second camera for travel

<p>Hi!<br>

Need a second camera for travel alongside my 4x5.Spent few weeks searching net and got really confused.What I need is a 6x9(might be 6x12 with 6x9 option), changing backs/formats ,interchangable lenses(I need at least two- 65mm and 90mm in 6x9 format). ground glass might be an option of fine focusing(though i don't mind viewfinder and DOF).Oh and weight shouldn't be more than 2kg(preferably1.5)<br>

I already have ebony45 and hasselblad and very happy with both,though as a hiking option want smth lighter(as my hassl and two lenses and backs is nearly2,5kg) and more rectangular.<br>

I was looking for Fuji 690 - no interchangable lenses(I mean last models)Mamiya 7ll-nice camera,but it's 6x7 not far from 6x6.looked even for the older press2x3,koni omega and all that but it hard to find parts now.<br>

I discarded alpa,arca,and linhof as they are really pricey.(may be even overpriced,well ,quality doesn't come cheap but I don't think it will be better than my 4x5).<br>

All that leaves with not much choice.Iwould go for horseman SW 612 but again,budget too tight.Chinese DAYI 6x12 seems a good option for price but i don't know quality of this cameras and it's a bit heavy.<br>

Early Horseman like vh,vf,er, 695,etc. might be an option but I know nothing about these cameras and lenses.<br>

And a last resort 1950-60's folders like bessa ll but as that will certainly do for B@W I don't think they do great colour.And might be an issue with a film flatness.<br>

Wow,really don't know.maybe You guys have some ideas?<br>

So briefly: need 6x9 camera for travel and hiking as a second to 4x5, weight apr.1.5 kg,interchangable lenses(need 65mm and 90mm at least) backs, and ease of use.<br>

Will highly appreciate any ideas ,though prefer people who know what they are talking about and have practical experience.<br>

thank you very much!<br>

Edvard<br>

P.S. why haven't they got voigtlander bessa lll 6x9?(though it 's still fixed lens)</p>

<p> </p>

<p>Some Horseman ifo at:http://www.prairienet.org/b-wallen/BN_Photo/LFN/CamProf_Horseman1.htm<br>

Old folders do not have interchangeable lenses so will not be an option for you unless you change your requirements. Old Graphic 2x3 cameras like my Century can work but will be heavier. Plus the rangefinder will only work for one lens. But one with a 65 Super Angulon and a modern 100 plasmat is a nice outfit. Ideal would be the old Fuji rangefinder but lenses are very expensive. Here's my option: a Fuji 645Zi. Not 6x9 but a similar shape. Light, sharp and has 4 lens choices built in. An ideal camera to take with your large format. No separate meter needed either. All in one package.</p>

 

<p>If you can't decide, it's because you haven't determined what you want a second camera to do that your 4x5 can't do. You briefly mention your Hasselblad, which is too heavy, yet describe several candidates which are twice as heavy and bulkier. Are you looking at a 6x12 camera for panoramas? You want something lighter for hiking, yet persist in schlepping a 4x5 field camera. Go figure?</p>

<p>Rather than a separate medium format camera, have you considered a roll film back for the 4x5. Sinar and others make backs with multiple formats in the same back. They're more expensive than single-format backs, but no heavier or bulkier.</p>

<p>If you want something light and easy to deploy (i.e., street scenes), why not get a 35mm SLR, better yet a DSLR. While neither might measure up to the image quality of a 4x5, most people find that a 10MP (or more) DSLR gives better results than 35mm film, and is easier to carry even if you need a laptop or backup device.</p>

<p>Think about a Hasselblad SWC or SWC/M -- w i d e - light, interchangeable backs, great for scenery, architecture,<br>

special effects, etc.</p>

<p>The Fuji 6x9s are your only options. You will have to give up interchangeable backs & lenses. With a weight limit of 1.5K it can't be done.<br>

Otherwise a Linhof Techkina 6x9 or the Horseman VH-R 6x9 will work but you will go over weight. They will weigh in around 4.5 Lbs.<br>

Have you weighed a Horseman 6x9 back? They are not light and if you carry 2 then it adds up. I use a 6x9 Cambo view with 3 Horseman backs and it is a LOAD to carry.</p>

<p>Get the Fuji 6x9 III series and you will be fine.</p>

<p>Thanks guys! please read carefuly-<br>

1I want to move from square for a while hence 6x9<br>

2 I like my 4x5 but sometimes I need to react swiftly that's not the case with 4x5 hence 6x9back is out of question<br>

3 I happy to carry about 5kg-that's my ebony plus 3kg for lenses and second camera.<br>

to Chuck - I had mamiya afd-6x4.5 is too small for me.And I don't believe in zoom, although use them while doing weddings.Thanks anyway!<br>

To Edward: I haven't find camera like Horseman 6x12 which do 6x9 and is in my price range,that's why i was looking at 6x12 as a posibility of doing 6x9 as well.And I like rodenstock and nikon large format lenses.<br>

To Antony: thanks,I started my search with these cameras but not sure about lens quality.Need to try one.What is 90mm in 35mm format like 37-40?<br>

Edvard</p>

 

<p>The Zeiss Ercona II folder is 6x9 and has a really sharp coated Tessar lens. It's zone focus, but that may not matter to you if you stop down. And you can pick one up for less than $100.</p>

<p>I have a Mamiya 7 II also, but I still like to use the Ercona in certain situations, such as landscapes.</p>

