Rokinon fisheyes for Nikon: Hd8m vs Fe8m?

I've been wanting to get a Rokinon fisheye for my Nikon D7500, but I'm very confused. The Hd8m one advertises an "auto-aperture" chip, but I've seen some stuff online that the only differences between the Hd8m and Fe8m are physical, not electronic.

Since I haven't ever shot with a manual focus lens before, I'm confused--are there any electronic advantages with the auto-aperture version in terms of communication with the camera that might make it easier for someone transitioning into a more manual lens? Or are the differences only related to the hood, which, as I understand it, wouldn't apply to someone shooting in DX?

Any help would be much appreciated!

The AE8M and FE8m are previous generation lenses. The former is 'chipped' while the latter is not.

The HD8m is a newer version of the AE8m. The HD version includes a removable hood, while the FE has a fixed hood. The newer HD is $40 cheaper.

All else being equal, I always get the chipped version, and always look for the latest version. In this case, they're one and the same: the HD8m. The fact that it is $40 cheaper makes this a no-brainer unless of course you MUST have a non-detachable hood.

As far as I can see from the web, the FE8M as no electronic connections. This means that with the D7500 or any D3x00 or 5x00 family camera it will not meter at all, and will be useable only in manual mode. The HD8m has an AF chip and contacts, so even though it focuses manually those cameras will recognize it and the meter will work - similar to the old AIP lenses which were manual focus but chipped.

Here's the Rokinon page for the FE8: Rokinon

And that for the HD8: Rokinon

The AE8M and FE8m are previous generation lenses. The former is 'chipped' while the latter is not.

 

The HD8m is a newer version of the AE8m. The HD version includes a removable hood, while the FE has a fixed hood. The newer HD is $40 cheaper.

 

All else being equal, I always get the chipped version, and always look for the latest version. In this case, they're one and the same: the HD8m. The fact that it is $40 cheaper makes this a no-brainer unless of course you MUST have a non-detachable hood.

Thanks so much.... For some reason, I was assuming AE8m was newer than the HD8m because the AE8m advertises both auto-aperture and auto-exposure, whereas HD8m only auto-aperture, but Amazon has the HD one first available a year (2012) after the AE one (2011). So, is the auto-exposure covered in the HD8m but just not advertised?

And, if I understand correctly, if I get the HD8m, I would set the lens itself to F22 so that it communicates with the D7500; and on the lens, I'd set the distance and then manually focus as needed; and, on the camera itself in AV mode, I set the F stop to whatever I want; and then wait for the focus confirmation to show up in the viewfinder--is that the gist of it? That's what I'm piecing together from forums, as it doesn't seem like Rokinon documents this much.

I really appreciate any further advice you could offer!

And, if I understand correctly, if I get the HD8m, I would set the lens itself to F22 so that it communicates with the D7500; and on the lens, I'd set the distance and then manually focus as needed; and, on the camera itself in AV mode, I set the F stop to whatever I want; and then wait for the focus confirmation to show up in the viewfinder--is that the gist of it? That's what I'm piecing together from forums, as it doesn't seem like Rokinon documents this much.

 

I really appreciate any further advice you could offer!

Yes to all of that if you want to get the focus confirmation with each and every shot. On a lens this wide, you can set the aperture (using the body) to f8, focus the lens to about 10 feet and everything between a foot a half to infinity will be "reasonably" in focus -- Google hyperfocal distance. That's typically how I would use a lens this wide -- almost like one ultra wide point and shoot.

Yes to all of that if you want to get the focus confirmation with each and every shot. On a lens this wide, you can set the aperture (using the body) to f8, focus the lens to about 10 feet and everything between a foot a half to infinity will be "reasonably" in focus -- Google hyperfocal distance. That's typically how I would use a lens this wide -- almost like one ultra wide point and shoot.

Sorry, one more question...I know that Rokinons also appear under the Bower and Samyang brand. Is the Samyang SYHD8M-N the same as the Rokinon HD8m-n? From the B&H page, it seems to be a similar update with the removable hood, but it also mentions an "an electronic circuit which allows for full control of exposure parameters accessible from the Nikon camera, including i-TTL flash communication and EXIF data with all Nikon Digital SLR cameras." Do you know if, like the Rokinon, that'd cover the auto-exposure, auto-aperture, and focus confirmation? It's so hard to tell given the variation in names, listings, and lack of documentation across the web. Thanks again!

If it has an AF chip, it should do all that an AF lens does, except for actually focusing. Of course since this is a third party lens one cannot be absolutely sure of how it operates, but a Nikon manual focus lens that is chipped operates the meter and the rest of the camera as if it were fully AF.

Auto aperture (in the old sense of the word, meaning that a lens is viewed wide open and shot at its set aperture) is present in any automatic lens, and that includes old manual lenses that do not meter on low end cameras. If this lens behaves as other chipped lenses do, it will work only with the aperture ring locked, and aperture chosen by the camera, and auto exposure will work normally.

