Sprockets missing holes in 35mm film

<p>I splurged on a circa-49-year-old <a

href="http://www.claus-marin.de/35seng.htm" title="Claus Marin's

second version, 45/1.9">Olympus 35-S</a> the other day.

One-five-hundredth aside, it seemed to work fine in the shop. However, I

didn't think of taking along a test film to evaluate film advance. You

know what's coming: during my first film (<em>after</em> paying the

money and taking it away with me) advance was ominously noisy and

arduous. Rewinding was arduous too. When I'd rewound the film and

opened the back, I found, uh, <em>chads</em> lying around. I haven't

got the film back yet: it's C41, and the processing company is sending it

off for special care. (At no extra price. This is Japan!)</p><p>I'm now

sacrificing a second roll to see what could be up. I lack any device for

measuring them, but the sprockets <em>look</em> curiously small

compared with those of my Canon L3. And when I've closed the back and

wound and fired a few times, winding becomes tricky and I open to see

that, sure enough, the sprockets are no longer engaging with the

holes.</p><p>This seems a very fundamental sort of 35mm problem, but I

haven't encountered or even heard of it before. I can't see any signs of

wear (unlike old sprockets on a well-used push-bike), and the only guess

I can make is that the film pressure plate might have lost its spring -- but

no, it certainly hasn't lost its spring.</p><p>Could this be a design

defect of this particular model (about which little seems to be written)?

Or is there something I should look for or a kludge I should

try?</p><p>The camera comes with a very limited warranty, so I can

return it if I do so very quickly -- but I don't want the people at the shop

(decent prices, helpful assistants) to start to regard me as a PitA.</p>

I encountered exactly the same problem with a Rollei 35 some years ago.

 

It seemed to come from a film flatness problem. The camera sprocket teeth weren't well engaged in the film holes (I had opened the back and sacrified a film to see what happened).

 

More, the misengaged sprocket teeth had torn the film holes and there were film debris all around in the camera body, that were a problem by themselves and caused some hardness in the winding mech. Some debris were there for years, far before I got the camera.

 

I had (partially) solved the problem by cleaning the camera of the debris and folding twice the film leading before fitting it into the take-up spool, and firmly holding the winding lever while putting the camera back on, so that the film remained as flat as possible while closing the camera back.

 

In addition, I didn't use 36 exposures films any more, using 24 exposures films only.

 

The problem came back sometimes but it could be managed. Also check that the sprocket moves freely when no film is loaded. Grime in the sprocket mech. can make the sprocket hard to turn, and tear the film holes because of the excessive force that would be needed.

 

Good luck.

Check the pressure plate in the back is not pressing the film too tightly against the rails in the body, making film advance difficult when camera is closed, and possibly stripping holes when excessive force is applied.

If you have pieces floating around, the previous owner may have had pieces floating around. These pieces are possibly the original problem and have jammed one of the sprockets involved in transporting the film. If this sprocket is not turning, everything is fine until the slack runs out of the film cannister and then things stick. Sounds like a headache, so I would take it back and let the shop fix, replace or refund.

Thank you all for your ideas. I'll digest them more carefully tomorrow and try out one or two ideas, perhaps saying what happened. In the meantime, though, I can say that the "chads" were from my own first film, and not from the previous owner's.

Maybe the mechanism for double-exposure prevention is sticky? Could just need a cleaning.<br>    I have an old 35-S that I bought cheap on eBay a couple years ago and restored. One of my earliest successes, so I was disappointed when the images were not very sharp -- something I had never seen from a G Zuiko. Took me a while to figure out that I was missing the rear lens element. The film transport on mine is very smooth.<br>    Judging from the deteriorated finish on mine, Olympus did not have access to very good materials at the time the 35-S was in production. However, I'd be surprised if the camera did not yield excellent results when new.

On some older cameras the sprocket was turned only by the film advancing, no film-no sprocket turning. If your's is this type, the sprocket may be binding. More recent cameras the sprocket is turned by the film advance system with or without film. Film slippage in the takeup spool might be your problem with this type.

Good point, so folding twice the film leader before fitting it in the take-up spool fence should be done, at least.

 

On my well working Rollei 35 cameras I always do that now. I did not kept the Rollei 35 that showed the same problem than Peter's Olympus 35-S. But the problem might have helped me to correctly load cameras that have not this problem, finally. Fold the leader. Try to fold once. If it does not solve the problem, fold it twice.

