Photographing Gymnastics

Need help with Lense selection. Looking for an affordable zoom lens

to take pictures of Gymnastic competitions were I will be unable to

use flash.

LOL!. You need a fast lens and fast film. Fast zooms don't come cheap. Start looking for a fast(2.8 or better) 180mm or 200mm prime. You may have to zoom a little with your feet.

<a href=http://www.wlcastleman.com/equip/reviews/85mm/index.htm>http://www.wlcastleman.com/equip/reviews/85mm/index.htm</a>

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William Castleman has shot a fair amount of gymnastics and uses some of the images in his reviews. You can get a good idea of what you might want by going through his work.<p>

From what I've seen, he sits on the side lines with either an 85mm or 135mm and shoots at f/2 or faster with ISO 800 film.<p>

How far will you be? How big you want the people be in the frame? What is your budget? Will you be using a tripod? Which body do you have? How sharp does the lens have to be (YGWYPF)? Have you searched?

 

 

 

Happy shooting,

Yakim.

Get the 135/f2

I have a Canon Rebel GII. I will be taking these photos for personal use and for our Competition Team. I have been looking at 70-300mm lenses. I just see many conflicting reviews.

100mm f/2 is a nice sharp lens that's reasonably affordable and small enough not to attract attention. If you can, shoot RAW as it will allow you to underexpose by a stop if required to get a fast enough shutter speed and you can compensate later when you conver the files.

 

Best of luck!

The 100/2 is a good choice since you have good floor access. I would also add a $80 50/1.8. A used third party (sigma, Tokina, Tamron) 70-200/f2.8 is also a good vaule (<$500) alternative. The 7x-300mm zoom may be too slow for most clubs and gyms.

if you have not done much of this, understand the reactions of people about lens speed is an important thing to pay attention to. gyms can be awful in lighting, and you cannot get a stop action shutter speed (about 1/250 or higher) without getting down to f.2 or lower. no zoom that you can afford can get you there. if you are willing to shoot at f.2.8 and high iso (800, sometimes 1600), the sigma 70-200 2.8 hsm is your answer, sells for about $700. look at keh.com for used and knock off maybe 150 dollars. the sigma is the zoom you seek with enough reach to get you around restrictions. if you don't need that much reach, i'd get a prime like people are recommending at the most optimal, long length for you -- depends on where you will be placing yourself in the gym, and also the 50/1.8, which is cheap enough to have as an alternative, and has often been a lifesaver for me taking basketball shots, but with a digital (gives it a longer reach).

If you're shooting with a GII then I'm guessing you are on a bit of a budget, in which case the $500-$1000 L glass people are recommending may not do you much good. You might want to try a used Pentax screw mount lens (check at keh.com). They are really cheap - a 135mm 2.5 will cost you under $100. You will have to get an adapter, but those run less than $20. You might also want to consider one of the little uber-zoom digital point and shoots, like the Canon S1 or one of Panasonics. They have image stabilization and really long (up to around 400mm) zooms. The Canon runs under $400.

<i>Looking for an affordable zoom lens to take pictures of Gymnastic competitions were I will be unable to use flash.</i><P>

Unfortunately, no such thing exists. The basic issue is that you need a very large aperature to get a sufficiently fast shutter speed to freeze the action, and to blur out distracting backgrounds. This usually means an aperature of equal to or less than f/2.8. This rules out almost all zoom lenses. The only options would be the Canon 70-200mm f/2.8 - $1060, or the Sigma 70-200mm f/2.8 - $800, and I'd bet these aren't in your budget range.<P>

Most professional gymnastics photographers are using a combination of the following prime lenses (if they're shooting Canon):<P>

Canon 85mm f/1.8 - $320<br>

Canon 100mm f/2.0 - $370<br>

Canon 135mm f/2.0 L - $850<br>

Canon 200mm f/1.8 L - $3500 - $4500 on the used market<p>

I'm guessing that only the first two lenses are anywhere near your budget. Of those two, I'd pick the 85mm as the best price/performance lens. Since it is a shorter focal length, you'll need to get closer to the action. One final option you might look at is the Canon 135mm f/2.8 Soft focus lens. It's reasonably sharp when the soft focus feature is turned off, though it has a slower auto focus motor. It's only around $270, so it would be the cheapest option of the bunch. <P>

Check out these other William Castleman lens reviews, and pay attention to the ISO, aperature, and shutter speeds he is getting at the events. He's shooting digital which is an advantage for high ISO. You might want to check out Fuji NPZ 800 film to get something with reasonably tolerable grain that is still fast. <P>

<a href="http://www.wlcastleman.com/equip/reviews/85_100_135/index.htm">85mm vs 100mm vs 135mm</a><br>

<a href="http://www.wlcastleman.com/equip/reviews/200mm/index.htm">200mm f/1.8</a><p>

Hope this helps!<P>

Sheldon

I have photographed gymnastics professionally. I could write ten paragraphs on what to do, but I will make a few suggestions.

 

The 200mm f1.8 lens has many drawbacks: it's extremely heavy for what is ultimately only a 200mm focal length. People who shoot gym often shoot many other sports as well, and the 200 is a little short for many such sports.

 

Furthermore, the 200/1.8 is quite possibly outside your budget and is now rare due to its price and its second-handly-only status.

 

"Floor access" is helpful, but it is not always the ultimate perspective, especially when half a dozen other photoraphers are there with you, getting remarkably similar angles. I also shoot from the seats. Sometimes you can look down onto the gymnast, which you can't get from the floor.

 

Use a tripod for the Uneven Bars. Don't worry about freezing the subject. Let it blur - try 1/10 of a second. Ideally, get part of the photo sharp and part blurred by movement. The tripod will definitely help here. The bars, and the gymnasts hands on the bars, will be sharp while the body will have a flowing quality. Shoot plenty of shots and then edit.

