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Pocket Wizard TT1 and TT5 don't work


ian_casement

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<p>This is just a continuation of more problems I'm having with this setup and it gets more bizarre and ridiculous !</p>

<p>I just did a quick test of TTL using two remote SB800s on TT5's with an SB900 on a TT1 mounted on a D3x.</p>

<p>First off.. strange pops of light for no apparent reason when setting up, not such an issue, but weird. Then there seems to be a tendancy to full dump on occasions or no sync at all on changes of ratio, which can be lived with, as long as it's not constant. I also had a case where the D3x wouldn't activate or wake up the SB900 from standby, no matter what shutter button, body light anything could fix apart from a shutdown and reset of the SB900.</p>

<p>But then, even more bizarre.. after trying TTL with two remotes, I switch from TTL using channels A and B to using single channel A, now with both remote flashes set to Manual 1/4 power each.. and I get no sync with the remotes whatsoever - Nothing. The on camera flash fires 1/128 as set. But the remotes do nothing.</p>

<p>I removed the on camera flash and tried that. Still no sync.</p>

<p>Switch everything off, reset each of the remotes, reset camera, without SB900 in TT1 hotshoe, remotes now work. OK, add the SB900 flash - and the remotes don't work again.</p>

<p>Turn everything off again and start from scratch.</p>

<p>Remotes first, with the flashes switched on first, then the on camera SB900, then the TT1, then the camera and... still doesn't work!! The on camera flash works. The remotes don't.</p>

<p>Am I getting angry and the client getting grumpy? No, because I'm just testing this and the only thing that's happening is I'm getting angry.. but just imagine !</p>

<p>Remove the on camera flash, remotes still don't fire.</p>

<p>Reset on camera TT1 without an on camera flash and the remotes fire.</p>

<p>Don't expect to use a flash in the hotshoe of the on camera TT1 and use remote manual flash at the same time. It just doesn't work.</p>

<p>This doesn't work with D3x, D2x, D7000.</p>

<p>Does anybody have this working with any other camera ?</p>

<p> </p>

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<p>If you can return it, just do it.<br>

Else, ... try to download the firware upgrade, and watch out for any new patches that could come again.<br>

I am really sorry to hear this, as I had high hopes for this system.</p>

<p>Knowing little how CLS works, and a bit how PW did that, and seeing contradictions in written reviews about it, and PW lack of good explanation how this works, or what it did to the CLS, I was sceptical about it.</p>

<p>Below are links to prior discussions on this subject.<br>

About SB400 and remote use of CLS flashes not in Remote mode, but rather in iTTL mode under PW control:<br>

<a href="00YEr9?start=10">http://www.photo.net/nikon-camera-forum/00YEr9?start=10</a></p>

<p>More if to use it or not, ... and <strong>I apologize for recommending the product without testing it myself:</strong><br>

<a href="../photography-lighting-equipment-techniques-forum/00YDXo">http://www.photo.net/photography-lighting-equipment-techniques-forum/00YDXo</a></p>

<p>A bit about a review:<br>

<a href="00YAWZ">http://www.photo.net/nikon-camera-forum/00YAWZ</a></p>

<p>..even more of the same:<br>

<a href="../photography-lighting-equipment-techniques-forum/00Y5Q8">http://www.photo.net/photography-lighting-equipment-techniques-forum/00Y5Q8</a></p>

<p>About the firmware upgrade:</p>

<p><a href="../photography-lighting-equipment-techniques-forum/00Y3RM">http://www.photo.net/photography-lighting-equipment-techniques-forum/00Y3RM</a></p>

<p> </p>

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<p>Hi Ian</p>

<p>sorry to hear about your troubles</p>

<p>I have no TT1 but use a TT5 as transmitter for 4 other TT5's as receivers, although not with a flash as master but a SU800 and recently a AC3 as master steering units. My flashes are SB800, SB600 and SB400, camera's D3 and D2x (does not work properly with D70S so far)</p>

