The perfect long-lens, portrait compact: Sigma DP3, or . . .

<p>I recently bought a fixed-lens APS-C compact, a Nikon Coolpix A, and I love it! Its stellar picture quality and spot-on matrix metering was just what I needed for fast, no-time-to-think grab shots. With its 28mm-equivalent, fixed lens, it's great for 90% of what I like to shoot. Now, I'd like to replace what I've been using as my long-lens "compact" camera (a Nikon D7000 plus a Tokina 50-135mm f/2.8), with something <em>truly</em> compact.</p>

<p>The Sigma DP3, with its 75mm-equivalent fixed lens fits the bill, however its universally reported ultra-slow performance is giving me pause. This "long-lens compact" purchase won't be for slow, studied photography, it'll be for quick grab shots, when I have only a moment to shoot. Ideally, I'd like this <em>second</em> compact to be paired with a prime lens in the 85mm-150mm range (full-frame equivalent), with a maximum aperture of f/1.8 or better. Here are the candidates:</p>

<p>Sigma DP3 w/50mm f/2.8 fixed-lens ($899); APS-C; 75mm-equivalent.<br /> Fuji XE-2 ($999) + 56mm f/1.2 ($999); APS-C; 85mm-equivalent.<br /> Sony Alpha 5000 ($498) + 50mm f/1.8 ($298); APS-C; 75mm-equivalent.<br /> Sony A7 ($1,698) + 55mm f/1.8 ($998); full-frame; 55mm.<br /> Olympus E-P5 ($799) + 75mm f/1.8 ($999); micro-4/3rds; 150mm-equivalent.</p>

<p>[Note: Rokinon 85mm f/1.4 ($299) may be paired with most other APS-C ILCs.]</p>

<p>Here's what I think about doing for something more compact: trade a D7000 for a D3300. But in your case, I think the 50-135 lacks a focusing motor.</p>

<p>The answer depends on how long you want the lens to be and how important low light performance and a shallow DOF are for you.</p>

<p>Would also consider the Olympus 45/1.8 on a suitable Olympus micro 4/3 body.</p>

Pick up a NEX-5n, which is cheap, an adapter and a Minolta 58mm f/1.4, which is $50 in perfect condition. Probably you

can get the whole thing done for under $350 and you don't have to spend $900 on a Sigma with the slowest 50mm on the

market.

<p>Thanks for the suggestions, guys! Of course I would kill for the Fuji XE-2/56mm f/1.2 combo, but that's a little steep. The Sony NEX is still a strong contender since the bodies are reasonably priced. A while back, I was considering the budget-priced Sony NEX C3, which has a surprisingly respectable DxO ISO score of 1083 (which bests even its successor, the NEX 3N, which has a DxO low-light score of 1067). The NEX C3 is no longer available, but it appears the NEX 3N is still being sold for as little as $349 (with lens) by major chain retailers.</p>

<p>Sony NEX/Alpha candidates:</p>

<p>Sony NEX 3N ($349) + 50mm f/1.8 ($298); APS-C; 75mm-equivalent = $647<br>

Sony Alpha 5000 ($498) + 50mm f/1.8 ($298); APS-C; 75mm-equivalent = $796</p>

<p>Andrew said:</p>

<blockquote>

<p><em>Would also consider the Olympus 45/1.8 on a suitable Olympus micro 4/3 body.</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>Thanks! I completely missed that one! At a 90mm-equivalent, that's closer to what I'm looking for, compared with only a 75mm-equivalent with the Sony lens. The budget-priced Olympus E-PM2 body rates a respectable ISO score of 932 on DxO's low-light test. Here's another short-tele ILC combo option:<br /> <br /> Olympus E-PM2 ($369) + 45mm f/1.8 ($399); micro-4/3rds; 90mm-equivalent = $768</p>

<p>Andy said:</p>

<blockquote>

<p><em>Pick up a NEX-5n, which is cheap, an adapter and a Minolta 58mm f/1.4, which is $50 in perfect condition . . .</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>That's an interesting option, but losing AF would be a big compromise. But since I already own a ton of Nikon glass, I could also just mount my AF-S Nikkor 50mm f/1.4G, or my old AF Nikkor 85mm f/1.8, or even my Ais Nikkor 105mm f/1.8 onto an Alpha 5000 or NEX 3N with an F-mount to E-mount adapter. Not nearly as compact as a Merrill DP, but certainly smaller than my D7000.</p>

<p>No Sigma DPM camera is fast--excellent quality, but incredibly slow.</p>

<p>BTW, they can be had on Amazon for $563 now if you don't mind them directly from Japan (and I assume without a U.S. warranty):</p>