 

:))=

No actually, what I meant is that film could have gotten down inside the camera's innards (somewhere not visible without disassembly) during previous use. This would potentially jam one of the sprockets, especially if you have a secondary sprocket that works in tandem with the film take-up spool. Small pieces of film are remarkably durable once they get down inside a camera. I was just suggesting that your pieces of film may be the result of the previous owner doing something to cause other pieces of film to get jammed down inside (like not securing the film end in the take-up spool properly as above) and may be the reason why the camera was for sale. Thus back to the shop.

<p>I'm back in my office, with my Olympus 35-S on my lap. Thank you all

again for your various ideas. They're very helpfully expressed, but

cumulatively the effect was to make me wonder why the hell I hadn't

done this or that <em>obvious</em> check before wasting other people's

time here. Thank you all for the undeserved politeness and

patience.</p><p>Right, then. Eggzecutive summary: I think something

could be amiss with the left-hand spindle, the one that holds the

cassette. Even "dry-rewinding" takes some effort -- not great, but

perhaps enough to suggest that there's too much resistance to winding.

There's no obvious reason for this, as although the rewind crank is of

course a lot less elegant than that of a Canon P (of which I happen

to have a sample close at hand), its effective radius is greater. (I

couldn't see how "dry" rewinding could be affected by the rewind button

at the base of the camera, but yes, I kept it pressed in.) Meanwhile, the

sprocket turns without any particular resistance, as does a little spindle

attached to the hinged back that presses the film in between sprocket

and take-up spool. As for the take-up spool, friction is so low that I can

just about "dry-wind" the film by pulling it with my thumb -- not

something I continued, as I'm sure the mount isn't designed for this kind

of pressure.</p><p>Somebody who's experienced might easily be able to

whip the top off this thing and examine the mount of the left-hand

spool, and loosen or lubricate something or other. But that person isn't

me: I'm inexperienced and a klutz. Anyway, it could turn out that a vital

and irreplaceable part is corroded, or similar. So I suppose I'll take it

back.</p><p>This would be rather a pity. Mike

Connealy:</p><p><em>Judging from the deteriorated finish on mine,

Olympus did not have access to very good materials at the time the 35-S

was in production.</em></p><p>This is no "concours" camera, but is

fairly handsome and the finish is good. It looks good in a display cabinet

-- but that was not the intention. The obvious flaw is that the rear of the

rear lens element is misty or dirty when I see light reflected off it -- set

the shutter to "B", open the lens to f1.9 and look <em>through</em> it,

and it's pretty good. I'll be sorry to say goodbye to it. </p>

Peter : without removing anything or doing anything that might void your warranty, here is at least one thing you can do yourself before you decide to bring the camera back to the shop.

 

Take a glass in the kitchen, and a WD-40 bomb. Blow some WD-40 in the glass. Take a 000 art paintbrush and put it in the WD-40 in the bottom of the glass. Store the WD-40 bomb back in your garage :-))

 

With the paintbrush put some WD-40 in the rewind spool mech, everywhere you can (from the top between the camera top cover and the rewind knob, from the bottom between the rewind spindle axis and the camera inner casting) to lubricate the shaft. Don't use too much but use enough, though. Wait for about 1 minute to allow the WD-40 to go through the shaft.

 

Then turn the rewind axle with your fingers till you feel it turns freely. WD-40 will free it if it had some grime or even corrosion, without leaving neither some oily nor greasy deposits when dry. If a few minutes later you see some WD-40 coming back from where you had put some, dry it with a paper towel each time it is necessary. It will quickly cease to come back.

 

Pay also attention to the film pressure plate surface. If corroded or dirty it could act as a brake. Clean it with acetone, and polish it with a soft polish cream for car paint. Then clean it carefully again with water and dishwashing soap, and dry it with an hair dryer.

 

Look at the film guide rails. The same : if corroded, or dirty, they brake. Clean them with acetone and a Q-tip. While passing your fingertip on them you should feel a soft, non resistant surface.

 

The problem is common and not serious IMHO. I see no reason why you should not keep the camera, if you like it. Don't give up. Never give up with a classic camera you like :))=

<p>Thank you for the further advice and encouragement, Nicolas.

"WD-40", yes, I'd heard of it and I knew very roughly what it was. But it's

inscrutably occidental; what the hell would I ask for here? Ah, saved! <a

href="http://www.st-c.co.jp/wd40/catalog/catalog.html" title="Yes of

course you want to read about WD-40 in Japanese!">It's available here

too.</a> And a paintbrush, yes, I'll get myself a paintbrush. It's close to

20:30 on Saturday, but I'll find both somewhere, dammit!</p>