook Pro, and 9.4 percent faster than this year’s 13-inch MacBook Pro with function keys. The 15-inch MacBook Pro scored a whopping 70.4 frames per second, which is 13.7 percent faster than the last generation.
    [​IMG]
    Cinebench R15, OpenGL test. Longer bars are better. The top three are this year’s Macs, and the bottom three are last year’s. Click to enlarge.
    So does this mean the 15-inch Mac is powerful enough for pro video editors, even with a maximum of 16GB of RAM? Probably. There’s a chance Apple will increase the RAM to 32GB next year if it updates the MacBook Pro line to Intel’s next-gen Kaby Lake processors, but even now, one professional video editor who uses Final Cut Pro finds the MacBook Pro “buttery smooth.” It’s worth noting that the 15-inch MacBook Pro can drive two 5K external displays, plus the 2880x1800 built-in display, and still have ports for two external Thunderbolt RAID arrays.
     
  67. Also worth noting is that SSD throughput in the 2016 MBPs is significantly faster.
     
  68. Sorry Andrew, I was talking about on my 2014 MBP not a new one. Was just wondering since people seem to be making an issue of the speed effect of using dongles or add-ons in order to use upload data. I'm not sure there are any. but was just wondering if anyone actually using a 2016 model noticed a slow down.
     
  69. Bottom line, is my MBP 15" 2014 is a workhorse for me. It handles many things at once without a hicup. It handles all the photos I throw at it, and has even been a very good tool for cutting excerpts from depositions and editing in FCPX. I take it to work, and at home I connect to a 27" monitor and its great. I would think the new version would be at least as good. The TB ports are really awesome and ultimately a step up in connectivity speeds. a dongle is a bit of hassle to enable use of common USB devices, especially thumb drives and your phone. but not a big deal.
     
  70. Barry... USB C to USB A adapters are tiny, inline (i.e. no cable stub), inexpensive at two for $8, and will not affect performance.

    Apple is pushing the USB-C/TB future forward, faster. Frankly I would have been very surprised and disappointed if Apple had included a legacy (almost 20 years old) USB-A port on the 2016 MBP. That would never have happened at this point. The peripheral industry will quickly adapt.

    The 2016 MBP can drive LG's new 5K display directly. With display data, display control settings, audio from the MBP to
    the display's speakers, display web camera video to the MBP, and MBP battery charging from the display, all over a *single* cable. And the
    display has three additional TB ports on the back. That's the future.
     
  71. I am using a MacBook Pro of three years ago. It has plenty of pep for running Lightroom and Photoshop on today's 24MPx images and 4K video.
    But, my favorite environment for photography is the 5K iMac.
     
  72. Yes Brad. Thanks. sounds good. I think the fact that there are 4 USB C ports is massive. My understanding is that the new MBP will support 2 5k displays and 4 4k displays if that is what one is into. That's a lot of GPU power for a notebook. Generally the MBP are on the cutting edge of upcoming Mac tech and we will see similar upgrades to the iMac. If I needed a new computer I wouldn't hesitate though my current one is great for now, like I said, a work horse. I'll probably hold out for another year or 2. due to budget.
     
  73. Following this discussion with some interest. Like Barry I work on a MacBookPro 15-inch (2013) which fully fulfills my needs when it comes to photography and I will keep it for some years on, until, maybe, you guys can agree on something.
    However, as I don't have other Apple products (Iphone, Ipad etc), I wonder whether future MacBokPro's are intended for users like me. I have the impression, not !
     
  74. . . .until, maybe, you guys can agree on something.​
    That is a good one Anders :)
    But sure, you will have increased capability for monitor/s fast external storage and depending on what else you do. Hooking up source video, your digital photo media from your camera, recording equipment that allows decent and clean A to D conversion, etc. I'm not sure what the other Apple products really make a difference. If you are talking about Android and other win based systems, you can put windows on your mac and have use of both. You can do that now.
     