<p>To begin with, is all the software on your units up to date? There was an update due to problems with the SB900. Also keep in mind that if the Hyper Synch option on the units is swithed on (by selection through the software ultility) the Nikon FP synch does not work.</p>

<p>Second, the flash that goes of when a unit is switched on is normal, I'd worry more if the unit does not give off a flash after switching the TT5 on.</p>

<p>Also the switching-on sequence has to be followed very strictly. Although from what I read you're following the right procedure (including I assume not putting the remote flash units in 'remote' mode) I'll describe my routine.</p>

<p>Everything is switched off, then for the transmitter first switch on the master flash (or in my case SU800), then the TT5/TT1, then the camera. The AC3 does not have an own powersource as it uses the one of the TT5 so it does not need to be switched on. If all goes well the light on the back will blink at regular intervals. For the receiver first the flash, then the TT5 and again the light on the TT5 will blink green. As I don't use one I don't know if the masterflash on the transmitter gives of a flash, but the receivers do if things work properly. I have noticed though that when the flash-units on the receivers are switched to manual they dont give off the 'trial' flash.</p>

<p>Battery condition is very important I've read, although I use the alkaline ones I have lying around so not brand new ones every time I use the TT5's.</p>

<p>First shot is for the system to synchronise so exposure should be out synch.</p>

<p>There here been reports that when the TT1 goes in sleep mode (which apperently is does very easy for battery saving purposes), and you want to start shooting again, you have to start/reset the whole thing up again, so that's in accordance what you reported.</p>

<p>You already mentioned the ABC channel selection, and as you probably know there is no need to synchonise the CH1 and CH2 when switching the units on if using only TT1 and TT5's.</p>

<p>I don't know what you mean with resetting the units (apart from closing down and restarting them in the order mentioned before) but personally I stay away from the test/learn button and make a test shot with the camera to check if everything works properly.</p>

<p>Well, this is everything I can come up with, sorry I can't help you any further as for me so far it has been an out of the box, upload software and shoot away expericence. Anyway HTH</p>

<p>Paul</p>

<p> </p>

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<p>Frank, Firmware is up to date on all units, I did that as soon as I openned the box, so that's not the issue.</p>

<p>I have already gone through a setup procedure to establish the best offset value to use the cameras I have in order to set up the highest Hypersync speed and flash benefit I can get, which is up to 1/800s which is great, especially if you switch that to useable increase of output or distance gain, but I fully expected to be able to use this with the Hypersync/HSS crossover facility, but can't as the ControlTL software only allows 1/640s FP activation which reduces the Hypersync use to a max speed of 1/500s losing 0.6 stop benefit.</p>

<p>Then, if using the Hypersync/HSS crossover with a flash on the camera's TT1 you get no flash between 1/320s and 1/500s as it doesn't work. There's a workaround which allows this to work, and I fully believe it should work, but doesn't, and it only works using the workaround for as long as the camera/flash don't go into standby.</p>

<p>Then, you can't just use a standard flash using a pin and rail sync as a remote flash on a TT5 hotshoe, if you just want to sync an SB80 or SB28 or the like.</p>

<p>Then, this.</p>

<p>Paul, can you use a speedlight on your on camera TT5 in manual 1/128 and trigger a remote on a TT5 with that remote set to any manual level ? I can't and it's crazy.</p>

 

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<p>Ian, seems that you need to go back to square one to try and figure out if your problem is hardware malfunction, software bugs or user error.<br>

<br /> Make a factory reset of the TT1 and TT5 units.</p>

<p>Start by trying old school triggering. Flash should be in manual. If you have older PWs try with them as well.<br /> Does it work or not?</p>

<p>BTW, good professional work on your website.</p>

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<p>Thanks Pete,<br>

OK, at this point I'm happy to try anything and everything as I pretty much believe these things are rubbish and don't work. This problem is just the icing on the cake. :(</p>