<p>http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B00B5P5XUG/ref=sr_1_1_olp?ie=UTF8&qid=1391208781&sr=8-1&keywords=sigma+dp3m&condition=new</p>

<p>But if you don't need AF then the NEX solution works very well. The old Tamron 90mm f2.5 in Adaptall 2 mount makes an excellent tight portrait lens on my NEX 7 coupled with a Pentax 50 f1.4 M42 for half body shots.</p>

<p>Mike said:</p>

<blockquote>

<p><em>BTW, they can be had on Amazon for $563 now if you don't mind them directly from Japan (and I assume without a U.S. warranty):</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>I saw that last night! I was tempted! But wouldn't all the menus be in Japanese?</p>

<p>Scroll down to the bottom of the linked page and view some of the model sample images at 100% which were lensed with the 75mm-equivalent, Sigma DP3. The mascara on the model's eyelashes, and the image in general is really impressive, with a very high degree of acutance. Reading the Luminous Landscape review of the Merrill DP3 is making me thing twice about this camera:</p>

<p>http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/sigma_dp3_review.shtml</p>

<p>However, its extremely poor high-ISO performance, short battery life, lack of third-party RAW support, and sluggish overall feel has the Sigma at a huge disadvantage compared with similarly equipped ILCs (I didn't say "peers," because it really has none). But those images . . . amazing. The better-than-D7000 quality of the Nikon Coolpix A's images convinced me of the advantages fixed-lens compacts can offer, where the optics have been optimized to the sensor at a very high degree. The Sigma DP3 proves this performance benefit in a longer lensed compact. Since getting my Coolpix A, I've been really warming up to the idea of shooting <em>two</em> compact bodies--two <em>fixed-lens</em> compacts. At only $552 for a Japanese import, I might just give this a shot.</p>

<p>Ralph, the image quality from a Foveon equipped camera is highly addictive. I've been shooting them almost exclusively since I started in digital 7 years ago. I own an SD15 now which, even though it has a relative low resolution compared to modern cameras, still looks better than my NEX 7 in the final print. And even though the NEX 7 has much higher resolution, the Sigma has a dimensionality and realism no Bayer camera can match since each pixel is unique. But they can certainly be a pain to deal with, with slow quirky bodies.</p>

<p>And the new DP3M camera's image quality is simply superb. But with each exposure taking 7 seconds to process (in raw mode, which is the best way to shoot them) and having only a seven shot buffer it forces you into a style of careful, almost meditative, photography that went out with shooting large format. In other words, you really have to slow yourself down when using it. But if you love high resolution beautiful landscapes, portraits or close-up the results are worth it.</p>

Gushing LL reviews aren't really a source for rational information.

<blockquote>

<p>DxO ISO score of 1083 (which bests even its successor, the NEX 3N, which has a DxO low-light score of 1067)</p>

</blockquote>

<p>The difference between an DxO ISO score of 500 and 1000 is <strong>ONE </strong>stop. Those <em>figure of merit </em>scores don't mean much either; it's more important to see what the difference is at specific ISO speeds. Without being able correlate numeric values to visible characteristics renders the numbers meaningless. </p>

<p>That sigma camera is just the ticket if you're looking for that pointillist painting look when you're shooting those night grab shots at ISO 3200. </p>

<p>Andy, I take it you've never shot with a Foveon equipped camera.</p>

<p>As for reviews there are plenty more, all equally gushing:</p>

<p>http://diglloyd.com/blog/2012/20121005_1-SigmaDP1Merrill-comments.html</p>

<p>http://www.fotopolis.pl/index.php?n=15841&p=0</p>

<p>http://www.optyczne.pl/230.1-Test_aparatu-Sigma_DP3_Merrill-Wstęp.html</p>

<p>http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/sigma-dp2-merrill-camera/</p>

<p>http://www.optyczne.pl/227.1-Test_aparatu-Sigma_DP1_Merrill-Wstęp.html</p>

<p>And the conclusions are pretty much the same, a PITA to use and process but the results are worth it (at least for those who value image quality over convenience). </p>

So what? There's nothing these cameras are being shown doing that you can't do with any other pretty decent APSC

camera with a prime lens, being used carefully. The reviews are gushing over the fact that careful use and a reasonably

good lens will result in a sharp image - which has always been true and has nothing to do with magic sensors.

 

This is because there is no such thing as a magic sensor. It's just a camera, with the slowest 50mm lens you'll ever see,

that costs $900.

