Videographer stealing images

<p>We shot an outdoor wedding last July that had a videographer also. During the reception he set up a projector and screen and we thought he was going to show the video. In fact he had been standing behind me shooting stills with his camera and put together a slide show. Interesting enough, the images he showed were shot over my shoulder and these are the images that were going to be in the bride’s book. Not wanting to cause trouble at the wedding, I waited till we were both leaving and confronted him. He stated that what he did was not wrong because you can’t copyright ideas and the poses were in public so anyone could have shot them. Now they are showing up on his website. Do I have any recourse?</p>

<p>None. He didn't steal any images, he used the images that he shot with his own camera.<br>

If you'll allow me to be blunt, there are two things "wrong" with what you've recounted here:</p>

<ol>

<li>You didn't talk to, and coordinate with, the videographer prior to everything starting.</li>

<li>If you're the "official" photographer, then you need to think of it being your set and you didn't control your set.</li>

</ol>

<p>By controlling the set, I don't mean that you don't let anyone else shoot. That's a great way to get a terrible reputation. I always stop people from shooting over my shoulder because it's a distraction to me and the couple, who have paid a lot of money for my services, deserve the best possible images.<br /><br /><br>

Instead, I tell everyone that, if they let me get the 'official' picture first once I have lined everyone up, then I will step aside and everyone can rush in and take their own picture.<br>

As for the tone and attitude of the videographer, I can't comment because I don't know the tone of voice you used or your exact words.<br>

HOWEVER, I will say that I personally find it tacky and unprofessional to have shown the images during the reception. He was the videographer and I think he crossed the line there (assuming that it wasn't part of the agreement/contract he had with the couple).<br>

AND, I commend you for not adding drama during the day. That was the professional move and too many photographers don't think about it.<br>

Let me sum it up this way: in the long run, this was just one wedding. Were the bride and groom happy with the results? If so, fantastic. It's a lesson learned in dealing with other vendors.</p>

<p>For future weddings, you might want to consider adding something like this in your contract, and make sure you go over it with the couple <br>

"Exclusive Photographer<br>

Couple agrees that Photographer shall be the exclusive photographer at the Wedding. No other paid photographer or photography team are permitted to photograph the Wedding. While family and friends are welcome to take photographs, Photographer shall have the sole authority to direct formal group photographs and posed photographs. Please ask family members and friends to refrain from blocking shooting lanes or ceremony aisles."</p>

<p>That clause is in my contract. I did not see him as I was concentrration on the job at hand. ANd the bride had used his images on her Facebook page. He was also he brides uncle, but he is a prfessionals. Did this for free. I ahev no proble with people shooting and if I see someone doing it, I do ask to be allowd to do what we do and then give them time. BUt for him to show them at the reception, pleople thought I shot them. I had a few comment on the images doirect to me</p>

<p>Life is never perfect. Writing up into contract will not prevent guests, or other photographers from shooting, at any time they seem pleased, paid or for free... it does not matter.</p>

<p>You cannot police a wedding, just must live with it. </p>

<p> </p>

<p>If he isn't stealing the images that you took with your camera, there really isn't much you can do other than let it go.</p>

I agree with the some of the above posts. You do have rights, if your contract is written well. If not, I totally agree with the above posts.

 

I don't want to sound as though I am OK with the video guy doing this. You have to have something in your contract mainly because this will happen again and again, perhaps with this video guy or even a guest blasting pic's over your shoulder or next to you. You MUST have complete control of your wedding or future people will be stepping all over your comfort zone.

 

My contract was written by an attorney.

 

"No other photographer, professional or amateur, can take photo's while the photographer is working." "The photographer has the right to leave if another photographer, professional or amateur is photographing while you are working." The key words are - while you are working. Such as the formals.

 

It's up to you to approach the bride and or the groom of this situation. It's happened to me. I simply tell the bride and or the groom that there photo's may not look very good because their eyes won't know what camera to look at and they will most likely be blinking and be distracted. It's worked every time I've had this situation, which has only been a few times. I first ask the people to not take any photo's until I'm finished. If they continue I will again ask them to stop because the B&G won't know what camera to look at. If they still continue well this is when you sadly have to talk to the B&G. You simply walk up to the B&G and softly express your concerns and you can't promise quality professional work is this situation. Trust me, the bride and groom paid you to be the main shooter. If you fail to say anything well it's your fault, not the video guy or any other people taking pics.