Likewise, focus confirmation (as differentiated from the digital rangefinder option) is present for any lens, manual or not. The dot will function, and will also still follow the AF and spotmeter center point, even when AF is not present. A chipped lens should also allow you to select the digital rangefinder, which is an option that replaces the meter readout in the viewfinder (at least on the D3x00) in P,S, and A modes. It is enabled only for AF lenses and it never appears in M mode. But again, at least judging from the two chipped MF lenses I've tried (the 500/4AIP and the 85/2.8 Micro D), as well as the screwdriver focusing lenses, the rangefinder will work correctly.

But if you're shopping at B&H, you might just try asking the question directly. It's quite possible someone in a similar situation has tried it.

If it has an AF chip, it should do all that an AF lens does, except for actually focusing. Of course since this is a third party lens one cannot be absolutely sure of how it operates, but a Nikon manual focus lens that is chipped operates the meter and the rest of the camera as if it were fully AF.

 

Auto aperture (in the old sense of the word, meaning that a lens is viewed wide open and shot at its set aperture) is present in any automatic lens, and that includes old manual lenses that do not meter on low end cameras. If this lens behaves as other chipped lenses do, it will work only with the aperture ring locked, and aperture chosen by the camera, and auto exposure will work normally.

 

Likewise, focus confirmation (as differentiated from the digital rangefinder option) is present for any lens, manual or not. The dot will function, and will also still follow the AF and spotmeter center point, even when AF is not present. A chipped lens should also allow you to select the digital rangefinder, which is an option that replaces the meter readout in the viewfinder (at least on the D3x00) in P,S, and A modes. It is enabled only for AF lenses and it never appears in M mode. But again, at least judging from the two chipped MF lenses I've tried (the 500/4AIP and the 85/2.8 Micro D), as well as the screwdriver focusing lenses, the rangefinder will work correctly.

 

But if you're shopping at B&H, you might just try asking the question directly. It's quite possible someone in a similar situation has tried it.

Thanks again for all your help! I did end up getting the Samyang SYHD8M-N, which B&H confirmed is the same as the Rokinon HD8M-N. So far so good with the photo quality. One thing I've noticed that's a little odd....When I'm inside and looking through the view finder, I can see and move the black focus square around as normal, and, when I depress it like I would with my other lenses, the focus square goes red and then I take the photo (even if it's presumably not actually focusing). But, when I go outside and do the same, the focus square never goes red. That said, the photos seem OK either way. So I guess my two questions would be:

1. Is the red-only-sometimes of any concern and/or do I need to adapt anything I'm doing?

2. Assuming that the depress'ing isn't locking the focus or anything, does moving the focus square around actually do anything? From something you said above, it sounded like that was the case (the enormous depth of field notwithstanding), but I wanted to confirm.

Thanks again!

Through the viewfinder, the AF point goes red when the camera decides the scene is dark and the plain LCD marking would be hard to see. It pays attention to the light meter (at least on some cameras), so indoors it probably thinks it's dark, and lights it up so you can see it better (where a black square would be dim); outdoors there's more light (during the day) so illuminating the AF point would make it less visible. I've not checked the D7500 manual, but there may be options for configuring this.

The only lens-specific thing about this is that fisheye lenses tend to be relatively slow (especially if, without having followed all this thread, you've stopped down manually and the aperture lever isn't holding the aperture open), so the illumination will happen in brighter surrounding conditions. I suspect you could get the same behaviour out of your other lenses if you set them to a tiny aperture and used DoF preview.

So, with a massive disclaimer that I could be wrong and haven't seen your exact circumstances, I'd say everything is fine and that's what's supposed to happen.

Moving the focus square around should change where the electronic rangefinder is reading from. If you're manual focus, this will still affect the focus confirmation dot in the bottom left of the viewfinder - but it won't be very precise if you're at a small aperture. If you have a huge depth of field, there may well not be much difference between different areas of the image that are, from the camera's perspective, "in focus". To blur a background with a fish-eye, you need to get very close to the subject - I have one of one of my cats, and to get a blurred background I was focussed on her eyes, and her nose was almost touching the lens.

"Thanks again for all your help! I did end up getting the Samyang SYHD8M-N, which B&H confirmed is the same as the Rokinon HD8M-N."

- To avoid any future confusion; can we clarify that Samyang is the actual manufacturer of these lenses, and that Rokinon and Bower are simply 'badge engineers' that resell these South Korean made lenses under their own name.

In addition: The CPU versions add the ability to control the aperture from the camera body. This enables P and S modes to be used, and removes the need to enter non-CPU lens data into the camera menu.

I'm unsure whether AF fine tune can be used with these lenses to alter the precision of the AF confirmation dot. I'll have to experiment with my Samyang lenses, but so far I've found no need to use AF fine tune with these lenses.