Replacing velvet in Ica/Zeiss-Ikon Ideal plate holders?

I have ten Ica plate holders for my Zeiss-Ikon 250/7 Ideal. These

holders must be close to, if not beyond 80 years old, and while they

seem light tight when closed, I've recently noted that at least a

couple of them leak substantially through the dark slide slot when the

slide is out (characteristic fan of light shows long cast shadows from

dust grains that would otherwise be almost unnoticable on the film),

especially in relatively bright outdoor conditions.

 

Obviously, the solution would be to replace the velvets in the dark

slide slot. Unfortunately, I don't see any screws or other fasteners

that would permit disassembly of the plate holder. Does anyone have

suggestions on how to remove and replace the velvet? Velvet ribbon

isn't hard to come by, if I can just figure how to get it in there.

You don't have to remove the slide. I just pull it out until I know that the film is uncovered and ready for exposure. Some darkslides have markings for that, like this one from KW.

As above, you get better light-tightness if you do not remove the dark slide completely from the holder. I have marked my darkslides with a line that shows when the dark slide has cleared the film opening. Of course, then you have to remember which holders are previously exposed without flipping the darkslide. I put exposed holders in ziplock bags.

Hi Donald! I got some light blocking material from Jon Goodman. It's priced right and does the job perfectly! I needed the velvet to be thicker, so I just stacked some of his material. Works great.

 

BTW, once I got the film holders nice and tight, leaks in the back of the camera started to show themselves. I replaced that material with the exact same stuff.

 

It would be nice if it were thicker, but that's not available anywhere. Stacking works for me. I'd check out Jon on it. If I needed more I wouldn't hesitate to call him.

Can you get the velvet wet, and then carefully fluff it for maximal fuzz and let it dry?

 

I don't know about your plate holders, but the Kodak ones for the Recomar 33 have VERY deep plush, about 1/8". They must be wool, one of mine appears to be moth-eaten. (Just won't try and use that one.)

 

Also, can you make the camera push out at that point? I think the Recomar 33 has a bit of a bulge there. Or put some ribbon on the camera!

After having to deal with a few types of these holders, I have come to the conclusin that some of them seem to use a material more similar to mohair upholstery fabric. Almost like the seats in my deceased '35 Chevy.

Ah, is *that* what those marks on the KW dark slides are for! And those have the little spring tab that flips up when the slide is withdrawn, too, so you don't have to flip them to know when they're exposed.

 

Unfortunately, all the answers about how thick the replacement material has to be don't really help with my question -- these holders (on closer examination) appear to be soldered or brazed together (seems to me an odd way to make them, given the spring latch assembly inside the lower end and the double velvet in the dark slide slot, but there it is). There's no velvet at all on the camera with these; there's a light trap between the holder and the camera body instead (a protrusion around the image area of the holder overlaps into the opening in the camera back, much more secure than velvet), but there is velvet on both sides of the dark slide slot, and that's what's deteriorated (there's no other possible source for a light leak so nearly parallel to the film, and only a couple holders are affected). And with no apparent way to disassemble the holder to get it out, it doesn't much matter what I can come up with to replace it.

 

I agree, it's not very similar to modern velvet, and in the holders on both my Kawee Camera and my Ideal, the velvet is reddish purple, though the camera side velvet on the Kawee is black. It might well be wool; suitable synthetics didn't exist yet in the 1920s when these cameras were designed, so wool, cotton, linen, or silk were pretty much the choices.

 

What I'm after here is how to get the velvet out and replacement material back in -- once I can do that, I'll figure out what to use (foam isn't suitable for the sliding seal, though it might serve as a backing for modern, shorter-pile synthetic velvet). How they heck did they get it in there at the factory? They couldn't have brazed or soldered the holder together with the velvet already in place, could they?

-- these holders (on closer examination) appear to be soldered or brazed together (seems to me an odd way to make them, given the spring latch assembly inside the lower end and the double velvet in the dark slide slot, but there it is). There's no velvet at all on the camera with these; there's a light trap between the holder and the camera body instead (a protrusion around the image area of the holder overlaps into the opening in the camera back, much more secure than velvet), but there is velvet on both sides of the dark slide slot, and that's what's deteriorated (there's no other possible source for a light leak so nearly parallel to the film, and only a couple holders are affected). And with no apparent way to disassemble the holder to get it out, it doesn't much matter what I can come up with to replace it.

What I'm after here is how to get the velvet out and replacement material back in -- once I can do that, I'll figure out what to use (foam isn't suitable for the sliding seal, though it might serve as a backing for modern, shorter-pile synthetic velvet). How they heck did they get it in there at the factory? They couldn't have brazed or soldered the holder together with the velvet already in place, could they?

 

I just bought a bunch of 726/6 holders - took me forever to find them -

they are rusty and dirty, but that I can deal with -

replacing the cloth light seal is the real problem. Both ends of the back and front plates of the holder are brazed together in the corners. Did you ever find a solution?

Thanks