  75. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    In Geekbench 4.0.1, the 13-inch MacBook Pro with Touch Bar scored 3927 in the single-core 64-bit CPU test, which is 5.3 percent faster than the previous generation’s score, and 4.2 percent faster than the just-released 13-inch 2GHz MacBook Pro with function keys. The 15-inch MacBook Pro scored 4216, which is just 1.5 percent better than 2015’s 15-inch MacBook Pro with 2.5GHz quad-core Core i7 with 16GB of RAM and a discrete AMD Radeon R9 M370X. - Andrew​
    Lol. So for $4200, the 2016 is "5.3 percent, 4.2 percent faster, 1.5 percent better" than the older models that people are dying to have replaced? And you're baffled why the interent is freaking out on Apple over the 2016. You can find a Skylake Dell xps laptop that is two years old with the same specs on Craigslist for $800...Windows is getting a lot great press lately and $2200 buys a 32 gb Kaby i7...
    Like Barry I work on a MacBookPro 15-inch (2013) which fully fulfills my needs when it comes to photography and I will keep it for some years on, until, maybe, you guys can agree on something.
    However, as I don't have other Apple products (Iphone, Ipad etc), I wonder whether future MacBokPro's are intended for users like me. I have the impression, not ! - Anders​

    My 2013 i7 16gb ssd MBP will have to do as well, Anders. Besides, it's only a few slower that the 2016. I have a feeling there is going to be some buyers remorse with those that bought the 2016 MBP when in eight months Kaby Lake with 32gb of ram is released for the same amount of money :)
    Was just wondering since people seem to be making an issue of the speed effect of using dongles or add-ons in order to use upload data. I'm not sure there are any. but was just wondering if anyone actually using a 2016 model noticed a slow down. - Barry​

    Barry, what a great idea! Andrew can test for us! He can import 1000 raws, if he still has a camera, onto both of his machines with a stop watch and report back with the time difference. When could you do this for us, Andrew?
     
  76. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    "5.3 percent, 4.2 percent faster, 1.5 percent better"

    Hilarious. All the name calling and arguing and in the end you
    post data supporting my sentiments. This is two threads in a
    row now! Oh Andrew...
     
  77. I think Brad answered the question re dongles.
     
  78. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    When could you do this for us, Andrew?​
    What part of the English text from this planet above do you not understand (again) Eric? Do try to read the text before an onslaught of more textual diarrhea from Planet Eric if you can:
    Andrew Rodney[​IMG][​IMG], Nov 29, 2016; 10:36 a.m.
    Bring (Import) them into LR how Barry? Just the setting for generation of each previews (Minimal vs. 1:1) would make a difference in the time this takes (although you can begin working just after import).​
    Seems on Planet Eric, English comprehension is also lacking behind the reality bubble.
     
  79. To answer Andrew's question re import I import them embedded and side cart, though maybe I will take a look. I like the metadata that comes in, its sometimes helpful and its whatever the default size. It really doesn't take long.
     
  80. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    Andrew can test for us! He can import 1000 raws, if he still has a camera, onto both of his machines with a stop watch and report back with the time difference. When could you do this for us, Andrew?​

    It's an easy test to do, right? Unless there's some reason you don't want to share with us :)

    As well Andrew, on both your 2013 and 2016 machines, make a folder on the desktop and drag the 1000 raws from sd card to the desktop folder while timing it. I'm wondering if the 2016 (even with the faster m.2 ssd) is actually faster getting the files from sd card to the harddrive than the non-dongled 2013 with built in card reader.

    Barry, the Walker Evans "Depth of Field" show is here! Wow, 200+ images....it was too much actually, stimulus overload. I guess you've seen it but it's rare something like this makes it up here.
     
  81. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    Hmm. Sound like anyone we know? :)
    "The study is detailed in a paper called, Predicting smartphone operating system from personality and individual differences, from psychology researchers at the University of Lincoln, Lancaster University, and the University of Hertfordshire.
    They went looking for differences between iPhone and Android owners in honesty-humility, emotionality, extraversion, agreeableness, conscientiousness, openness, and whether people preferred to be unique, and whether they viewed their phone as a status symbol.
    "In comparison to Android users, we found that iPhone owners are more likely to be female, younger, and increasingly concerned about their smartphone being viewed as a status object," they write.
    That would seem to confirm the view that iPhone owners are anxious about appearances and willing to pay through the nose to satisfy their insecurities.
    But if the findings really are generally applicable in the real world, job hunters might want to think twice before whipping out an iPhone at an interview for a service role or one where they'd be handling cash.
    "Key differences in personality were also observed, with iPhone users displaying lower levels of honesty-humility and higher levels of emotionality," the researchers add."
    "Are iPhone owners really less honest than Android users? That's what this study says" www.zdnet.com/article/are-iphone-owners-really-less-honest-than-android-users-thats-what-this-study-says/
     
  82. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    It's an easy test to do, right?​
    All tests are easy once the parameters have been set. I've asked twice about specific parameters required to run the test specifically in LR (as requested) and have not received the answers indicating some here suggest they use and know LR but really don't understand how it works importing images or how the parameters one can set affect the outcome of testing.
     