 

Blur isn't as effective for the horse or the beam. But it can work on the trampoline.

 

You are right about the 'no flash' rule - and note that coaches or gymnasts can get seriously miffed with intrusive photographers. Be quiet, unobtrusive and tactful.

 

Also get some detail shots. Good lenses for gymnastics are 135/2, 70-200/2.8, 300/2.8 and 400/2.8

 

Thre 400 is a little long (but will be helpful for other sports), while the 300 is the most useful of the lot, based on my way of shooting. Others seem to agree, judging by what they shoot with. (Note - I am talking a fill frame sensor here, or film shooters, I am not taking into consideration any lens magnification due to digital bodies.)

 

My first thought when I read your post was, and still is, hire some lenses. You may want to shoot with more than one focal length, and no lens can single-handedly do it all. If you're on a budget, this may be the best way to get great images with gear you can't otherwise afford or won't have regular call for. Use 3200 ISO film pushed a stop to 6400 ISO. Good luck - gymnastics is one of my fave subjects!

Shooting film, you will need:

 

Fuji 1600 ISO or Fuji 800 ISO film. If you use the latter, be prepared to overrule the rating on the canister and set ISO to 1600 and have the film processed accordingly (your local Walmart almost certainly doesn't handle push processing). Make sure you know how to do this, and locate a lab that will do push processing if needed. You may also need to locate a supplier for the film, which is not stocked everywhere. You might even experiment with Ilford Delta 3200 ISO black and white film - again you will need to locate a supplier and processing lab if you aren't equipped to do your own B&W darkroom work. It will be capable of giving you some really nice atmospheric shots. Don't imagine that you can begin to get by with regular 400 ISO film.

 

Even with fast film, you really will need f/2 or faster lenses, unless you are content only to photograph held poses where the contestant is still. There are no f/2 zoom lenses for EOS cameras (the only ones I know of have just been announced by Olympus for their 4/3 digital SLRs - but they wouldn't solve your problem, as their cameras struggle with very noisy high ISOs). You will therefore be restricted to one or two prime lenses. The longest more easily affordable one is the 100mm f/2 (the 135mm f/2 L is excellent, but much more expensive, and the 200mm f/1.8 is several grand). Given that you are shooting film, it might be marginally preferable over the 85mm f/1.8. A 50mm f/1.8 will allow some wider shots, and might be a useful addition if you don't already have it - it's inexpensive.

 

Some shooting tips:

 

If possible, shoot from a low position - cross legged on the floor beside the arena is ideal. Avoid having the gymnast being backlit, unless you are actively trying to create a silhouette. You won't get good shots from the back row of the stand. This will require careful negotiation with the organisers.

 

There are several things you will have to learn about the best handling of your Rebel G II.

Firstly, shutter lag is significant, so will need to practice shooting ahead of the action you're trying to capture. If you see it in the viewfinder, you shot too late.

 

Secondly, you will have to choose how you control focus. This is also tied in to what mode you use for shooting. Since you will be using wide apertures to get fast shutter speeds to freeze action, depth of field will be narrow, and focus will be quite critical.

(post continued)

 

It's not quite clear from the specs what focus modes the camera uses in which circumstances, but it is possible that the Sport mode offers continuous focus. The problem with the Sport mode is that it may overrule any ISO setting you make if you are pushing 800 speed film to 1600, and that you lose control over exposure. Ideally, you should meter exposure from a mid tone that is under the same lighting as the gymnasts and set that exposure in M mode, using a wide aperture/fast shutter speed combination. Since the lighting won't change, you should have correctly exposed images regardless of the colour of the strip worn by the competitor, or the darkness or light of the background. The downside of that may be that you have to accept a focus mode that doesn't follow the action. If that is the case, you may well need to use manual focus, setting focus where you know the action will be (e.g. on the beam, near a corner of the floor exercise mat etc.) and shooting when the subject is about to get to your chosen focus area (remember the shutter lag!). You will need to experiment to find what works for you best, so try to get to some practice sessions so that you too can practice - which will help you get better shots when it comes to live competition.

Kevin,

 

I just went through purchased a 20D to take gymnastics photos of my daughter team. I did a lot of lens research and bought the following: 50 1.4, 85 1.8, 135 2.0, and 70-200 2.8 IS. I have taken pictures at two local meets and some at gymnastics practice. If you want to stop the action then 1/500 shutter speed is marginal. I have not been in a gym yet that had enough light to obtain that fast of shutter speed with the 2.8 aperature. Maybe at the collegiate level but for kids gymnastics the lighting is very poor. The 50 1,4 works well at the practices or when I can get closer to the equipment. The 85 1.8 is the lens that I probably have ended up using the most. The 135 2.0 is my favorite lens but is sometimes a little slow for the available light. The 200 1.8 is on my wish list. As mentioned previously, William Castleman's site is an excellent source of information. Also search the message boards at www.sportsshooter.com. You can view some of my pictures at low res at http:sharpImages.dotPhoto.com I'm still learning but I have been satisfied with the results so far.

One other thought - if you intend to continue photographing gymnastics on film, rather than making the switch to digital (for which you should pick the 20D), you would benefit from getting an Elan 7. The benefits include whisper quiet operation that will be appreciated by gymnasts, and much improved focus capability in low light that prevails in gyms, as well as having the freedom to set the focus mode independently of the exposure mode. The camera also offers a much faster frame rate - there will be times when you find the 1 frame per second of the G II a little limiting. Second hand bodies in near mint, little used condition can often be found on *bay at prices that represent a useful saving over a new Elan 7N.

Thanks For all the Good Information