<p>I reset a TT1 and 2 TT5's, waiting for the 4 flashes each time to indicate they were factory reset. I'm using v2 build 100 firmware.</p>

<p>I put an SB800 on a remote TT5, powered up the SB, Manual 1/4 power, then powered up the TT5, CH1 Zone A.</p>

<p>I put an SB900 on a TT1 in the hotshoe of a D3x. Powered up the SB900 Manual 1/128, powered up the TT1 turned on the camera - Shutterspeed was 1/200s (1/250s - normal x-sync).</p>

<p>Shot a few frames - All blank. Changed TT5 receiver and went through the whole procedure again. The same. All blank.</p>

<p>Turned everything off, took the SB900 off the hotshoe of the TT1 on the D3x, turned everything back on again and the remote fired. (No flash in hotshoe/TT1 on camera)</p>

<p>Now, can somebody else try this, as I've spent 30 years as a professional photographer and although I understand that user error can come into these things, often it takes somebody else to confirm the problem exists and isn't just a figment of imagination.</p>

<p>Thanks for the compliment (it could do with updating) :)</p>

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<p>Thanks Pete,<br>

OK, at this point I'm happy to try anything and everything as I pretty much believe these things are rubbish and don't work. This problem is just the icing on the cake. :(</p>

<p>I reset a TT1 and 2 TT5's, waiting for the 4 flashes each time to indicate they were factory reset. I'm using v2 build 100 firmware.</p>

<p>I put an SB800 on a remote TT5, powered up the SB, Manual 1/4 power, then powered up the TT5, CH1 Zone A.</p>

<p>I put an SB900 on a TT1 in the hotshoe of a D3x. Powered up the SB900 Manual 1/128, powered up the TT1 turned on the camera - Shutterspeed was 1/200s (1/250s - normal x-sync).</p>

<p>Shot a few frames - All blank. Changed TT5 receiver and went through the whole procedure again. The same. All blank.</p>

<p>Turned everything off, took the SB900 off the hotshoe of the TT1 on the D3x, turned everything back on again and the remote fired. (No flash in hotshoe/TT1 on camera)</p>

<p>Now, can somebody else try this, as I've spent 30 years as a professional photographer and although I understand that user error can come into these things, often it takes somebody else to confirm the problem exists and isn't just a figment of imagination.</p>

<p>Thanks for the compliment (it could do with updating) :)</p>

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<p>Hi Ian</p>

<p>just did a test in the set up you requested inside, with remote approx 3, 5 and 8 meters from camera, also hidden behind the bench</p>

<p>Master<br /> D3 + 24-85mm with TT5 C 1 Channel A<br /> and SB800 in Mastermode M Manual mode 1/128 <br /> A Manual mode 1/4<br /> (also Manual Mode 1/16 and 1/2)</p>

<p>Remote<br /> TT5 C 1 Channel A<br /> and SB 800 Remote off Manual Mode 1/8<br /> (also tried out TTL /FP)</p>

<p>No problem, triggers as it should and output reduction is performed according to value selected on the Master flash/unit<br /> No matter the setting on the remote flash (TTL or Manual) the Master dictates the output</p>

<p>But when reading your request and your latest explanation of how you set your flashes I wonder if you left the flash in the remote TT5 unit with the Remote setting in the flash OFF, and dialed in the reduced Manual setting for the remote in the A channel of the Masterflash</p>

<p>Hope this helps</p>

<p>Paul</p>

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<p>Hi Ian</p>

<p>just reread your last message and with all due respect really get the impression it might be user error</p>

<p>I completely miss in your extensive explanation any indication on putting the SB900 in Master Mode, and dialing in the various settings for the master and remote flash from the menu of the SB900</p>

<p>And also you don't mention leaving the remote SB800 itself in Remote OFF, while at the same time you seem to want to dial in the strenghth of the output of the remote unit in the flash itself rather then steering it from the Master unit.</p>