  83. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    I knew it. Andrew, it's simple, we just want to know if the card reader via dongle increases or decreases the time of file transfers compared to your older machine with a built in reader. Do you need me to buy you a card reader and have Amazon deliver it to you? Or is there another reason why you are being so difficult and avoiding this simple test with us? There's lots and lots of new owners with 2016 MBPs that are plagued with gpu problems, is yours one of them?
    Anyway, I'm sure it's within your skill set to import 1000 raws and set up the "parameters" on both machines in an identical manner and report back with your findings. Easier yet, just make a folder on the desktop and drag the 1000 raws from sd card to the desktop folder while timing it. I'm wondering if the 2016 (even with the faster m.2 ssd) is actually faster getting the files from sd card to the harddrive than the non-dongled 2013 with built in card reader. I look forward to your next post!
     
  84. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    That isn't importing in LR as requested FWIW!
     
  85. No, Eric, Haven't seen it! I hope it comes to So Cal would love to see it!
     
  86. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    That sure is taking a long time, Andrew. What's the hold up in comparing these simple tasks with both of your machines?
    Barry, check it out! https://www.vanartgallery.bc.ca/the_exhibitions/exhibit_evans.html
     
  87. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    That sure is taking a long time, Andrew. What's the hold up in comparing these simple tasks with both of your machines?​
    You in a hurry to look foolish again Eric? Seems that way.
    Facts from Planet Earth and the time it takes to copy the DCIM folder containing 17 Canon 5DMII files 470MB):
    2013 Macbook Pro: 6 seconds
    2016 Macbook Pro: 5 seconds.
    So yeah, the new MacBook is faster and you look foolish once again. Extrapolate with more images, bigger images. The 2016 MBP is faster in this task. And so many others.
    Want to look even more foolish from Planet Eric? Seems you always do. Ask about the differences rendering video's from ScreenFlow or building ICC Profiles or manipulation from other processes that are vastly faster on the new MacBook Pro than the other one!

    If you had a lick of sense or experience in the use of these products, as I do, you'd cease from asking really foolish questions by now. But you can't help yourself, can you?
     
  88. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    I'm not sure why you're avoiding a simple test? Five and six seconds with seventeen files? That's a benchmark we can all believe! You were asked to do a thousand files for a good reason. Why didn't you do a thousand 1000 files? Or, maybe you did and...
    What card reader did you use? Imight have to ask Santa for one.
    are vastly faster

    "Vastly". Like "5.3 percent, 4.2 percent faster, 1.5 percent better"? That's vastly worth $4200 and $300 in dongles...
    A thousand files. With your experience and youtube channel, it'd be easy to watch your experiment too?
     
  89. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Outside the Planet Eric unreality bubble, the facts are the facts: the new MacBook was faster than the older one.
    $300 in dongles...​
    We've been over that: less than $30. More facts outside your inability to accept reality.
     
  90. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    I was hoping you'd do 1000 files and do Lr tests...oh well, tried
    my best.

    (Even before it was released to public a few weeks ago, we knew the 2016 SHOULD BE faster with a usb-c card reader connected to that pcie
    ssd, Andrew. It's crazy fast compared to your old sata. I work in
    the film industry, Planet Hollywood, and surrounded by DOP's,
    DIT's, viz fx, SPFX, sound dept, art dept, construction, legal, and other still photogs.)
     