<p>Mike said:</p>

<blockquote>

<p><em>Ralph, the image quality from a Foveon equipped camera is highly addictive . . . But if you love high resolution beautiful landscapes, portraits or close-up the results are worth it.</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>Thanks for your comments, Mike! Yeah, I was pretty amazed by the LL sample images. Quantitative measurements are fine as a starting point, but images of human subjects are always the most compelling tests. I think the problem is that we're often trying to serve too many masters with a single system, or a with single piece of gear. Many times, a highly specialized tool is required (or, simply desired), one which is best suited to task, and one which best fits the specific application requirements.<br /> <br /> My Nikon Coolpix 'A' certainly solved one specific problem--to always have a camera with me. That it's also one of the prettiest APS-C imagers I've ever seen is a huge plus. I just wish Nikon took the Merrill DP route, and built additional fixed-lens compacts with different lenses, similar to Sigma's approach. But, if no one is going to make the "perfect" long-lens compact, then maybe I'll just have to adapt <em>my</em> requirements, and adjust to what's offered. Certainly the DP3 has some huge trade-offs, but I have to admit, I'm pretty impressed.</p>

<p>Bruce said:</p>

 

<blockquote>

<p><em>The difference between an DxO ISO score of 500 and 1000 is <strong>ONE </strong>stop.</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>I consider a 1-EV performance difference significant.</p>

<p>Andy said:</p>

<blockquote>

<p><em>So what? There's nothing these cameras are being shown doing that you can't do with any other pretty decent APSC camera with a prime lens, being used carefully.</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>Well, that's why I'm discussing this in the <em>mirrorless</em> forum. Full-sized APS-C DSLRs are either impractical, or simply inconvenient for certain applications. I'd bet money that my Coolpix 'A' images bests those taken with my D7000 with my AF Nikkor 18mm f/2.8D mounted, and it's a mere fraction of its size, plus, it was only about one-third the cost.</p>

<p>Okay, I'm "back" (I lost my head for a while looking a those Merrill images). As much as I like the images from the DP3, operationally, it probably just won't work for me. I see that the recently announced Olympus E-M1/E-M10 micro-4/3rds bodies have upgraded ASICs (TruePic VII), so I can only guess that a similar upgrade is due for the more compact versions of Olympus' line. What brings me back to Olympus is its super-sexy 75mm f/1.8 (150mm-equivalent) mid-tele. Probably too rich for my blood, but I can still opt for the almost-as-sexy 45mm f/1.8 (90mm-equivalent), which has a much less painful selling price of only $399. Perhaps, it's worth a short wait to see if an upgraded E-PL5 arrives this spring.</p>

<p>The absolute, hands down, high value, telephoto, native µ4/3 lens is the Sigma 60/2.8. I have one and the 75/1.8 & 45/1.8. It gives up 1 - 1/3 stops to the other lenses, but it's tack sharp WO. I can hand hold it @ 1/15 sec. with an E-M5 and that equates to a reasonable ISOs in rather dim light. At less than 1/3 of the size and price of the 75/1.8 it's a great deal.</p>

<p>Ralph,<br>

Are you planing to carry with you two fixed lens cameras?</p>

<p>the m4/3's biggest plusses are AF speed, lens selection, and IBIS in-body stabilization. but you're giving away image quality to the Fuji X series as well as low-light performance. the sigma DP3 is probably worth it at under $600, but it's not going to be the best for low-light candids. or anything which requires speed. personally, i'm waiting for an XT1 to go with my XE1 and x100. the 56/1.2 is definitely on my radar. if the dp3 drops to $500 i might go for it.</p>

Being a Fuji x100 user with a hankering for a longer lens, this thread has really got me thinking about the sigma dp3. Two

small compacts in a camera bag wouldn't be much heavier than one body and two primes, and there would be no need to

switch lenses in the field and worry about getting dust/dirt on the sensor.

<p>Bruce said:</p>

<blockquote>

<p><em>The absolute, hands down, high value, telephoto, native µ4/3 lens is the Sigma 60/2.8. I have one and the 75/1.8 & 45/1.8. It gives up 1 - 1/3 stops to the other lenses, but it's tack sharp WO.</em></p>

</blockquote>

<p>Thanks for the info, Bruce. Although price is always a consideration, that 150mm-equivalent f/1.8 sure seems cool. If I go this way, I would be going for max-speed and optimum subject isolation, so I would choose either the 45mm or 75mm. I would love to see some wide-open portraits shot with your 75mm f/1.8 if you care to share any (and, also any shot with the 45mm f/1.8 as well).</p>