Shooting team candids...

If this has been dealt with elsewhere, please direct me to the appropiate place.

 

I'd appreciate any ideas or experience on shooting kid team sports--not team shots, more

candids. Some of the parents have asked me to come to some games and shoot their kids.

How do most people handle that? Do you charge a fee that can be shared among parents

for showing up (maybe that goes toward the price of any prints? Do you offer the disc or

negatives? Do you offer proof sheets or website that the parents can order from? My

experience is that parents go crazy for even shots of the back of a kid's head.

 

Also, where is a good place to get pictures made into sports cards--websites, etc?

 

Does anyone use photoshop to make your own sports cards?

 

Thanks.

Do you do this for a living?

 

Is there a Dads Club or Sports Booster Club at the school that can pick up the direct operating expenses?

 

Can you shoot digital(a modern SLR without the shutter lag of the point and shoots) and do away with the film, processing, traveling to the lab time, etc...

 

Do you actually want to get tied down to a computer for DAYS burning copies onto disc?

 

FORGET about handing out negatives, they'll get scratched up and or lost..

 

What type of sports are you talking about?

 

If you can shoot digital or if needed film and have the local 'pro lab' burn them to CD's you can upload them to one of the web hosting sites like SNAPFISH and then the parents can either download the shots from there or pay SNAPFISH to print them (which is their business for being on the web and hosting )and you'd be done with it, other than collecting the direct operating expenses from the above mentioned organizations.

 

I don't think the parents had in mind for another parent to make a living from this type of thing, its a community service type of thing, you know, giving back to the community..

 

Is there a PTA at the school that will take care of the expenses?

 

These shots can also be used for the yearbook, and to promote the school.

 

www.bwc.net can print them on anything, your backside if you want to pay enough..

 

lots of things to think about, not to mention the equipment that you have to possibly do this project..

 

oh yeah, don't expect a big hug or barely a thanks... people..

If you do get one of the organizations to pick up the tab (that will take some work on your part), are you prepared to make a list of ALL the players and be sure to get shots of ALL of them , not just the main offense scorers. Alot of the kids are support for the team and aren't necessarily in the lime-light at these events. Their parents still want shots of them..

 

Do you have a file cabinet or some way to catalog all these shots that you will end up with?

 

When i shot film for these things, i set up a different colored looseleaf binder for each of the schools that i was doing the volunteer work for and bought those archival sleeves for the negatives to be slid in to. I had the lab cut the negs in 6's for these sleeves. I had a contact print in each binder as well. A seperate binder for each sport. A seperate binder for each season..

There's alot of time involved in this stuff...

As Miles pointed out you can loose your shirt on this type of project, the total time you will spend divide by your profit may put you in the red. What I use to do is to shoot proofs, deal with parents, let them pick the ones they wanted, go to the lab, call the parents, try to get paid. What I do now,is one on one, set a upfront fee for the event based on travel and time, set a package for what they want(say 72 4x6 proofs, with 2 8x10's, or one 11x14 of there choice). Then I get a deposit up front, I use to feel guilty about asking for this till I had to chase car owners who have 50 grand in a motor around try to get the measly hundred dollars they own me because they saw my work and wanted me to do the shoot, now standing in the pits they want to know if I can take Mastercard or catch me next week at the race. Sorry for the rant.There are a lot of guys out there who only do the team shot and Johnny at home plate shot because of this. The only money maker I had was a job by a father to shoot every one of his sons football games as a senior and to put together a album which he gave his son as a present. Most pro labs offer the baseball, scoccer photo kits, you can even purchase custom mats online.But please whether you use film or digital figure in all your expenses, gas, car,travel, sitting editing in Ps can take up your time.

Good luck

I have to second the sentiments of the others on the aspect this will take up ALOT of your time. If this is your profession then you should charge. If you are friend/parent then you should charge. You will find that most parents just want you to give them the photos or if its digital to email. If you hand over your photos freely expect them to take them down to walgreens or where ever and get christmas cards, etc made without nothing more than a thanks can you do that again from the parents. If youre willing to have them use you and use you alot dont charge more than your expenses but at least charge your expenses. If you want them to take you seriously and use your services then charge a fee for doing the shots and then a fee for the disk or prints.

 

I work in a school, I do the yearbook sports, team, and dance photos. I give away shots to the parents and students, I will burn a cd for them providing they give me a cd. I make prints at cost. But I do this as a favor, as part of my overall committment to the lives of the children I work with. I cant help you with fees but I can warn you if you let people use you they will and it will sting sometimes.

 

And yes, parents flip over any shot of their kids. I have had parents eew and ahh over shots that I was going to toss.

Thanks all for your responses. There's a lot of energy in this topic, judging from the length

of your posts!

 

I sensed some bitterness as well, and I'm sorry for that.

 

Fortunately for me, my photography is still enjoyable enough as a "secondary career" that I

don't have to make a living at it. Probably couldn't anyway. But I do love it, especially

things like sports. I have the luxury of being selective in my jobs because I have another

job that pays the bills.

 

I just found that a lot of people were asking me to do things--"using" me a little I guess,

and I finally put my foot down, and said I can't do ALL this work for free. Not that I really

make any money at it, but it does cover some of my costs, and believe it or not it is

thrilling to think I actually DO get paid for doing something that I love. Also, believe it or

not, I truly enjoy making people happy with photos.