 

This is also what you need to do. Take a picture of the video guy or other photographers getting in your way; with their cameras. It's for 2 reasons. The first reason is if the B&G complain about the quality, well you have a photo of the person thats in your way. If it happens to go to court well you show the judge the person causing the problem. If you've talked to the B&G and they refuse to do anything well you can walk out. This hasn't ever happened to me and I'm not recommending you to ever do this.

 

Don't yell at the video guy or a guest, let the B&G aware of this issue and they will always tell the people to stop.

 

This is your dagger against the B&G if they don't say anything and if they don't like the photo's.

 

I repeat - they paid you to be the photographer. You must have complete control when you are shooting.

 

Well you can't do anything now so let it go. It's just something that you learn from.

 

Hope this helps.

<blockquote>

<p>For future weddings, you might want to consider adding something like this in your contract, and make sure you go over it with the couple<br>

<br /> "Exclusive Photographer<br /> Couple agrees that Photographer shall be the exclusive photographer at the Wedding. No other paid photographer or photography team are permitted to photograph the Wedding. While family and friends are welcome to take photographs, Photographer shall have the sole authority to direct formal group photographs and posed photographs. Please ask family members and friends to refrain from blocking shooting lanes or ceremony aisles."</p>

</blockquote>

<p>What language do you suggest to use for the remedy when this provision is ignored?</p>

I'm not trying to be abrasive about this, but this job is done. Move on to your new stuff and don't waste any good energy

on this nonsense. JMO.

<p>He probably crossed the line by doing this, but realistically what can or should you do about it? </p>

<p>The situation is further complicated by the fact that he is the uncle of the bride - which means she is going to take his side no matter what you say or do. </p>

<p>The best answer is to learn from this for the next wedding. Talk to the video person beforehand and understand what they are planning and coordinate it with them. If they say "Hey, I'm planning on doing stills and a slideshow at the reception" then you can nip it in the bud, or work with them to use your poses and photos. </p>

<p>If you really don't want someone else using your poses - then the time to announce that is BEFORE they do it. Not after. Once they take a photo - they own the copyright, not you. I've found it highly effective to have my strobes "malfunction" when someone refuses to cooperate with my rules. (It's amazing that people don't realize what a pocket wizard is and how it works) I've perfected the "gee, I'm sorry - I don't know why the strobes keep going off like that" look. </p>

<p>Dave</p>

 

<p>Slightly different situation but still related... I shot a wedding recently where many of the bride's family was moving around during the ceremony to take their own pictures. It was annoying for me as the paid photographer but the families didn't mind it. As the B&G were kissing, one of the "Uncle Bob's" stepped right in front of me and blocked my shot. I'm pretty tall at 6'3" so I captured an image that was mostly obstructed by this man's balded head. I showed the B&G later on in the day and explained that we would need to reshoot the kiss... something I've never had to do.<br>

<br />Lesson learned - I will show that picture to ALL future B&G's during their consultations and insist that I will not shoot if there are any Uncle Bob's walking around. <br>

<br />Take what you've experienced and learn from it. Best of luck!!</p>

<p>Poses aren't proprietary. I mean, you learned them from somebody right? or did you actually create them? If so, protecting your intellectual property is your responsibility, ahead of time, since, as the videographer points out, you are setting them in public. While shooting over the shoulder <em>is</em> extremely distracting, both to you and your subjects, unless you are willing to 'accidentally' elbow him in the neck or gut or nuts with your camera (an effective choice, especially with a good sized fast zoom attached). You can be like "Oh! my bad! what the heck were you <em>thinking</em> sneaking up on me like that! I'm <em>working</em> here!"</p>

<p>David's solution is maybe a bit more elegant ;-)</p>

<p>In fairness too, he is adding something to the B&G's experience that you weren't a) prepared to, or b) unwilling to. That 'snapshot slide show' thing is popular, and not something that I offer. some B&Gs like it though... And he's providing it.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>" <em>that I will not shoot if there are any Uncle Bob's walking around.</em> " -- that is highly impractical, and innovative way to kill your wedding photography business.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>Frank - Allow me to amend that. I mean during the ceremony. Of course there will always be guests snapping photos through any wedding day. The ceremony, however is mine alone to wander around without obstructions. Of course there will be the occasional guest that may stand up to get his/her shot and I'm okay with that but I would prefer not to shoot in that situation again. Its now in my contract. Wedding photography is a small sector of my business - my specialties are commercial photography and videography so I am choosy with my clients. Typically, I like to shoot ~12 weddings a year.</p>

<p> </p>