<p>Look forward to your feedback</p>

<p>Paul</p>

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<p>This is the way I understand it:</p>

<p>Remote slaves:</p>

<p>1) All slave flashes that are to be controlled at the flash and not part of TTL needs to be set to manual and whatever power needed. The TT5 unit itself needs to be programmed so the “Use ControlTL Channel for Rx” is NOT selected. This way the TT5 works the same as an old style PW. This means you can hook up any flash or strobe to a TT5.</p>

<p>2) All supported slave flashes that are to be controlled remotely needs to be in regular iTTL mode, same as when they are in the hotshoe as a single flash.</p>

<p>On camera trigger:</p>

<p>3) If you don't have a flash in the TT1/TT5 that is on the camera you will control your slave flash mode TTL/Manual and ratio or flash power from the camera.</p>

<p>4) If you do have a flash in the TT1/TT5 that is on the camera you will need to set the flash to MASTER. You will now control your slave flash mode TTL/Manual and ratio or flash power from the master flash.</p>

<p>Paul K, do you concur?</p>

<p> </p>

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<p>Forgot this one:</p>

<p>5) If you want to put your TT1/TT5 on a non supported camera and use it as an old style PW you need to set it to "Basic Trigger Mode". All remote slaves needs to be old style PWs or TT5 units that has “Use ControlTL Channel for Rx” NOT selected.</p>

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<p>Hi Paul, thanks for trying that, but it's not what I'm trying to do.</p>

<p>What you explain works OK with my setup, but it fires pre-flashes even though the flashes are in manual. I'm going to be using up to 8 other remotes which are powered by either Wein's or built-in PEC's which will all trigger at the wrong time if I use any sort of pre-flash system, so this is trying to be avoided.</p>

<p>All I want to do with the TT1/TT5 is simply trigger an on camera flash and remote flashes using a basic trigger mode in manual without any pre-flashes. I specifically don't have the on camera flash set as a master and I don't have the remotes set to TTL. I just want them to trigger in plain simple manual mode.</p>

<p>I can use the remotes triggered by the TT1/TT5, each set to manual mode, but I then can't add an on camera flash should I need to and trigger that at the same time, if I add an on camera flash, then only the on camera flash will fire.</p>

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<p>Pete,<br>

<em>'4) If you do have a flash in the TT1/TT5 that is on the camera you will need to set the flash to MASTER. You will now control your slave flash mode TTL/Manual and ratio or flash power from the master flash.'</em></p>

<p>That's what I'm not doing as I'm trying to avoid the pre-flash.</p>

<p>It appears that you can't have both an on camera flash set Manually as well as remotes, even though the remotes will work fine in their native manual mode and triggered by the ControlTL channel.</p>

<p>Thanks for your help, that clears things up a bit.</p>

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<p>Ian, if I understand you correctly everything works as you want until you put an on camera flash onto the TT1?</p>

<p>As a workaround you could put some tape over the hotshoe contacts on the SB900 and hook it up to the camera's pc sync. Or maybe if you cover all contacts except the center pin and see if the SB900 will fire in manual mounted on the TT1.</p>

<p>PS. In your case I would try to contact LPA Design directly in the US. Maybe you are experiencing some software issues they are familiar with. The Nikon version is still fairly new.<br /> U.S. customer service: 914-347-3300</p>

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<p>I don't own the TT5 and TT1, yet. But based on what little research I have done I thought the remote flashes were to be set to TTL/iTTL mode. Flash is then controlled via the AC3/SU800/SB900 on-camera. To avoid pre-flashes, use either the AC3 or SU800. Manual settings are controlled via the AC3/SU800/SB900 and not on the remote flash. I don't see how the system could work if the remote units are set to anything but "0n". (i.e., not master, not remote, just "on".)</p>
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<p>Pete,</p>