 

It is a HUGE time sink, you are all right. But I still enjoy it and I'm still learning. That's the

other reason I shoot anything. To get something out of it for myself--to learn how to

shoot football, basketball, night games, etc. I have worked out some ways to streamline

my process. I don't plan on shooting every single kid in the game either, unless that can

be compensated.

 

I guess the point I am making is that I don't do it for free, and I probably don't charge

what it costs me either. Nor do I charge today what I will be able to charge tomorrow.

 

I was just looking for some insight into others' process and experience. Thanks for all your

time and energy to enlighten me from your experience!

 

J.

"Can you shoot digital(a modern SLR without the shutter lag of the point and shoots) and do away with the film, processing, traveling to the lab time, etc..." How to spend 2 to 3 thousand $$$$s and break even?

 

 

 

I can (and have) shot six rolls of film and taken in $1,200 [dumb me to use film.] Had I gone digital, I would still be in the 'hole' -- trying to figure out how to 'print' the packages on my home printer. Using a lab, the parents were happy, I did not have to buy paper or ink (to save money) or use my 'time' to print up everything.

 

 

 

Go digital to save on film....?

I dont think going digital to save money on film is the answer. However, if youre digital you do save a little time if you shoot, download, and just burn to a cd and sell the cd. Or take the cd in and have it printed from there. You save a small amount of time off the processing and enlarging process. I shoot digital for school just to save money on film and developing fees that the school just doesnt have money to pay for.

I am in no way suggesting to throw out a film camera for digital. Unless you can afford the mamiya with digital and film backs.

Jairy-

 

I will be doing a similar thing this season. I hope to photograph all the kids on my son's baseball team - while they are out daydreaming in the outfield (they are 7-year olds). It's a close-knit town, I know half the parents and with COSCTO film processing, which is actually better than Kodak it will only cost me $7USD.

 

I know the pres. of the town little league too. If things work out, I may ask him if he wants to "work something out" I won't get rich, but I just hope to make a few bucks.

 

Which brings up a story. Our family used to vacation at a Dude Ranch in New York state. Some local photographer would park himself on the trail and photograph all the vacationers on the bridal path riding horses. He would come back later that evening and charge $20 for each 5 x 7. They sucked, no fill flash, harsh shadows, the subject filled less than half the frame and he didn't even have a strap on the camera.

 

With respect to my endeavor, I will put a business label on the back of each print and if the parents want to pay me, fine. If not, maybe they will hire me for a local event.

 

Like you, I have a primary profession and burn film on a part-time basis (wedding, parties etc) and love every minute of it.

 

Good luck-

 

Jim

Jim:

 

I have to ask. What does the lack of a strap on the camera have

to do with the sucky results? :)

 

 

Eric

lack of strap shows willingness to take risks. maybe strap caused the photog to be nervous due to such risk and thus the shots sucked.

No strap had no effect on image quality.

Having a strap on you camera make it easier to pee, however.

This thread might be dead but the last answer by Jim made me laugh. Thanks. I've been taking team photos for a couple years (I am not a pro), and this last weekend was typical.

 

300 digital photos and 3 rolls of KodakUC over the weekend at my son's 10 year old baseball tournament: hip-shot candids, action shots, individual shots, family-in-the-stands, kids-eating, formal and informal full team shots (we always do a "go crazy" pose where kids and coaches make faces, etc.) Of the 300 digital, I uploaded them all to my computer, deleted 50 just by looking at the thumbnails, deleted another 50 when I saw full screen shots, and then used Elements to create and post a web gallery. This entire process took about one hour. Parents will now email me for specific shots (I expect to get fewer than 40 total requests) and I'll get 4x6 prints made at a local shop, costing me maybe $10 and maybe another hour of work.

 

Most people are completely happy to see and email the jpeg files, and nobody expects me to print sports cards or anything like that. My film shots will be much better quality because my digi is a P&S (good for sticking through the fence) but the film are really made for myself and the coaches as much as anything else. I do get double prints made and give them away throughout the season and at the end of the year. My film costs for the weekend will probably total $35 but I won't shoot anywhere near this much throughout the season.

 

Parents might like the back of a head once, but then they do prefer faces and action shots. Digi is cheap if ya already have the equipment, and jairy seems to have a digi system.<div></div>

As far as team photo distribution goes, I upload my photos to

kodakgallery.com. I upload all the usuable photos, but only order

prints of my kids, and maybe other exceptional shots for my enjoyment.

 

I email the collection to other parents. If they want to order prints

fine, if not fine, they can at least peruse the collection.

 

I don't make any money this way, but I get photos of my kids, and other

parents get photos of their kids, but I only pay for my photos.<div></div>

what i have done at sporting events is shoot a couple rolls send them off and have 4x6's developed off them then at the next event have them set up in an album and let people browse through them and sell them for $4.00 each. parents usually go nuts over them and sometimes i can make a pretty penny with this. if you have shots that aren't very good (dark or a little out of focus)you can sell those for cheaper, that way you can get ride of them and people always feel like their getting a good deal that way.