peter_may Posted October 9, 1998 Share Posted October 9, 1998 The forum seems to be a bit slow lately, so let me pose this question that I've been thinking about lately. How many of your nature shots are well-planned and thought out in advance, i.e., you make it a point to be at a specific location at a particular time to capture a subject, as opposed to "grab shots" for which you happen to be lucky enough to be at the right place at the right time? Is there a noticeable difference in the percentage of keepers between the two categories? For some subjects, the pre-planned shots are obviously not real predictable, but for others... I find myself thinking more these days more about shots of the pre-meditated kind, but also find that I often don't follow through. Just curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m._huber Posted October 9, 1998 Share Posted October 9, 1998 Actually I've had bad luck with both. Ex. As I passed a river on the way home, I passed a perfect scene and I acutally had my camera with me. I got a half roll of great shots--except, in my excitement, I neglected to turn off the date imprint from the previous shooting. I set up at the same place four times, but didn't get the needed sunset once. Or the time I traveled 90 miles to be at the right place at 7:00 a.m. That was the day the sky was so overcast, the lake blended in with the sky. Unlike Galen Rowell, I can't seem to predict the right place at the right time On the other hand, my macro shots are carefully planned and usually turn out quite well. So for me, it's a toss-up. I do have a general plan as to where and when. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piaw Posted October 9, 1998 Share Posted October 9, 1998 It seems to me that the two blur together. Here's an example: I visited Yosemite over labor day weekend. On the first evening, it was overcast and rainy, drowning out any possibility of any evening sunset pictures. Driving back to camp, however, I spotted a foggy situation near the top of a pass. Thinking quickly, I realized that the reduced visibility allowed me to isolate some interesting looking rocks and trees without the surrounding area's cars, highway, etc , and I quickly stopped, ran out with my tripod, and shot a roll of film. One of those pictures turned out beautifully. <p> The next day, I was up at Glacier Point waiting for the Alpenglow on Half-Dome. The cliche picture, I know, but I wanted it. The weather, once again refused to cooperate, and after waiting for 3 hours for the storm to let some light through, I gave up and packed up. As I was driving away, however, the clouds parted. Upon spotting the situation, I quickly pulled over at the next viewpoint, set everything up, and proceeded to shoot another roll to take advantage of the situtation, trying every lens I had with me. The result was a look at half-dome with pinkish-red Alpenglow that I've never seen before. Not a cliche at all. <p> In conclusion, I have to say that how you fare depends very much on your ability to react to the changing light. It is one thing to be somewhere at the right time, but it is another thing to creatively use the situation to provide a good picture. If the light or weather doesn't cooperate, changing your goals rather than sticking rigidly to a shooting plan is the only way to get pictures worth looking at. Even when everything cooperates, you still have to work. Galen Rowell's most famous picture is "Rainbow over Portola Palace." But you have to remember that there were others who got off the bus at the same time as him, but they stayed in position and took snap-shots. Only Rowell had the insight that if he ran a couple of miles in a particular direction, he could line up the rainbow with the palace. Even when he reached that position, he had to wait around for some time until the clouds opened up enough to light up the palace. <p> I've watched Rowell in the field, and he is definitely not afraid to pack up his tripod, walk a few steps away and then suddenly see that the light had changed entirely and looked better, and proceed to redo the entire shoot. It might not get him a better picture every time, but having the persistence to keep trying is why he gets as many good pictures as he does. Luck does play a role in great pictures, but as the saying goes, good luck only happens to those who are prepared for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stanley_mcmanus Posted October 9, 1998 Share Posted October 9, 1998 I guess it depends on what you call planning. If planning includes bringing the right body, lens, film and accessories to get the opportunistic photo that suddenly presents itself, then I guess most of my shots are planned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derek_ferrington Posted October 9, 1998 Share Posted October 9, 1998 Most of my photographs are not well planned. I like to explore an area, especially if I have never been there, to see what it offers. I photograph subjects that grab my attention or that I think are interisting. Many times while exploring I will see something that would make a great photograph eventhough it is not the best time to shoot it. This is when I start planning shots. I'll rememer the location and come back