<p>This was one issue, correct.</p>

<p>Further than just that was using an on camera flash, (or on bracket flash, without remotes this time) and using hypersync with the on camera flash. It doesn't want to do it.</p>

<p>In order to set an on camera flash to use hypersync, you need to go through a workaround and setup routine and do your shots without allowing the camera to go into standby. When it does, it stops working again and you need to start the workaround again.</p>

<p>I emailed PW over a week ago (twice) about this and have still had no reply, still waiting.. :(</p>

<p>I found the PC socket solution, as I had that in mind for use with another set of radio triggers for the other eight lights. I should have realised to put a sync cable in there for an on camera flash instead, but it just seemed so logical to be able to use the TT1 hotshoe for a flash.</p>

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<p>Douglas,</p>

<p>I don't know if the pre-flashes are from the on camera SB900 or the remote SB800's for sure. I thought the on camera pre-flashes - like the SU800's were quenched and radio was used instead. Whatever it is, using a Master controller with remotes in Manual there's pre-flashes of sorts whether they're command signals or pre-flashes, I don't know.</p>

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<p>Quote :What you explain works OK with my setup, but it fires pre-flashes even though the flashes are in manual. I'm going to be using up to 8 other remotes which are powered by either Wein's or built-in PEC's which will all trigger at the wrong time if I use any sort of pre-flash system, so this is trying to be avoided. Unquote</p>

<p>I think I now understand what you mean. Basically using one radio transmitter on camera to trigger a remote radio receiver with the flash in Manual, and have that remote trigger a number of other flash units with an opticall signal. In that case the PW TT1/TT5 units are not suited and way to expensive for the job.</p>

<p>Quote: All I want to do with the TT1/TT5 is simply trigger an on camera flash and remote flashes using a basic trigger mode in manual without any pre-flashes. I specifically don't have the on camera flash set as a master and I don't have the remotes set to TTL. I just want them to trigger in plain simple manual mode. Unquote</p>

<p>Only way I know by experience to do so would be using the Master flash in Manual, without a PW TT1/TT5 and putting the remote SB800's in SU4 mode. Of course you will have to set everything manually and as said the TT1/TT5 units are not fit for this job. Also the triggering will be optical and less reliable then when using radio.</p>

<p>Quote: I can use the remotes triggered by the TT1/TT5, each set to manual mode, but I then can't add an on camera flash should I need to and trigger that at the same time, if I add an on camera flash, then only the on camera flash will fire.Unquote</p>

<p>The TT1/TT5 will work with the PW PLus II and other older PW units which are strictly manual so I assume that in those cases the pre-flashes are ignored. Here's a video with in the second half a shoot with mixed use of the TT1/TT5's and PW Plus II's.

I don't have the older ones so can't comment or test myself, but maybe it might be worth looking into those or the cheaper imitation ones.</p>

<p>For me personally reason for getting the TT5's was the extended range while maintaining TTL compared to Nikon CLS infrared as going strictly manual was never my intention. Also being able to change the settings on remote units from the master unit (flash/SU800/AC3) for me was a major lure.</p>

<p>But for shooting manual and by optical triggering, it seems to me the TT1/TT5's are not the tools for the/your job. In case you insist on triggering by radio you would be better of with the 'older' PW Plus II's or cheaper imitations, or if Radiopopper JRX</p>

<p>My two cents</p>

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<p>An interesting thread, because to my knowledge these products for Nikon are not yet released. That is true where I live. PocketWizard had lots and lots of problems with the Canon versions and it seems like it is a repeat with the Nikon as well, although I have been assured this is not the case from beta testers. <br>

Where did you buy them?</p>

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<p>Hi Steven</p>

<p>the TT1/TT5 for Nikon have been availible since december last year. They were a.o. announced on the site of Rob Galbraith http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/multi_page.asp?cid=7-10057-11055</p>