<p>"Mamiya 7ll-nice camera,but it's 6x7 not far from 6x6."<br>

The rounded-off number designations are deceptive. Is 4x5 too close to 4x4" (if there were such a format)? Yes, 6x7 is actually 2.25 x 2.75" and has the same proportions as 4x5", thus termed "ideal format". There are some attractive and portable choices in so-called 6x7... :-)</p>

<p>If I were using 4x5 (and I was) and wanted something lighter and more suited to travel without losing a significant amount of IQ, I'd go for the Mamiya 7II (and I did).</p>

<p>I think you should think about Mamiya 7II again . It has superb optics, built in light meter and can be used in extreme weather conditions (even in gloves !!! ) + it is lighter than the Hasselblad.<br>

If you compose your photos without using 1-1 cm on the top and on the bottom of the 6x7 area you get a 4x7 cm format which almost the same ratio than 6x9 . ( And since you have larger area than you need it gives you some extra room for composition or later freedom in the lab !) <br>

Current Mamiya optics are far superior than lenses made 30-50 years ago ! </p>

<p> </p>

<p>As Doug said, there is a huge difference between 6x6 and 6x7, if you consider that most people crop and print with an 8x10 aspect ratio. The same thing applies to 6x9 (or 35mm), which loses about 25% of its available area to cropping.</p>

<p>If your main interest are landscapes and architecture rather than closeups, then at least look at the Mamiya 7II - a rangefinder camera with outstanding lenses. This is a 6x7 camera, but surprisingly small compared to an SLR of the same format. The lenses too are much smaller and lighter than those of an Hasselblad, since they don't require backspace to clear a swinging mirror. The used price at KEH is typically a little less than half the new price. Favorite lenses, the 65, 90 and 150, are a little hard to find at times at KEH.</p>

<p>To Doug: 4x5 and 6x7 have different ratio - simply divide 5by4 and7by 6. and 6x9 have the same ratio as 24x36 that's why i'm looking for it.<br>

there is no such thing as ideal format it's up to people and camera manufactures.(hasselblad claimed 6x6 as ideal than changed it's mind when started digital)</p>

<p>Can someone upload or make the link to pictures made by Mamiya 7ll? haven't seen much but what I've seen seems too contrasty to me.I'm not after l/mm I'm after good photograph.<br /> To Edward: how much will You loose printing 6x9 on 30cmx40cm paper? As for me I like 6x8 (Might go for Fuji GW680?)</p>

<p>To Robert:<br /> I was looking at this folder as well.What year was it make and how's bokeh of this lens.I might consider it for B@W<br /> thanks</p>

<p>Edward,</p>

<p>I have a chart of 6x9 to 35mm lenses :</p>

<p><a href="http://www.oresteen.com/69lensdata.htm">http://www.oresteen.com/69lensdata.htm</a></p>

<p>This should help you out.</p>

<p>BTW, the 6x9 Fuji camers are OUTSTANDING!</p>

<p>Thanks Anthony!</p>

<p>Have to apologise to Doug.Sorry, haven't take into account the actual size of the frame(56mmx70mm).Should read responses more carefully.</p>

<p>Edward, most of the images on <a href="http://www.michaelsebastian.com">my website</a> are from the mamiya 7. It is a spectacular camera, and would be ideal for your purposes.</p>

<p>Contrast has more to do with choice of film and exposure and processing than with the camera per se.</p>

<p>Sounds like you are describing the Fotoman 69 camera. We still have some left... www.fotomancamera.com</p><div></div>

<p>The Horseman 2x3 has more movement than the Linhof 2x3 cameras. It is lighter and with its grip, it is a very fast camera when used with the rangefinder. In addition, the spare lenses are quite light. I would assume you do not need to use the ground glass for focusing since you mentioned how slow the 4x5 is. So if you put the 6x9 back on the camera and the 150mm lens, you can carry the camera ready to fire and closed up. With a quick mount unipod it's the fastest interchangeable lens and back 2x3 camera ever made. The Topcon lenses are great. Just a hair less than Nikkor lenses. BTY You can unscrew the elements and mount your favorite optics on the Seikosha shutters.</p>

<p>The Horseman 2x3 has more movement than the Linhof 2x3 cameras. It is lighter and with its grip, it is a very fast camera when used with the rangefinder. In addition, the spare lenses are quite light. I would assume you do not need to use the ground glass for focusing since you mentioned how slow the 4x5 is. So if you put the 6x9 back on the camera and the 150mm lens, you can carry the camera ready to fire and closed up. With a quick mount unipod it's the fastest interchangeable lens and back 2x3 camera ever made. The Topcon lenses are great. Just a hair less than Nikkor lenses. BTY You can unscrew the elements and mount your favorite optics on the Seikosha shutters.</p>

<p>I've used the horseman 985 for years. It's a cool contraption, but it has its frustrations too. The rangefinder focusing is wonderful: very bright, very acurate. The separate viewfinder is a pain - it's almost impossible to compose using one of several concentric frames. I've considered getting an external finder as one solution to that problem. The few times I've overcome the ergonomic challenges and done handhold portraits with a Nikkor M 105 mm at wide apertures, the results were pretty stunning: lots of detail in the subject with beautifully blurred backgrounds.</p>

<p>Have you looked at Graflex XL? It's a 6x9 press camera with coupled rangefinder. Quite compact in size and light weight when compared to Mamiya Universal or Linhof Technika Press with similar designs. </p>

<p>To Paul Droluk<br>

Thanks for reply.Look like the camera i need.Where can i get one?<br>

edvard</p>

<p>To Michael Sebastian:<br>

thanks for images</p>