at the optimum time or season. <p> After you have an idea for a photograph in your head, be sure to pay attention to the weather reports. However, the weather is so unpredictable at times that you need to be prepaired for whatever happens. Many times I have waited at a particular location to photograph a pre-planned idea, only to have it ruined by the weather. When that happens try to look for something else to photograph. Don't let that one missed oportunity destroy your creatvity. Make the best out of whatever happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe_boyd Posted October 9, 1998 Share Posted October 9, 1998 I have a lot more time to photograph within a few miles (25 or less) of home, as is probably pretty common with most of us. Over a period of time, I'll find particular areas that may have some particularly interesting subject, generally wildlife or landscape. I'll go back through these areas from time to time to see what's going on. I recently had an experience where this worked quite well. On a pond within ten miles of home, a flock of 150 egrets would congregate to feed for about 30 minutes to an hour around sunrise. Their appearence was extremely regular and I was able to photograph several rolls over several days. It made getting up at 4:30 am very worthwhile;) <p> It's not so much a situation where I know exactly what I'm going to find in any particular area at a particular time. I have an idea of what sort of weather conditions, or time of day, will create possibly interesting light in particular locations and try to be there about that time. Determing the feeding times and areas of wildlife dramatically increases the chances of success. <p> The old saying, "f/8 and being there" implies that you know where to be and when to be there. I think a combination of reasearch (theoretical), and trial and error (empirical), knowledge will put you in the right place at the right time. You have to apply the research to the particular environment you're in to determine the results. For instance, I have been told, and have seen, deer on the wildlife refuge near my home. In order to get some pictures of deer, I need to do some reading to find out what they feed on, what time of day, what time of year I'm likely to find a doe with a fawn, etc. Then I have to look for those areas at particular times of the day and year. Just like hunting, but different end results. Likewise, I don't plan many outings for the middle of the day, because I know my chances of success are pretty slim of finding a suitable subject or light. <p> So, as far as visualizing specific images I don't do much of it, but I do try to determine lighting effects and timing from other images I've seen that I like, as well as having an idea when a particular subject might be in a given area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jto1 Posted October 9, 1998 Share Posted October 9, 1998 Piaw Na makes two excellent points: <p> 1) If the light or weather doesn't cooperate, changing your goals rather than sticking rigidly to a shooting plan is the only way to get pictures worth looking at. Even when everything cooperates, you still have to work. <p> 2) Luck does play a role in great pictures, but as the saying goes, good luck only happens to those who are prepared for it. <p> Those two things being said, I use both methods. I have set up for a number of interesting shots on many occasions, and I also stumble across many others. Sometimes I get exactly what I wanted, and sometimes not. But I find that even though the weather or light sometimes bags when I am looking for a particular shot, adapting to the changing situation and trying things from a different approach works well for me (rather than giving up, and calling it a day). I often end up with great shots other than the one I was initially attempting to get. Even when the pictures are of the original target, but under different circumstances than I had imagined/wanted! I can (hopefully) come back for the initial goal some other time. <p> I would guess that perhaps part of the reason that Peter might not follow through on pre-planned shots often is because of the rigidity of "the plan", and/or the significant effort that is sometimes involved. If you subscribe to the philosophy of "I have to be there at 6:47 AM, at this spot, with this tripod height, this lens, this filter, this weather, etc", and that is the only acceptable shot that you are after, then perhaps this rigidity is somehow subconsciously unattractive to him, and that is why he doesn't follow through. Who knows.... When I plan a shot, and it doesn't work out quite right, I make the best of it, and move on...Of course if you spent a lot of money and/or time getting to the location, it hurts a little more to have it pass by. I am just making general comments here, not a cost/benefit analysis.... <p> IMHO, combine both methods (but don't be obcessed with either), enjoy yourself, and when the situation changes, adapt. Have fun with it. <p> Oh yeah....The method used doesn't seem to make a tremendous difference in the number of keepers that I get. When things work out with either method, I usually get keepers. When they don't, then I end up with little or