  91. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    I work in the film industry, Planet Hollywood, and surrounded by DOP's, DIT's, viz fx, SPFX, sound dept, art dept, construction, legal, and other still photogs.)​
    http://nofilmschool.com/2016/10/new-macbook-pro
    http://www.macworld.co.uk/feature/mac/best-mac-for-video-editing-which-is-best-mac-for-video-editing-update-3449141/
    Best Mac for video editing: Best video-editing Mac for portability...
    ...is the new MacBook Pro
     
  92. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    That's kinda funny....suggesting a MBP doing video editing in Hollywood...
    Unsure why you keep bringing up video in this thread as some sort of validation for Lr and Ps performance? The slight performance improvements that some FCPX users are experiencing has nothing to do with Lr and Ps performance. Conversely, Lr and Ps users are actually reporting going slower on their spanking new 2016 than their 2013 MBP and is why we're curious on your Lr results, Andrew. Are we going to get them, or not?
    What memory card (speed) and card reader did you use for your six second test?
     
  93. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    I was hoping you'd do 1000 files and do Lr tests...oh well, tried my best.​
    Good example of 'your best' for others here to witnesses.
    Wasting time and providing misinformation is your M.O. from your Planet Eric. Facts are simple; the test I did was faster on the new MBP as has every function I've thrown at the new product since I got it. Those are facts based on knowledge using the product you have zero experience with while predicting all the FUD!

    "Those who have knowledge, don't predict. Those who predict, don't have knowledge".-Lao Tzu
     
  94. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    Planet Eric. I like that. I like it so much in fact, that I bought the domain name. http://PlanetEric.ca
    17 raws...five seconds and six seconds...What would you think if you're someone google researching the 2016 MBP and landed on this page and read this test result performed by a self-proclaimed expert?
    We want a 1000 raw files because of the sustained work load it puts on the machine. A 1000 raws is a real-world number for pros that want a pro machine and might be considering the 2016. You've come back with 17. I don't even know a soccer parent that comes home with 17. And instead, you've spent more time and energy returning here with insults than actually proving your new $4200 MBP is faster in Lr than your 2013. I'm suspicious. You claim to have both laptops, own a camera, and have a Lightroom subscription. I assume the digital dog able to configure Lr on both machines in the same manner. You spend enough time arguing on the Adobe, DpReview, and PN forums so it can't be a lack of time. So, what's the problem?
     
  95. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    We want a 1000 raw files because of the sustained work load it puts on the machine. A 1000 raws is a real-world number for pros that want a pro machine and might be considering the 2016. You've come back with 17.​
    1000 raws is a number you alone pulled out of your rear end and is meaningless. The facts remain the same: 17 raws were measurably faster on the newer machine than the older machine, just like every function I've used since I got the new MBP. It's faster. On this planet.
    I'm very sorry again that the reality and facts continue to ruin your empty life on Eric World.
     
  96. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

  97. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    Planet Earth, like the one that uses MBP's to edit video on Planet Hollywood?
    17 raws were measurably faster on the newer machine than the older machine, just like every function I've used since I got the new MBP.

    1.3% quicker? Is the 2016 MBP so embarssingly slow that you wont publish your results?
    Glad we can get the straight goods from Dig Lloyd.
    2016 MacBook Pro: Adobe Lightroom Import RAW Files with 1:1 Previews
    "This test is as real world as it gets and for a very large number of users: importing digital camera RAW files into Adobe Photoshop Lightroom. How does a 3-year-old 2013 MacBook Pro beat out the fastest possible build of the 2016 MacBook Pro*? These tests were (tediously) repeated three times for each machine**, with the best result from each shown (consistency was strong). The explanation is that 2016 MacBook Pro performance declines with sustained usage. It is pathetic that the 2016 MacBook Pro runs at 2.9 GHz and with a 4.5X faster SSD, and the 2013 model runs at 2.6 GHz and yet the 2013 MacBook Pro wins." https://macperformanceguide.com/MacBookPro2016-LightroomImport.html
    2016 MacBook Pro: diglloyd Adobe Photoshop Benchmarks
    "The 2016 model is slower than the 2013 model! Indeed, the 2015 model (not available for testing) stands a good chance of beating the 2016 model too. These results were triple-checked: the 2013 model is faster. Possibly it is GPU related and some update will improve matters, but that is wild speculation. After waiting 3 years and spending about $4800 (with AppleCare) for the 2016 MBP, this is hardly a compelling argument for upgrading to the 2016 MacBook Pro, which as tested here is the maxed-out fastest possible variant."
    https://macperformanceguide.com/MacBookPro2016-diglloydBenchmarks.html
    2016 MacBook Pro TESTED: Photoshop Performance on Real World Job 'Create Size Variants'
    "Today another Photoshop test, and one that Lloyd does day in and day out for generating lens rendering aperture series shows a smidgen better performance for the 2016 MacBook Pro, effectively no gain at all. This test is as real world as it gets, at least for Lloyd’s photographic work. This particular job was one performed only a few days prior for this lens comparison, repeated here on all four test machines. 2016 MacBook Pro: Photoshop Create Size Variants Here, the 2016 MacBook Pro ekes out a 2.7% win over the 2013 MacBook Pro. But in one run it turned in a slower time, and its performance is oddly variable in all the tests, suggesting some kind of power management behavior that degrades performance at times."
    https://macperformanceguide.com/blog/2016/20161122_1906-Apple2016MacBookPro-Photoshop-CreateSizeVariants.html
     