<p>I can based on my own experiences ( and not on what I read on the internet) confirm what the beta testers told you i.e. that they work flawlessly. I have aquired 5 TT5's and a AC3 since last december and although I'm only slowly learning to use them to their full potentitial I find them a major tool to further help me solve some of the tecgnical problems I sometimes encounter.</p>

<p>Got them at Calumet in Amsterdam, but from what I read they are readily availible in at least Europe, US and Canada, Australia and Asia. B&H has them in their catalog http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/605715-REG/PocketWizard_801_143_MiniTT1_Radio_Slave_Transmitter.html</p>

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<p>My units are from the UK. I've been watching development of these with interest over the years with specific interest in the hypersync and any increase in output available (like there is with the Canon versions).</p>

<p>Like the lack of extra output that the Nikon system has compared to Canon. The fact you can sync remote flashes in whatever mode including manual and an on camera flash in whatever mode including manual, yet you can't sync both on camera and remote flashes together at the same time are failings. (CLS can, PW can't - and I was sold that they were the same over radio). </p>

<p>H<a></a><a></a>ypersync too fails as it only works correctly when syncing remote units and then only to a limited degree imposed by PW (1/500s rather than the full benefit your system can offer, mine is 1/800s).. This works fine on camera too, yet, not just restricted within the constraints of the PW system but by having to use a workaround as well, which shouldn't be neccessary.</p>

<p>Other things not working like being able to sync a pin and rail basic speedlight in manual on a TT5's hotshoe mount whether using ControlTL transmission or standard transmission with remotes set to act like a Plus II or Multimax is annoying. PW say that a TT1 can transmit that channel and a TT5 can recive that channel, but transmit and receive on that same channel don't work together in this way. It's annoying because when you need to use it, you know you're going to be stumped, and that's just a simple function.</p>

<p>Where people are excited by being able to control flash units over radio, I've been doing this for years with Quantum so this part of the excitement is less persuasive for me, I'm more interested in using their benefits, as they exist for me and the way they're needed to work.</p>

<p>I'm no beta tester, and my experience up to now hasn't been flawless .</p>

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<p>You need to be careful not to confuse Hypersync with High Speed Sync.</p>

<p>High Speed Sync is the same as the Nikon FP mode sync and suffers from the same loss of around -2.6 stops pretty much right throughout the shutter range to 1/8000s. Hypersync is the PW derivative and shifts the flash and shutter sync to some optimal point to suit your flash. With this, you can get either greater range, more flash on subject or darker backgrounds. Even a combination of all three utilising the extent of the advantage afforded by your own flash and camera combination. In my circumstances, I can get either an extra 20ft range or 1.6 stops more flash on the subject or darken the background by 1.6 stops. Beyond this point (1/800s for me) image quality suffers, shutter curtains get seen and range reduces.</p>

<p>Being capable of 1/8000s sync is fine, but there needs to be some reason or benefit to do this. Typically people sacrifice output for larger apertures using HSS and think that they can darken backgrounds more at the same time, which isn't the case.</p>

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<p>Pocket Wizard admits switching to FP at higher shutter speeds, let say at some 1/320, or 1/500, some claim 1/800 sec. depending on the camera. Faster than that Hypersync is the same as FP. The FP technology in Nikon FP flashes plays here. After FP takes over, there is no special magic that people seem to attribute to the PW Hypersync.</p>
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<p>You can set the switch over point between Hypersync and FP mode easy enough in the software, or not use FP mode at all if you can sync cleanly with Hypersync. You can decide. I'd rather not let any 'auto' switching take place by settings applied by PW as I like to know just what I'm getting and what result to expect.</p>

<p>I'd like to push the Hypersync as far as possible because I never use HSS anyway. My cutoff point is 1/800s and after this I would like to activate HSS as a precaution. Unfortunately this is restricted by the software to a 1/640s cutoff, meaning a maximum 1/500s Hypersync capability. So instead I have HSS switched off and I'll have to watch I don't go beyond.</p>

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