nothing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul_lenson1 Posted October 9, 1998 Share Posted October 9, 1998 I've found also that being flexible is the only way since there are too many variables involved ( light, wind, weather, etc). However, I return to locations through the seasons where I know what I can generally expect to find and then be flexible enough to recognize the opportunities as they present themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m._huber Posted October 9, 1998 Share Posted October 9, 1998 I think we are all saying the same thing. In my case, when plan A didn't work because of the cloudy day, I went to plan B: "Wing It" Since the people for whom I was taking the pictures didn't know about plan A, they thought the pictures were great. (They were good - but not like the one I had planned). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marv_thompson Posted October 10, 1998 Share Posted October 10, 1998 Joe Boyd's experience especially, and a lot of the others also, mirror my own, to a great degree, especially when it comes to the proximity from, and frequency of visits to, a given area. The more familiar I become with a given area, in the various seasons and times of day, the greater the chance that my visit will be planned. The selection of actual subject matter and specific location still seem to be more luck than planning. I will have an idea of lighting and general areas that should yield some results, beyond that it is still search and shoot. <p> Luck favors the prepared photographer, and the better you know your equiptment, abilities, subject and terrain the more likely you are to "plan" and image, and the lees likely that you will rely soley on luck. <p> As to percentage of keepers, I might give the edge to the "planned" images, where I was there at a time I thought might produce results. I tend not to produce images in situations where they might not come out, but instead, use the time to get to know an area and determine a time that might be more condusive to photography. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_j._kravit Posted October 10, 1998 Share Posted October 10, 1998 Ya know, after years of practice as a design professional (architect) I find that the best designed sometimes "just happen". What I mean is that you can't alway plan you designs or shots. Somestimes you just have to depend upon your experience, talents, and technical competence and let things just happen. <p> This past summer my wife and I spent many hours in Rocky Mountain National Park. We rose early, scoped out the areas we wanted to photograph and returned only to find that we would wait hours for the perfect shot, all to no avail. On those occassions that we were spontaneous and took advantage of opportunities and what nature handed out, we got some excellent images. <p> My experience indicates that the best stuff happens when you are prepared, and let it happen, don't force it. FWIW. <p> Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albins images Posted October 16, 1998 Share Posted October 16, 1998 Interesting thread! Often I find myself in a position where I need to do nature-photography the opportunistic way. Time usually does not allow for careful preparation and setups, it's this or no photography at all. Nevertheless I want to be prepared for the unexpected and haul everything from 24 to 300mm+, extension-rings, flashes, synch.cords and tripod. Within minutes of departure I will curse myself for my indecisiveness and the 'nature-experience' can be severely hampered by the load of equipment. (This leads to other frequented topics, like "Which three lenses?"). <p> Hardware-wise, I come prepared. What follows should be the actual photography, making the right decision at the right time. Being there, seeing it. The first step to do this though, requires the motivation to unpack my overloaded and crammed backpack. To unstrap that unwieldy tripod, change to the desired focal-length, move myself in position... Too much preparation on the hardware can become a serious limitation! If you 'plan' to do grab-shots, less is more: one body, one (even prime!)lens, a tripod with quick release, perhaps a flash. A combination like that can be quite liberating. I rarely do this, because I am afraid I will miss something. I have too little time to go 'outside' and want to use that time as optimal as I can. I realize that is naive. On some occasions however, I quickly forgot my pains and complaints when luck did indeed favour the prepared. Some satisfying portraits of foxes justify many aching shoulders in the future. <p> Obviously, there will be more 'keepers' whith opportunistic photography as opposed to staying home and not taking pictures at all. The argument is that experience has taught me what 'works' on a quick photograph and what subjects are better left photographically undocumented until more relaxed occasions. When I do have/take the time for preparation, I choose more 'difficult' subjects, like small mammals or insects > 1:1. This actually produces LESS keepers than the casual, walk-around photography! But the images that succeed are my personal milestones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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