Stuck(?) shutter speed ring on Konica SII rangefinder

I didn't want to hijack to ongoing rangefinder thread, so I'm starting a new one. Mostly because of that other thread, I just acquired a Konica SII. It appears to be in very nice condition, but the shutter speed ring is set to B, and it won't move to another speed.

 

It acts like there's some kind of interlock in place, in that it will move, but only a tiny amount and the ring between the shutter speed ring and the aperture ring moves with it. I don't know if that's normal or a symptom. When I say "a tiny amount", I mean it moves far enough that the B is no longer aligned with the tick mark, but only ~1/3 of the distance to the 1 second setting.

 

I'm hoping this is one of those "oh, you have to do <fill in the blank> before it will move off B" kind of things. Anyone know?

I looked at the instruction manual at the Butkus website but didn't see any information about a lock to move shutter speed dial off B. Some cameras from that era had LVS settings that linked aperture and shutter which may have had a release of some sort. Some cameras I used had a lock to select B setting, but nothing to return. You might go to the Butkus camera manual website and see if I overlooked anything. I hope you can get your SII up and running.

I looked at the instruction manual at the Butkus website but didn't see any information about a lock to move shutter speed dial off B. Some cameras from that era had LVS settings that linked aperture and shutter which may have had a release of some sort. Some cameras I used had a lock to select B setting, but nothing to return. You might go to the Butkus camera manual website and see if I overlooked anything. I hope you can get your SII up and running.

Thanks, Mike. I checked the manual before I posted (as everyone should :)), and didn't see anything relevant, either.

Well, 23 views and only 1 response tells me that this probably is not a case of me not knowing the "secret". So, the next questions are, A) does anyone know how to fix this, B) does anyone know someone who could fix it, and C) is it worth putting money into this camera?

Okay, checking current eBay auctions tells me that it is NOT worth putting money into it. So, anyone have any do-it-yourself repair tips?

Actually, it's (potentially) worth more than I was thinking from looking at eBay. It turns out there is a Konica SII and a Konica S2, and they're quite different. S2's are cheap, SII's are not.

Have you tried moving the ring with aperture set to a large value, for instance f/2.8?

 

It may well be that it is just stuck. A judicious amount of torque and heat might get it moving.

I've been tempted to pick up an SII if I can find one in working order that's not too pricey. If the selenium meter works even better.

I have a Konica S which preceded the SII, pretty much the same with the Copal SV shutter. The shutter ring is stuck on B, just like yours. As I recall, the shutter was firing but the blades weren't opening, and I tried it on a variety of speeds, with no luck. When I tried it on the B setting the shutter fired (still with no movement of the blades) but I was subsequently unable to move the ring to any other speed. So, it could be a matter of taking out the front elements and attempting to get the shutter blades freed up with an application of the good ol' lighter fluid.

I have 2 of these cameras. They are victims of the sticky shutter syndrome. The are a lot of photos here Minolta Himatic 7s. The lever in the 1st photos can cause problems if not replaced correctly, DSCN2124

Good Luck.

Have you tried moving the ring with aperture set to a large value, for instance f/2.8?

 

It may well be that it is just stuck. A judicious amount of torque and heat might get it moving.

Thanks, Julio. I tried it just now, with no luck. I'm afraid to put too much torque on it, because I don't know how much it takes to break something.

 

I've been tempted to pick up an SII if I can find one in working order that's not too pricey. If the selenium meter works even better.

Hi Mike. The meter on mine seems to work. I can't say whether it's accurate or not, but the meter needle responds approximately as it should. So, you may find what you're looking for.

 

I have a Konica S which preceded the SII, pretty much the same with the Copal SV shutter. The shutter ring is stuck on B, just like yours. As I recall, the shutter was firing but the blades weren't opening, and I tried it on a variety of speeds, with no luck. When I tried it on the B setting the shutter fired (still with no movement of the blades) but I was subsequently unable to move the ring to any other speed. So, it could be a matter of taking out the front elements and attempting to get the shutter blades freed up with an application of the good ol' lighter fluid.

Thanks, Rick. That sounds like it could be exactly the same thing that happened to this one. I was hearing the shutter firing, but I hadn't checked whether the blades were opening. I thought that they must have been, but they don't open. Have you performed the steps you indicated on your S? I've never attempted such a thing, and I don't see any spanner slots/holes in the trim ring. I guess the outer rings unscrew?

 

I have 2 of these cameras. They are victims of the sticky shutter syndrome. The are a lot of photos here Minolta Himatic 7s. The lever in the 1st photos can cause problems if not replaced correctly, DSCN2124

Good Luck.

Thanks, Greg. As it happens, I have a Hi-Matic 7S, too. It has the advantage of offering spanner holes for unscrewing the front trim ring, at least. Any suggestions for removing the front on the SII? It doesn't have the spanner holes.

I should have asked if the shutter was operating and the camera winding on at the "B" setting, of course, before posting my reply above! If it is, ignore my comments; you'll have to delve deeper...You'll have to use a rubber lens spanner to remove the front "beauty ring". As a substitute for the spanner, a piece of rubber sheet, such as a section of dish-washing glove, wrapped around a suitably-sized jar lid, may well do the trick.

I should have asked if the shutter was operating and the camera winding on at the "B" setting, of course, before posting my reply above! If it is, ignore my comments; you'll have to delve deeper...You'll have to use a rubber lens spanner to remove the front "beauty ring". As a substitute for the spanner, a piece of rubber sheet, such as a section of dish-washing glove, wrapped around a suitably-sized jar lid, may well do the trick.