  98. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    1.3% quicker? Is the 2016 MBP so embarssingly slow that you wont publish your results?​
    I did publish my results and the new MPB was faster than the old one. Again, I'm so very sorry the facts and reality on this end continue to confuse and upset you. Didn't help your exposure issues either (another reality issue outside your reality bubble).
    I'm absolutely thrilled with the new product in terms of it's speed, size, weight and display. ZERO buyers remorse. That from actual experience using the damn thing daily the last three weeks. Something you severely lack (experience, a reality of facts and the ability to move on in a thread that just makes you look foolish).
    Oh and no viruses affecting all my images and files on this planet either. An experience of yours I never hope to experience.
     
  99. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    Again, I'm so very sorry the facts and reality on this end...​

    "reality on this end" can't be verified and your blind faith fanboy-ism has time and time again shown Andrew has a different experience than everyone else. Lots and lots of links and graphs from Eric. From Andrew? Nil. It's very strange you wont do this simple Lr test that anyone is capable of, why? After 13 years on PN with you, one would think you'd gladly spend half an hour with a stopwatch and do this little Lr import exercise on your two MBP's. Something is amiss...Did your 2016 MBP go back to Apple because to all the GPU problems that the 460 is having? Do you even own a 2016 MBP?

    FStoppers published a post yesterday for over-heating MBP's. You might find it useful Andrew and put your $4800 MBP on an egg crate! (This is so funny, I couldn't even script this into a short film if I wanted to.)

    "To improve its weak ventilation, place the laptop on something that lets the air flow below the computer. Something as simple as an egg tray can do the trick"
    5 Tricks to Keep Your MacBook From Overheating https://fstoppers.com/education/5-tricks-keep-your-macbook-overheating-156932
     
  100. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Unnecessary on this end! It runs just fine and dandy and fast and I love it. Best MacBook I've ever owned (and I've owned dozens dating back to the original). Without any virus issues or over heating issues.
    You don't want one or like it, don't buy one! Simple as that. Otherwise, there's no reason to continue debating about a product YOU have zero experience with that you'll never buy while I've got weeks of experience and love the purchase. If that' reality check doesn't cut it for you on Planet Eric, I guess you should just piss-off! Rant about other topics you love to provide FUD about, this one is tired and everyone else has left your planet and your unreality bubble which I plan to now do as well.
    Your time would be better spent examining your sever problems exposing images on your new web site!
     
  101. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    That from actual experience using the damn thing daily the last three weeks.​

    I wish we could take your word for it. Perhaps use your YouTube channel to satisfy us?

    Oh and no viruses affecting all my images and files on this planet either. An experience of yours I never hope to experience.​

    The trouble with successful malware is that you don't even know you have it. Safari is the easiest browser to compromise so I try to practice safe surfing habits and avoid clicking on links provided by strangers in internet threads
     
  102. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    I wish we could take your word for it.​
    Please, don't take my word for it Eric and you'll be consistent in ignoring facts and actual experiences from knowledgeable people who know far, far more about this (and other) subjects than you do. That's what forum trolls can't help themselves from doing as we've seen here over and over again in this pointless thread that it seems everyone else has intelligently ignored (as I will now do myself). You're a vortex of CWOBaT (colossal waste of bandwidth and time).