And I suppose I should have mentioned that it "seems" to wind on and the shutter fires but, as you pointed out, the blades aren't opening. I never knew that was possible, so I've learned something. I assume that anything that fits is "suitably-sized", when it comes to jar lids.

I assume that anything that fits is "suitably-sized", when it comes to jar lids.

Yes, I invested in a set of the rubber wrenches some time ago, but prior to that I used lids and rubber. Here's a typical example using the lid of a spice container, though I might wash the lid first! You want a lid that fits neatly into the front of the lens, hollow side in.

 

Yes, I invested in a set of the rubber wrenches some time ago, but prior to that I used lids and rubber. Here's a typical example using the lid of a spice container, though I might wash the lid first! You want a lid that fits neatly into the front of the lens, hollow side in.

 

[ATTACH=full]1237502[/ATTACH]

Oh! Well, that's the opposite of how I thought it worked but, now that I know better, it makes sense. The idea is to establish friction along the sides of the ring, rather than the exposed edge. Much more surface contact, that way. Thanks!

Hmm. Waitaminnit... am I trying to remove the outermost ring, which has the filter threads on it, or the trim/beauty ring?

 

I really hate these "You must wait at least 65000 seconds before posting" messages.

Rick Drawbridge said:

I have a Konica S which preceded the SII, pretty much the same with the Copal SV shutter. The shutter ring is stuck on B, just like yours. As I recall, the shutter was firing but the blades weren't opening, and I tried it on a variety of speeds, with no luck. When I tried it on the B setting the shutter fired (still with no movement of the blades) but I was subsequently unable to move the ring to any other speed...

 

I also once long ago had a first version 'S' that was stuck, think Rick has something here. Camera may be "in the middle of a firing cycle". Won't allow shutter speed change until blades open and close and cycle is completed. Try a long shot, set the self-timer?

 

Just hope Rick doesn't have my old 'S'...

Hmm. Waitaminnit... am I trying to remove the outermost ring, which has the filter threads on it, or the trim/beauty ring?

 

I really hate these "You must wait at least 65000 seconds before posting" messages.

 

The trim/beauty ring, which shares the filter thread.

Should unscrew anti-clockwise.

Oh this is funny: looked up Konica SII on the b*y. The first one that popped up had the bottom rewind button pushed in. No wonder it wound so well...

 

Anyway, thought of something else. Have an Olympus Auto-B. It took a lot of tinkering only to discover that it wouldn't work unless the charge lever was slightly cocked.

I'm glad I checked this thread one more time before attempting the lens removal. L Pederson's suggestion partially solved the problem. The self-timer was stuck halfway through its cycle. I was able to ease it all the way to the end, and that freed up the shutter speed ring. But, then I couldn't re-set the timer, until I noticed that the X/M flash sync switch was also "stuck" in the middle. So, I moved that the X, and now I can re-set the self-timer.

 

But, the timer still doesn't work. Cocking and firing the shutter does not trigger the timer, and the blades still don't move. So, I guess it still needs the shutter treatment.

 

It may be a deceptive bit of cosmetic design, but there is a gap between the trim ring and the filter thread ring. I can't tell if they're connected further back than I can see, but I can get a fingernail between the two. I guess we'll find out, if I can get anything removed.

Okay, well, that was ridiculously easy, contrary to my expectations. The trim/beauty ring turns out to be part of a whole lens assembly and completely separate from the filter ring.

It actually threads into the small barrel just in front of the shutter. You can see the threads in this shot.

 

 

So, now I have access to the shutter blades, and I've read posts from people claiming to have "flooded" the shutter of other camera models with lighter fluid or naptha, but this camera has another lens behind the shutter. I'm concerned that I might wash gunk off the shutter blades only to have it adhere to that rear lens.

 

I believe the rear lens may be beyond my capabilities to remove. It's deeply recessed and, while I have a spanner (that I've never used), it seems to be the wrong size for this job. I'm also not at all confident in my ability to avoid damaging the lens while trying to remove it.

 

So, I'm seeking advice on how to go about applying the cleaning fluid to the shutter.

That was an easy one! Rather than "flooding" the shutter blades I'd use a fine artists brush loaded with fluid to very gently soak the blades, or an eyedropper. Often, it doesn't take very much to free up the blades. Once you've got the shutter working you can use "B" to keep the shutter open while you use a Q-tip (or whatever) to polish the face of the rear element. You may have to fire the shutter multiple time before you get any movement. Select one one the higher speeds, now you can move the speed ring.

Thanks, Rick. I hate waiting, so I didn't actually see that anyone had replied before I went off and did it but, luckily, I seem to have gleaned enough from my reading to be in the ballpark. I used a Q-tip dipped in naptha and lightly brushed across the blades. I did that probably 10 times (wasn't counting) and then tried the shutter. Eh, voila! It works!!

 

I think/hope I was gentle enough. The shutter seems to work well at all speeds, at least for now. And I did use a Q-tip to clean the rear element, which was really dirty. I assume most of that was the gunk from the shutter blades. But, now I need to wait (I hate waiting) for it to dry out before putting the lens assembly back in. Not sure how long to wait, because every time I fire the shutter, more wetness appears. I tried absorbing it with another dry Q-tip, but that seems ineffective. I suppose I could wait overnight. I hate waiting. :)

...I hate waiting. :)

 

Hmm... I'm still waiting for

my tax refund from 2016.

It's so complicated, my

CPA's had to file for five

extensions...

http://bayouline.com/o2.gif

I suppose I could wait overnight.

 

Sensible. You may have to repeat the process in the morning... But well done, in the meantime!