    Any fool can criticize, condemn, and complain -- and most fools do. -Dale Carnegie
    The trouble with successful malware is that you don't even know you have it.​
    More FUD and hogwash. There's app's for that issue (which it appears you are once again ignorant about).

    What none of us should ignore and forget is the one fellow here who can't stop posting FUD by his own admission infected all his images/files and backups on the planet of his own creation. We should be listening to that guy give advise on computers he's never used from his distant planet of unreality? Seems others are ignoring the rants and FUD from that source. That's smart!
     
  103. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    (do we have over 100 responses yet?)
    FUD. I had to look that up. Seems only retired people use it. Anyways, can't be FUD as I've provided links and graphs from all over the internet that counter your claims. That's all you have provided us with is your own typed words on this thread. Here's a couple more links with data that counter your claims. It's no wonder you wont do this little Lr test.
    diglloyd 2016 MacBook Pro TESTED: Lightroom Import RAW Files "Disappointing on two counts: the 2016 MacBook pro and Adobe’s algorithms. 2016 MacBook Pro: Adobe Lightroom Import RAW Files with 1:1 Previews Between the minimal or negative improvements with Photoshop and this inferior performance with Lightroom, the 2016 MacBook Pro surely deserves being sent back to its maker." https://macperformanceguide.com/blog/2016/20161201_1214-Apple2016MacBookPro-LightroomImport.html
    2016 MacBook Pro TESTED: Photoshop Performance "I am seriously doubting that spending close to $4800 (with AppleCare and tax) on a top-flight 2016 MacBook Pro makes any sense at all. My original premise was that (a) I needed Thunderbolt 3 for testing (still true), and (b) that there would be real world gains for the things I do in Photoshop. The latter premise is proven false, making me seriously consider returning the 2016 MacBook Pro and sticking with my 2013 MacBook Pro Retina, which still performs like a champ and has none of the port hassles." https://macperformanceguide.com/blog/2016/20161121_2138-Apple2016MacBookPro-Photoshop.html
     
  104. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    Crosspost (because some folks are so foolish, they need their noses rubbed into reality)
    It is always my pleasure to go out of my way to make you look the fool. Someone with not much experience but with a massive opinion with no basis in fact. As such, here are some real world speed results:
    Import 122 CR2's from a Canon 5DMII.

    NEW 2016 MacBook Pro: 3 minutes, 11 seconds
    OLD 2013 MacBook Pro: 4 minutes 27 seconds.
    Import and convert to DNG, create standard Previews.
    16GB 400X card using USB 3 card reader.
    On Planet Earth, not Planet Eric, the new MBP is faster at this task!
    Now from Planet Eric, we'll be told some utter rubbish about not using enough images for import, something about how could I be only using a 16GB card or what an armchair photographer I am for shooting on a 5DMII or how the tests are invalid because I also converted to DNG etc, etc, etc. The sole inhabitant on Planet Eric is a fool! He posts FUD. He has so little experience in telling us about a MPB he's never used, or recommending displays he's never seen, or telling us about how we should protect and back up our files when he's the victim of computer virus. He'll tell us how I am an armchair photographer when the FACT is, I've got far more experience at that profession than he does (we can go there if you want facts to embarrass you further Eric, I'm armed and ready).
    Do you ever get the feeling prior to posting here that what you're writing isn't utterly foolish? What a sad, confused, opinionated by fact less reality you must be living; I almost, almost feel sorry for you.
     
  105. EricM

    EricM Planet Eric

    Congratulations! But why did it take weeks to do this little test? Is this how long it took Apple to replace your first 2016?
     
  106. digitaldog

    digitaldog Andrew Rodney

    More foolish text from your unreality bubble! It's of course the same MPB I received; no replacement, no need for one. And it's still faster than the old MBP, a fact you can't fathom.
    So know you look foolish in two posts here (again, as usual).
    The length of time between your silly request and the test today doesn't change the facts or your foolish ideas about a product you have zero experience using. I really hope no one here takes you seriously based on your ridiculous text and ideas that have no basis in fact, have no merit!
    Do get in the last foolish word in this silly set of posts and do keep in mind it's a paper trail that will be very useful in the future, pointing back to your silly fiction of ideas solely formed in your unreality bubble. Or don't post and hone your snapshots. Better use of everyone's time....
     

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